| Author | Message | ||
     Ducxl |
Buell sources parts to the best supplier, period. It's a shame that we American manufacturers can't compete with third world countries.Just sad.I make high quality stuff,but my health care/benefits package puts me at a disadvantage | ||
| M1combat |
"(Water cooled seems an obvious answer." Not so much ;)... One of the important parts of the test is output for the first couple minutes of the test... The XB do exceedingly well at that portion due to the fact that they heat up a good deal quicker than a liquid cooled bike. If we don't see water cooling for performance sake, I think we'll see a cat on an XB before water cooling for emissions sake. | ||
| Reepicheep |
The Torco clamps I just put on my exhaust that came straight out of the Buell wrapper were from Illinois. | ||
| 07xb12scg |
Buell sources parts to the best supplier, period. Do you honestly believe that? I surely don't. The reason the wheels, for example, are made in China is because they can do it cheaper than any US company can. We can make wheels that are the same quality if not better, but they'd be a lot more expensive. | ||
| Blake |
You are obviously confused as to what is meant by "best supplier." Price is a factor. "It's a shame that we American manufacturers can't compete with third world countries.Just sad.I make high quality stuff,but my health care/benefits package puts me at a disadvantage" What third world country do you imagine is beating you out for Buell contracts? China is not a third world country. Neither is Japan. Neither is Italy. You should tell your employer to switch to a catastrophic health care protection scheme. I pay just $120/mo for my health insurance. If that is preventing your employer from winning a contract against a Chinese of Japanese, or Italian competitor, then you need to look at other factors, perhaps labor cost is part of that, perhaps other factors. | ||
| Tommy_black_shark |
I picked up a brochure at March Badness and it says that the current bikes meet 2010 emissions. As far as hydrocarbons and CO coming out the tailpipe these bikes (as well as everybody elses) are about as clean as mouse farts. My understanding is that some companies are going to need new designs to reduce engine/tranny/intake noise. Buell is pretty good is that area too from what I read. I'm excited to see if there is any reality to the rumors of a Buell superbike for the street. Even if it materializes I probably am not a prospect for one. All the bamboo brands make one and while nice, they don't do anything for me. They're a lot faster than my Uly on US129, about the same on GA180, and way slower on FS42 (forest service).  | ||
| 07xb12scg |
You are obviously confused as to what is meant by "best supplier." Price is a factor. The rest of his post points towards quality and China is not known for its quality control. (Message edited by 07XB12Scg on June 24, 2007) | ||
| Jackelfox |
similar quality parts, with one being significantly cheaper certainly means a better part to me. | ||
| Anonymous |
Buell sources parts to the best supplier, period. Do you honestly believe that? Yes. The best supplier makes high quality at a competitive price. The trick isn't to supply aerospace quality parts for motorcycles that cost $75K like a Desmosedichi or $100K like a Motocysz; it's to find a way to do that same aerospace quality for bikes that cost $8-12K. | ||
| L_je |
I'm normally quick to agree with anyone posting as "Anonymous", but in this case... Trust me, you do not want "Aerospace Quality" parts. The resulting bike would weigh about 40,000lbs. I have a hard enough time picking my bike up off of the ground as it is; I don't need an additional 39,500 pounds. But, with an "Aerospace Quality" Buell you could: -launch it off of a catapult -try to take corners at 9g's -contaminate the bike with VX nerve agent on a whim -decontaminate your newly contaminated bike -need a really big fan just to cool your triplex ECM suite -easily avoid radar speed traps -happily cruise at ~1.5 Mach, because people who think they need to reach Mach 2.5+ "just don't get it" A Buell burdened down with aerospace quality parts may no longer Own the Corners, but instead, Own the Run-Out...good thing you've got that ACES II ejection seat! I love my Buell. I would change very little about it. I'd like to own more Buells. -jason | ||
| Cityxslicker |
WElcome to the 700 club, let the plagerism police come get me. less than two weeks left of speculation | ||
| Court |
Buell purchasing, like may components of the company, is quite an extraordinary process. Shame to see those folks neat work so misrepresented.. A good deal of the above information is patently inaccurate. Bother anyone that Harley-Davidson has been equipping their bikes with wheels from Australia for years? Talk about a 3rd world country!!  Have fun. By the way, Buell wheels come from the same city that most the generators I've installed in the last 2 power plants came from . . . there's a cool $1,800,000,000 sent from the US to China. Many of the materials I buy from generators to steel A490 bolts, come from China. Interesting to note that one of the largest factories in that city in China is adorned with a huge, and quite familiar looking, bar & shield. I think there's much more to be learned. You'll be glad to know that U.S. steel products are making a comeback. | ||
