| Author | Message | ||
     Mokuloa |
I bought an 02 P3 (my first bike) and it has always ground into first from neutral. They seller had the dealer rebuild the engine because he ran it out of oil. The bike has 5000 miles on it. I adjusted the clutch at the bearing and the lever, and replaced the lubricant with Harley Formula+. That's when I noticed that the spacer had never been removed from the primary adjusting bolt. I adjusted the primary with the 24-inch-pound spec and turned eight flats back. I haven't yet got the nerve to do the adjustment while idling. The bolt is now farther into the case, and the spacer would no longer fit. Now the transmission goes into first from neutral with a satisfying "chunk" instead of a grind. Overall shifting performance is much better - a firm foot is required but no more chattering is heard. I do have several questions that I think the more experienced members can answer: 1) My idle has dropped a bit. I have read that this is a sign of the primary being too tight. If too tight, will I receive no warning before a catastrophic failure happens? 2) Twice, the transmission has "stuck" in first gear from neutral. Letting the clutch out slightly releases the transmission with a "clunk". This happens very rarely. Is this an immediate problem? 3) The bike is hard to push in gear when cold (clutch in). When warm I can sense some drag but it is much better. Is this just because the lubricant is thicker? Overall I am very happy with the transmission performance. I am just wondering if, given the apparent history of the bike, I should take the primary cover off for a look. Thanks for any advice you can offer and thanks for a great website - I have learned a lot already! (Message edited by mokuloa on October 20, 2008) | ||
| Ezblast |
Turn it out 8 more flats and enjoy! Mobil 1 15/50 for the rest. EZ (Message edited by ezblast on October 20, 2008) | ||
| Reuel |
#1: Ed got ya. #2: Quite common. Switching to Mobil 1 synthetic 20W50 made mine do it less. I'm going to try something lighter next time. #3: Yes. I'll report on #2 to see if it makes a difference for #3. | ||
| Mokuloa |
Thanks guys - it shifts great! EZ - I went out 8 more - grind. Back four - chunk. I love it. Reuel - I will also try Mobil 1 15/50 when I feel like taking that left foot peg bracket off again! | ||
| Thump |
Thought I could just post this here since I have some of the same symptoms, but maybe a different cause. #2 has happened to me more than a few times. Not too bad except when the light is really long. Sometimes if I engage the clutch for a few inches it will 'unlock'. #3 happens almost every time I start the bike cold. Even when I warm it up, usually until I hear the choke kick off, it will be difficult to get into first. For me I can hear the gear grinding, much like when you try to down shift at too high of RPM's. Then I literally have to slam it pretty hard. I wince sometimes b/c it seems like a tooth will break. I have a small weep coming from the primary. I was curious if these ailments could stem from there not being enough lube in there. The temp has dropped a bit in the last few weeks as well, and I know that doesn't help any either. | ||
| Mokuloa |
Thump - #2 sounds like the same situation. Releasing the clutch a bit frees up the transmission for me. It usually "clunks" very solidly when it does this. #3 was explained to me as not enough oil on the plates. Sparky said to hold the clutch in for a while at idle before trying to shift. I think the 15/50 would help in both situations, especially on cold mornings. The symptoms of your P3 sound very similar to mine. I'd do the full-on clutch adjust and then adjust the primary. It sure worked for me. You can check/change the lubricant while you're in there. | ||
| Swampy |
Adjust the primary first then the clutch. A good synthetic of your choice will help the shifting, but when things get cold it takes a while to get things to shift right. Even the Sporty makes niose when its cold. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
" The bike is hard to push in gear when cold (clutch in)."Normal. With the engine off, its almost always going to be that way, especially in first gear and its been that way forever. Proper adjustments can help, but you can spend a lot of time trying to solve a problem that doesnt really need to be addressed. As in how often do you need to push your Blast around, cold, in gear? | ||
| Mokuloa |
"As in how often do you need to push your Blast around, cold, in gear?" Never - the problem was grinding. I just wanted to know if it was a problem. Thanks for the information! | ||
| Jdreadrocker |
