| Author | Message | ||
     Tx05xb12s |
Those of you riding cg's take heed: I purchased a LSL steering dampener recently. The installation instructions were easy to understand and included several diagrams. No problems were noted during the installation, and I was very pleased with my work and the fit and finish of the new equipment. A caveat mentioned in one of the diagrams was a recommendation to slip the fork tubes down until the tops were flush with the top of the triple tree. Fearing that this would change the bike's geometry and resultant performance, I failed to do so. I rode the bike on a couple of short trips and dialed in the dampener to my satisfaction. Everything was working great and I was well pleased with my new added measure of safety and performance. This past weekend my father was at the lake house about 30 miles away, so I decided to meet him out there. On the way back, I came to an intersection where the road I was turning onto had been repaved with about six inches of fresh blacktop. So, as I was turning onto the roadway, I had to hop the bike up onto the new pavement. Considering the fact that I had to lateral off of this same roadway on the way out at high speed and managed to accomplish the task without high-siding, I considered getting back onto the road traveling less than ten miles per hour a pretty doable task. Anyway, got up on the road no problem and went on my merry way, all thirty miles of it at highway speeds, momentarily reaching higher speeds I won't disclose in this public forum while passing a few cars along the way. Got back to town and rolled to a stop at the first traffic light. There was a little smoke wafting up from somewhere in front of me and I kept smelling this burnt plastic smell. I went ahead and rode the few blocks to my house because the bike seemed to be performing normally. When I got off I discovered that several inches of the front of my fender was completely gone! It took a few moments of staring at it in disbelief to fully realize what had happened. The steering dampener fork clamp had hooked the back of the fender, forcing the front into contact with the tire. As a result, my front tire was coated in melted plastic, and little droplets of burned plastic were speckled all over the front of my engine. So, as a remedy I turned the clamp 45 degrees counterclockwise and lowered the forks 1/2 the distance recommended in the instructions and added a click to my rear preload to balance things out. This should clear my new fender when it comes in. So, you guys riding the lowered cg bikes be aware that the recommendation to slip the fork tubes down is pretty much mandatory. On a positive note, Al of American Sportbikes took about 45 minutes out of his busy schedule to trouble shoot the problem with me and arrive at a good solution. Dave of Appleton H/D & Buell was kind enough to give me an excellent price on a new fender. Both of these gentlemen went out of their way to help me out even though the problem was clearly caused by my not heeding the warning in the instructions. Good bunch of people here. | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
The LSL damper will also touch the front fender of a normally suspended XB. This is especially true if the damper is incorrectly mounted, which is rather easy to do. The illustration on the American Sport Bike Site shows the proper installation. It is easy to install the mounting clamp on the isolator bolt so that the damper tube is in front of the mounting bolt, moving it closer to the front fender when compressed.  While Al's solution sounds like it will work, it does run against the entire idea of the lower model by raising the suspension, albeit a small amount, and changes the bike's geometry. Buells are particularly sensitive to this kind of thing, and changing the rear preload to compensate for a change in fork height, may have unintended consequences: making the rear suspension stiffer. I think I might have recommended either the Storz side mount in this case, or the Ohlins XBRR front mount model if the bike is an R model. I use a side mounted Ohlins, but I had to make the mounts.  PS. Several members have figured out how to mount the side mount dampers so the rod faces to the rear, instead of the front as on the rather ungainly installation recommended by Storz, who just couldn't figure it out. (Message edited by gentleman_jon on November 22, 2006) | ||
| Xbob |
storz = jousting pole. | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
Right you are, Bob. Storz seems to think that mounting their damper like a jousting pole adds a certain macho look to a motorbike. Lots of other people call the look "stupid". Here is a Storz mounted on Ol' Yaller in a somewhat less medieval manner. Several brothers have done the same. The info is hidden somewhere in the KV.  If memory serves, this was done by using the "long" Storz clamp on the damper, and fabricating a mount that allows the Storz clamp to be set horizontally, instead of vertically as in the case with the Storz rear mounting hardware. When asked about this installation, Storz said " I wonder why we didn't do it that way?" or words to that effect. | ||