| L_je |
I'll start off by stating that I know of no quality issues with the XB wheels that are made in China. That being said, I would feel much better about the Buell products if the wheels were manufactured elsewhere. Not because of quality issues, but for the fact that I simply despise China. Why? 1) China thinks R&D stands for Rip-off and Duplicate. There is no such thing as "intellectual property" or "patent protection" in China. I'm sorry, but simply put, they steal everything. 1a) When you outsource your beloved manufacturing processes to China, those proprietary processes are disseminated more quickly than the latest motorcycle crash videos on YouTube. 1b)In the United States, we send people to jail for violating intellectual property rights, and for good reason too. In the US, corporations go out of their way to play by the rules, even so far as to place ourselves at disadvantages when competing in a global economy. And, I'm glad that we do play by the rules because it's the right thing to do, as respect for property rights is paramount in this country. In China, everything is "communal" property, duh, it's a communist society, so what else would you expect? 2) The Chinese are not honest. Honesty goes a long way with me. The Soviets were honest to a large degree; "We will bury you!"...hey, there isn't much ambiguity in that statement, now is there? At least we (the US and USSR) were all perfectly honest about pointing thousands of megatons of nuclear weaponry at each other. 2a) "Free Tibet"...I hate those stupid bumperstickers...the only way you are going to "free Tibet" is through a war on par with WWII. Maybe the folks that sport these bumperstickers really mean "Free Tibet. Attack China"...but I don't think so. 2b) The buzz in China is that they are going to "liberate" Taiwan in September of 2008, after the Olympics clear out of town. Sorry, but by my accounting, the people of Taiwan are already free, as this is where the legitimate government of China fled in the chaos of the Communist Revolution that killed millions in the mainland, and confiscated all of the private property. 3) The Korean War. The Vietnam War. Iran. 3a) In Korea, Chinese soldiers killed tens of thousands of of UN (US) soldiers, and forced a stalemate that has evolved into a nuclear standoff, and currently holds the entire population of Seoul on the brink of absolute destruction from conventional artillery fire. 3b) Would Vietnam have been overrun by communists if it weren't for China? 3c) Iran. The Chinese have serious oil interests in Iran. They will do everything possible to prop up the current regime in Iran just to maintain their comfortable status quo. Forget the fact that this regime's goal is to develop nuclear weapons to smuggle into the west and bring about nuclear armaggedon. Ahmedinejad wants to create as much chaos as humanly possible, though which to bring the return of the 12th Imam, ie the appocalypse, and China seems to be cool with this. 4) Currency manipulation. China artificially drives their currency up and down, in sync, with the US Dollar to maintain a favorable trade surplus with their biggest consumer. Should any other country do this, the WTO would scream bloody murder, but otherwise, very little fuss is made with respect to China's currency manipulation. 4a) China owns a crippling amount of US dept through US treasury bonds. How the US allowed this, I'll never know. Their substantial ownership of US bonds essentially ties the hands of the US should the US ever be called upon to militarily defend Taiwan, or otherwise intervene in any of the other Chinese territorial disputes. So, yes, I really don't like China. It's probably that I really hate Communists more than just the Chinese as individuals, but I think my general opinion of China is beyond rehabilitation. So, Erik, for Pete's sake, could you please get the XB wheels manufactured somewhere else? Counterfeit goods are so rampant in China, that there is probably a street vendor in Bejing that is selling XB wheels as $5 "necklace bling" to the up-and-coming Chinese hip-hop generation. ...Though, maybe this is a good thing, because these kids will then have such sever back problems that they can no longer work in the factories, thus forcing the XB wheel production to some other source? | ||
| Jaimec |
"Aircraft quality parts" obviously doesn't apply to the cheap sh*t metal used in Buell mufflers... Is it because (like Harley Davidson) Buell just assumes their buyers will pitch the stock muffler for something louder in the aftermarket?? | ||
| Swordsman |
Wow. This is one loooooooooooooooooooong thread! ~SM | ||
| Court |
Just plum chucked full of valuable info too. . . . right? I love it . . HD makes stuff cheap cause they know folks are going to throw it away. There's a sure strategy to become one of America's most successful manufactures! Hey . . you can't say Buell didn't give you plenty of hints this year. | ||