Well i have the same problem with the clutch grinding when i go to put it into first gear, and i am still quite new to the buell bikes, so i don't really know where everything is yet. How exactly do i adjust this? I have tried adjusting the cable length, it worked for a bit but then it just seamed to fall right back into the same problem. What do i need to do to adjust this problem and where do i need to look for what i need to adjust? Thanks! | ||
| Swampy |
In cold weather the transmission needs to warm up a bit first before putting the transmission into gear otherwise grinding will result. This is also true with my Sportster, it is just the way things happen. Now if it grinds all the time there are a few things you can do to help remedy the problem. Grinding occurs usually due to the clutch dragging. So to prevent the clutch from dragging there are a few things you can do. Change the primary fluid. Adjust the primary chain(Looser than what is recommended in the manual because if you get it too tight you can pull the clutch basket out of line on the bearing and that will cause the clutch plates to not be parralell and that will cause dragging) Make the internal clutch adjustment. Make the external(cable adjustment) Do that in the above order and you should be good to go. Also, another thing to try is patience, pull the clutch in, count to 5, then put it in gear. | ||
| Jdreadrocker |
how exactly do you change the primary fluid? I mean where do you drain the fluid and where do you fill it? thanks | ||
| Swampy |
There is a transmission/primary drain plug towards the rear of transmission area under the engine on the left side. To fill it according to the manual you need to remove the left foot peg frame and remove the clutch adjustment cover and fill there. I usually fill it through the transmission vent tube because I am lazy. | ||
| Billyo |
EZ-do you use mobil 1 for v-twins or the regular mobil 1? The v-twin juice is just about impossible to find around here. I switched to it on all three bikes and cannot find it now at auto parts stores, bike shops, Wallyworld, etc. | ||
| Ezblast |
I and many others use the regular Mobil 1 15/50 - If you can find it - the 20/50 motorcycle oil - use it, but it is real difficult to find generally. EZ (Message edited by ezblast on October 27, 2008) | ||
| Bebegirl |
This seems like a good place for my concern. Has anyone else had a problem with the bike dropping out of first gear briefly but enough to cause the bike to lurch? I ride my 03 Blast to work as often as I can. Last February I didn't have a choice... no car, had to ride every day, 25 miles round trip. By the end of the month the bike had developed a hiccup in first gear, after the clutch was released all the way, accelerating into intersection, it would drop out of gear, lurch, then go back into gear. Really annoying because it made me look like a newbie who didn't have proper control of the clutch, sometimes a little unsettling in a turn when that loss of power would kick in. Husband rode it too, agreed there was a problem, bordering on unsafe. My dealer, who is awesome, rode the bike but couldn't feel the problem area. Several times they took the bike in, rode it, looked it over, couldn't find anything wrong, and thought I was having an issue with the grabby clutch, or the unsmooth shift into first you've been mentioning. They were really nice and didn't charge me. They advised me not to go to the expense of breaking the engine down. The problem continued and seemed to be getting worse. So last week, luvmybike, I took it in committed to get it fixed. After MUCH persuading from me and husband, they did break it down and found bent parts in first gear and have ordered the replacements. My reasoning... 69 miles per gallon, easy ride in predawn rush hour traffic, can't get a new one easily. I appreciate my dealer trying to protect me from an expensive repair on an inexpensive bike, but I was surprised that they couldn't perceive the problem themselves when they rode it.} | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Bebegirl: Thanks for posting. There has been some discrepancy whether your problem is caused by bad trans parts or clutch adjustment. I believe either could have been cause of it. Glad you're getting it fixed. Since this is a somewhat common problem, I'd really love it if you could post the part numbers of the bent parts. This could really be helpful to Blasters in the future who may have to do this repair (or at least diagnose the problem). I'd also ask for the old parts back too. That could also be helpful. Thanks?! | ||
| Krjoseph |
Mobile 1 15/50 is easy to find, and Wal-mart has a 5 qt jug for about $26. Great deal. | ||
| Reuel |
Bent parts? I'll have to check that when I finally open mine up some day. Mine does that on cold mornings. It gets better or nonexistent after an oil change, and starts after a couple months of riding. | ||
| Bebegirl |