| 07xb12scg |
I think it's pretty ridiculous that you're asked to change your suspension settings just to install a damper. They should just recommend not using this particular damper on the cg if they don't already. No offense to anybody, but those side dampers look ridiculous and gaudy. Isn't there a Scott's or similar damper available for Buells? | ||
| Pwnzor |
Gentleman Jon, doesn't that damper poke you in the leg? Just curious, looks like it might get in the way. | ||
| Swordsman |
Ha! I like the jousting pole! Needs an arrow head mounted on it for good measure!  ~SM | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
07xb - You put your finger on the problem! Because of the design of the Buell Air box cover/ Fuel intake, it does not appear that any stock damper will just bolt on. (One or two people have made mounts for the Scotts, but it was a tricky bit of business). Also, the limited number of Buell XB's in service make designing a mount unappealing to the usual manufacturers, or so it seems. I think I recall that Hyperpro now may have model for one or the other Buells. Not sure, (obviously:-). Pwnzr - Looks like it might poke me in the leg, but it never did. Never think about it, really. I sold that bike, but I have more or less the same installation on my new one, this time with an Ohlins damper. I do like being able to just reach down and change the amount of damping according to conditions, and/or temperature PS. Is there something the matter with gaudy?  | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
Yeah, I really didn't want to change the position of my forks, but look what that got me. I don't think ramping up the rear preload is a good solution either, but what can you do? If the rear preload at least compensates for what I'm going to do to the front forks, I can deal with a little rougher ride. As far as ride height is concerned, I kick myself for not getting the regular XB because I rode one recently and had no problems handling the bike at the higher ride height. Before I start jacking with my suspension, I will see if turning the clamp 45 degrees counterclockwise from the position shown in the above photograph will clear the new fender when it comes in. I may not have to move the forks after all. I just won't know until I get the fender and look at it. This was my original solution. It was Al's recommendation to just move the fork tubes down per the instructions. He says he did it to his CityX and didn't notice any negative influences on his turn-in. To tell you the truth, I wouldn't have bought this particular dampener if I had known about being required to change the bike's geometry to make it work. But now I'm out $350 and don't want to spend another $350 for a different dampener that looks like some sort of an engineering joke. So, like the rest of you, I'll just find a better way to mount it than the manufacturer recommended. That's part of the fun anyway. I'm just really glad I didn't have an accident on the way home. I was riding on an old cupped and wear marker showing tire that needs to be changed anyway, and put all that heat and molten plastic on it and rode like a bat out of hell. I think I'm down to 8 lives now. | ||
| 07xb12scg |
You're mad you didn't get the regular XBS just because this damper won't fit? It does sound like you got kind of lucky with not wrecking, though. That's one good thing in this sucky situation. | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
No, I'm not mad about the add-on equipment. I just wish I had gotten the regular height XB because I like them better than what I have due to the superior suspension setup. Actually, I wish I had gotten the XB12R instead of the XB12Scg. That's OK, now I know what to get next. I'm thankful for what I have now and will find a way to make it all work. If anything, I always like a challenge and want to make my bike unique anyway. My alternate mounting method will just add to the character of the bike, right? I'm a pretty positive minded person. | ||
| Metalstorm |
I've never considered buying a damper for my cg because of that 1" loss of clearance. When I put the bike on stands I have to remove the front fender just for the front stand to fit. So.. I knew from the start a dampener would be bad. On the other hand, I have my suspension set good enough to where I really don't need a damper since I seldom venture into the triple digits anymore. (at least not until I can afford track days) | ||
| Diablobrian |
superior suspension? are you talking about the travel? or the 43mm tubes on the newer models vs the 41mm on the 03-04 and scg? I think internally the valving is very similar if not identical. The differences are in the tube and spacer lengths. I'm about to swap my regular height suspension from my 03 firebolt for an scg suspension (+kickstands) the only real trouble I forsee is needing to smooth the transition from my driveway to the road out a bit, but I needed to do that anyway. The wife's firebird is dragging bottom there. If you have more inside info I'd be interested in hearing it. I always want to know more  | ||
