| Author | Message | ||
     Hybridmomentspass |
Can someone please inform me of the differences between a race header and a standard header of a FI tuber? What are the performance differences? How much is the going rate for one of these? | ||
| Sloppy |
Longer primary tubes into the collector. Performance difference - eliminates that dip in the torque curve. Result:  Doesn't increase peak power, instead makes the bike pull out of corners with much better responsiveness. If you're into drags, probably not worth it. If you're into canyon carving, huge difference. | ||
| Ratbuell |
To clarify the longer tube part - the race header has its collector pointed to the back of the bike; the header "turns the corner". The stock header exits across the front. When I switched my S1W from stock header / V&H muffler to a race header and muffler...WOW. Amazing power delivery, all over the rev band. As noted above - that dip was GONE. | ||
| Hootowl |
I remember reading that the dip was due to reversion in the stock muffler, which made it pass EPA. An aftermarket can fixes the dip. The longer primaries give more top end. Sound right? It was a long time ago. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Since I went from "aftermarket can" (Vance & Hines SS2R) to "aftermarket can" (Buell race muffler)...I'd hazard a guess it ain't just the muffler | ||
| Brinnutz |
Yeah no doubt. I went from a Wiley Co. to Race Header/ D&D Race Muffler...Made a difference in the butt dyno. | ||
| Brinnutz |
Oh, and the going rate for a Race Header is anywhere from $400-$550. The Race Muffler is basically in the same area. | ||
| Sloppy |
That torque dip has little to do with the muffler. It's completely to do with the primary length of the header - hence the race header tunes out that torque dip. There's plenty of information on exhaust resonance on the net to explain why it works. But how do I "know" it's not just the muffler? I tried stock, V&H, Supertrapp, but they all left that dip in the torque curve. Switched to the Buell race kit (headers and muffler) and it transformed the mid range into an awesome out of the corner jumper. And it was all confirmed on a dyno. The header showed up as a completely flat line across the mid range versus the "wave" with the stock header. If you're interested in improving the overall package of your bike, I would HIGHLY recommend K. Cameron's Sportbike Performance Handbook. A great "Course 101" - if it's not in your library, then you need to get it. | ||
| Rjn |
Not saying that all you guys are wrong, but i don't think it's just the header and exhaust that makes all the difference. As far as i know when you fit an other exhaust you'll probably also change the jetting in your carb and the air filter. Than for the proper setup run a dyno and than make the final adjustments to get it running smoothly So all of those combined makes the differences in the power curve and elimanate that power dip. | ||
| Buellistic |
IMHO, one needs to put a FUELL/AIR GAUGE on at the collector ... This allows you to TUNE in the REAL WORLD as you ride ... Then you do a DYNO RUN to check PERFORMANCE DIFFERENCES and not by the seat of your PANTS or by EAR !!! | ||
| Sloppy |
Well, that's the whole point of a fuel injected system so you're not at the sole whim of flow reversion and density changes... the Buell Race Package was a tuned setup:header, muffler, ecm. And it truely is "that" easy. Note that today with ECMspy and aftermarket headers with tuned primaries (like D&D) that you don't need to go with the Buell Race Package anymore. | ||
| Buellistic |
YES, fuel injection is the BEST THING that ever happened, "BUT" a FUEL/AIR GAUGE is a good REAL WORLD TEST for it to make sure the mapping is on the money ... | ||
| Impala |
Anyone have experience with the performance difference between the D&D full exhaust or the force vs. the Buell race header? | ||
| Kalali |
As Sloppy mentioned, the Race ECM maps were tuned perfectly for the Buell Race package (including a high flow air filter) but the complete package can cost more than $1000. The other option is to do "data logging" using ECMSPY and collect real-world/real-time fuel/timing data for your specific set up. Then you can go back and modify the maps to get it all dialed in. | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
Do Any of you have pictures of the race version VS the standard version? I dont know which I have. My motorcycle cam with race intake and V&H exhaust. | ||
| Brinnutz |
Here's a race header for a 99-02 M2  | ||
| Phelan |
On standard mufflers, the collector is right after the first 90* turn. On race headers, it's after the second, as in Wilson's picture. | ||
| Jayvee |
Now, keep in mind, in this picture, they're comparing a 2" stocker to the 2.5" Race Header; so here's the comparo photo from the UK Buelligan site:   (Message edited by jayvee on March 05, 2010) | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
thank you! | ||
| Sleez |
jayvee; only the 97 and earlier non-thunderstorm bikes were 2", all thunderstorms were 2.5" regardless of race pipe or not. | ||
| Hootowl |
Impala, The full D&D kit makes slightly more power than the Buell Race kit at high RPM, a little less at low RPM. Sporttwin.com posted some dynos a long time ago. They have a PDF available on their site that details the development. You have to be logged to see it. http://store.sporttwin.com/product_info.php?cPath= 41&products_id=157 There's the race kit. There is a link on that page to the PDF. | ||
| Sloppy |
Fascinating how a few inches of primary tube length can eliminate the torque dip in the mid range. And you thought science was only for geeks!  | ||
| Hootowl |
Huh. Size does matter.  | ||
| Kalali |
Every inch counts... |