| Jaimec |
Never said Harley used cheap stuff. Can't remember the last time I saw a rusting exhaust on a Harley, either. Then again, I can't remember the last time I've seen a STOCK exhaust on a Harley, now that I think of it (other than on the showroom floor, of course). (Message edited by jaimec on June 25, 2007) | ||
| Trojan |
Can't remember the last time I saw a rusting exhaust on a Harley Not surprising, as most Harley owners are terminally allergic to water. | ||
| Tommy_black_shark |
It would seem obvious that the supplier, whether in China, or China Grove, NC will supply exactly what the buyer specifies. No more, no less. If the component is substandard, it will be rejected. If it exceeds specifications it is also likely to cause some issues. When I was in manufacturing if an outside component had an un-specified variance (unless the specs said "equal to or better than") it needed to be re-certified by engineering before it could be used. Also, if a supplier could consistently provide components that exceeded spec, procurement inevitably felt that they had left money on the table and would want to see about a "new" price for just what we ordered. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Not to take a practical tangent on this thread, but after 20k miles of riding (including winter and plenty of rain) I finally pulled my stock can and hit it with the angle grinder and wire brush and repainted it. I noticed the places where the rust was the worst were the places where I let my oil drain over the exhaust when I change it. So I wonder if some of the damage is self induced. I also noted that for a new Drummer, you have to exchange a stock can... or pay $250. As Kevin has no shortage of fabrication expertise and resources (he is building these things from scratch with Stainless) I am assuming that this means that the stock part is already a fairly expensive assembly. So it's not like that stock exhaust is a some piece of junk... It's already a better and more sophisticated part then most other manufacturers use. I know I couldn't jack a VStrom up by its exhaust cans, and if I had to slide any bike bottom first into a telephone pole or a rock then pay for the repairs, an XB would by my first choice. It could use a better finish though, as could many of the fasteners on the bike. | ||
| Jaimec |
Okay, the secret is out! Here are photos of the new, 25th Anniversary Buell! Put your deposit checks in now: http://tinyurl.com/yvwcux | ||
| Paintballtommy |
honestly though whens the release date? | ||
| Bads1 |
Key word about the wheel's is who can cast them (wheel's). Some diecast company's may have huge problems doing these rim's. The front would be a bitch. The dwell time in the die has got to be atleast 45sec per wheel. The spokes are so thin that purosity would be a big problem and thats something in a wheel you don't want. See some company's may look at that wheel a bigger pain in the butt then what its worth to cast. I know that the primary covers are done right in Grafton wisconsin. Same company could do the wheel's but maybe they can't compete with China on that particular part. I used to die cast,did it for 6 years. I used to cast borg warner transmissions. When the die changed for a new model we couldn't be consistent enough with the new die.Borg Warner pulled the die and sourced it to another company that had better luck with it then we did and got the contract. It not just the money all the time its also who can do it and give consistent parts and yes if they can't be consistent the parts get more expensive to make. China just may be able to do what can't be done here and hold a feasable price. | ||
| Blake |
Aerospace quality is heavy?  Kinda tough to get heavy to fly, let alone launched into orbit, to the moon, Mars, or beyond. Maybe you are thinking Mil Spec. | ||
| M1combat |
I thought the wheels were powder coated in China, but made in Japan... By enkei no less... I could be wrong... they may have changed, but I seem to remember seeing a graphic stating where various parts were made and by who and that was the story on the wheels... | ||
| Kuuud |
Nope, it's definately China. Look at the ULY wheels for the big raised CHINA lettering. Why is that necessary? It does say that on the other models (or it didn't used to)... and I don't see big 'ITALY' on the frame or AUSTRALIA stamped on HD wheels! HD full floater rotors used to have JAPAN stamped in them, but they had the sense a few years ago to at least switch to 'Made in Japan' stickers. | ||
| Ducxl |
Here's a revolutionary wheel manufacturer using thixotropic injection molding for some very cost efficient wheels.AND they're made in Michigan USA!! http://www.durraniracing.com/index.html | ||
| 07xb12scg |
Wow those are some killer wheels! But the Chinese will make copies of them for much cheaper! | ||
| Blake |
Thousand bucks a piece is cost efficient? | ||
| Anonymous |
Buell has been using a thixotropic molded magnesium part since 2003 -- the front fairing bracket on the XB9/12R. There are other processes that might be first choice for a extremely high-performance wheel. |