| Diablobrian |
good point about the front stand metalstorm. I'll look at modifying mine when I get the suspension in. PM me in january or so and I should have it done and have details, or reasons why not | ||
| 99buellx1 |
You can feel a difference in the 41mm and 43mm forks. It really does ride better IMO. | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
superior suspension? are you talking about the travel? or the 43mm tubes on the newer models vs the 41mm on the 03-04 and scg? Both. Riding the R as opposed to my Scg was like night and day. Maybe part of that is the setup on my bike, but I really liked the fact that I could actually feel the suspension transferring weight from front to rear on the R and the ease in which the suspension accommodated rough pavement. By comparison mine is stunted, choppy, and rigid per factory recommended settings. I only perceive little if any weight transfer due to the short travel of my Scg. Admittedly I was happy with it before I rode the R and do consider my suspension to be adequate for high performance riding, but now that I have something to compare it to, I see what it is lacking. That's all I'm trying to say. It's pretty darn good, but I want the best I can get. That could have been had for the same money I spent.} So now I have something to put on my wish list. This was my first road bike. Live and learn... | ||
| Diablobrian |
A little work by LE or traxxion dynamics would probably take care of any problems you perceive and be considerably cheaper than a different bike. If all you want is the standard suspension post a request and someone will answer. There was another guy asking a little while back when I started trying to set up my swap. Just be sure that it is an 03-04 or you'll also have to swap lower triples along with the suspension bits and the kickstand. | ||
| Mortarmanmike120 |
This may sound stupid, especially since I haven't seen a damper installed. What about just trimming a little bit off the back of the fender? I mean how much is the overlap? Of course that doesn't help if the damper is then contacting the tire instead of the fender... just thinkin' outside the box a little. | ||
| Old_man |
Earlier someone posted the same problem with the front of his fender melted. I suggested that the fender may have been hooking onto the damper clamp when the forks compressed. This idea was dismissed. I may have been shown to be correct by your experience. | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
Michael: I have decided to leave my front forks exactly where they're supposed to be. With the fork clamp turned 45 degrees, I'm thinking it will clear the fender. If not, I will notch it. I'm just not willing to start degrading the performance of the bike just to bolt on something that I really didn't need anyway. I've never had any problems with headshake. I just did this as a safety measure just in case. We'll know if the updated clamp position will work when I get the new fender from Dave toward the end of next week. Jack: I was always taught to respect my elders because through their life experiences, they just might know what they're talking about. Guess the youngster you're talking about doesn't subscribe to that philosophy. | ||
| Old_man |
Tx05xb12s Even on my standard suspension XB9S, I lowered the forks in the clamps 3/8 in. when I installed the damper. To compensate for this I didn't raise the rear but rather changed the front spring preload from 4.5 lines to 5 lines. The bike handles great and is very balanced. | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
That's another viable option Jack. Thanks for sharing. Considering I already have the rear preload 1 click over recommended for better turn-in, I probably should look at your idea as a solution should I decide to slip the forks down. My fender should be in from Appleton any day now, so I'll know if just turning the clamp will be good enough or not. | ||
| Old_man |
The damper works really well, so I hope you're able to get it to work for you. Let us know. Good luck - keep safe. Jack | ||
| Cycleaddict |
well if the damper bracket hits the fender ,won't hitting the tire be the "next" event to occur ??? | ||
| Tx05xb12s |
I've thought about that too Cliff. When I get everything back together on the bike I'll measure the potential travel as opposed to the clearance between the clamp and the fender and/or tire. The clamp itself clears fine. It's the inside bolt flange that is causing the problem. The way the clamp is designed and instructions say to mount it, the bolt flange hangs right over the fender. LSL should have set the clamp up with the bolt flanges parallel to the tire instead of parallel with the bottom of the triple tree. I'll post some pics when I get the new fender in to show what I'm talking about. I'm pretty sure the clamp will work turned 45 degrees counterclockwise from what is recommended in the instructions. |