I pick up my bike tomorrow. I'll ask for the old parts and part numbers. Gearheaderiko, your diagnosis was exactly the same as husband's. He also thinks fast idle during warm up could be a factor. Well, I'll let you know and thanks for the response. | ||
| Bebegirl |
I made a scan of the parts list and will be glad to email it... it doesn't seem to be uploading properly. I have the old parts in a box. I don't know the technical terms for what happened, but it was easy to see where parts had worn down and would not take hold as they were supposed to. That's why it was slipping out of first gear. The bike ran really well on the way home. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
 Glad you live in a warm state so you wont have to wait out the winter to enjoy it. I've sent you a PM with my e-mail address that you can send the parts list too. .Thank You! | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
The shift into first at fast idle, with that awful noise, sure couldnt have helped things  We'd also be interested if it shifts better now too? | ||
| Bebegirl |
Shifting way better now. Fast idle not racing like before, not grinding. A real pleasure to ride again. I wonder if there is anything I can change to offset the impact of riding in stop and go rush hour traffic. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Here's a condensed list of parts Bebgirl sent me (thanks). I didnt go through the manual and sort out whats what, what caused the problem and whats just incidental in parts replacement. This should at least give an idea of what may need to be changed. (a lot of old XL parts on the list -89 is the year) 11019 Retaining ring 11067 Retaining ring 11161 Retaining ring 34142-89c shifter fork (1st & 2nd gear) 34144-89c shifter fork (3rd & 5th gear) 41147-89c shifter fork (4th gear) 35021-89 snap ring 35030-89A bearing mainshaft 35038-89A retaining ring 35762-89A gear, mainshaft, 1st 35773-94 gear, mainshaft, 4th 37909-90 circlip 8996A ball bearing 8998 ball bearing 9187 bearing | ||
| Reuel |
So, is the slipping in 1st gear because those parts were bad, or did the parts go bad because of the stresses caused by the slipping? | ||
| Swampy |
Usually what happens is too much pressure is used to put the transmission into gear and it bends a shift fork, the shift fork being bent prevents the ears on the slider from fully engaging into the gear. When you get a little bit of rounding on the ear and a little twist of the wrist, Bingo bango the slider pops out of the gear! So how do you prevent requiring too much pressure to get the trans in gear? Make sure you adjustments are correct, don't start forcing on the shifter when while trying to shift gears. | ||
| Fast1075 |
My experience with bikes regardless of brand is that bent shift forks are the cause of progressive gear dog failure..it's a cascade failure where one problem causes another. Usually, bent forks are the result of a crash in which the shifter gets whacked, or hamfisted shifter technique..in the case of the blast trans...I heartily recommend that "clutchless" shifting not be attempted...there is too much flywheel and rotating mass in the engine...toss in the CV carb and the engine rpm takes too long to drop...this does not allow the dogs to disengage cleanly...my bike had a bad problem with shifting (crunchy/grinding/missed shifts) that turned out to be due to the stock clutch failing to cleanly disengage regardless of adjustment or lube type...I replaced it with a new "Energy One" package and Mobil 1 V-twin oil...the problem vanished...now the shifting by and large is "japaneseish"..not quite "silky" but far, far better than stock... | ||
| Bebegirl |
Thanks for your thoughts... and fyi, the bike has never been crashed or dropped. | ||
| Barrysnow |
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show .cgi?tpc=20164&post=1292680#POST1292680 where is the Trans vent tube located | ||
| Swampy |
Welcome to the Thumper Forum. The trans vent tube is black about 1/2 inch diameter and it comes from the transmission area by the starter and runs up along the frame behind the air box and then snakes its way up into the left side seat frame. It is an open ended tube and if you spray water in the frame rail to wash out the frame area you will be putting water into the transmission. If you look into the left side seat frame area into the cutout area just to the left of the shock absorber you can see it laying on the bottom of the frame rail. You can touch it if you like....LOL You can un thread it out of the seat frame area and look at it....but when you put it back I like to zip tie it to the top of the frame rail to keep any water from getting into it by keeping any water from running down the frame rail and into the hose. | ||
| Truthnexile |
"You can touch it if you like..." Hahaha, funny guy. Thanks for the tip on that, Swampy. That could certainly be a potential source of water getting into my trans fluid. |
