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Dynasport
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 08:53 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I haven't been on this board for a long time. After Buell was shut down the first time Buell threads began drying up and political threads seemed to dominate. Then after EBR closed it got even worse. But I am giving it another shot. I have a couple of questions about the SX I am hoping someone can answer. I mentioned Froggy specifically, because he seems to have inside information on things at times.

Anyway, first, any idea when the promised SX accessories such as bags and windscreen will be available? And any idea how effective that tiny little screen will be?

Second, I have seen Froggy mention he doesn't ride his SX long distances because of chain maintenance and bike servicing. Is the chain that difficult to maintain? And what is the service interval for the bike and is it difficult and/or expensive?

I am thinking about an SX, but I want it to be as comfortable as my Uly XT on trips and I am skeptical that it will be. I also don't want to spend an arm and a leg every time I turn around on maintenance.

Oh, one more question, that I hesitate to ask. But do you guys think buying and EBR is a big risk considering the track record of EBR having a hard time staying in business.

Thanks
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Ebrfan
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 10:49 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The bike can be comfortable, its all dependent upon how you like to sit really. There are different aftermarket bars available to change body position. And there are several aftermarket tank and tail bags and windscreens available that can be retrofitted to the bike with a little ingenuity. I am working on a few of these for my bike and will post it when I'm done.

Chain maintenance also depends on your riding habits as well. If you flog the throttle, launch and decelerate hard a lot it will stretch and you will be sliding the axle back on a regular basis. It is a five minute maintenance job, that I include with waxing the chain (again, if you ride hard).

There is no bigger risk of buying an EBR than buying a Buell, or any other bike that is no longer made. The only reason EBR had fell on hard times is the bike's sales volume fell behind company growth, that and financial backing became non-existant when Hero split. OEM accessories for the SX may not come to the market as fast as people would like beause the company is relatively small currently. But with more and more bike sales comes the demand for these products, and then the new EBR can justifiably afford to make these pieces parts.

(Message edited by Ebrfan on May 30, 2016)
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Hughlysses
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 11:32 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I've had one ~10 mile test ride on an 1190SX (luckily on a very twisty road) and I found it surprisingly comfortable. I think I'd want slightly lower footpegs, and I'd have to put in some decent seat time to make a call on the handlebars.

About the chain- judging from posts I've seen about the bike at ebrforum.com and on Facebook, keeping the chain adjusted properly is pretty critical.

The chain goes through the swingarm, and there's a plastic "sacrificial" guard to protect the swingarm here. At least a couple of people have had the chain wear through the guard and into the swingarm in just a couple of hundred miles of riding. Maybe they didn't have the chain adjusted properly at the start of their ride, and just a little additional stretch is all it took to cause the problem. I'd guess you should maintain less slack with 1190's compared to most chain drive bikes since they have an idler roller similar to the belt drive Buells.

Just something to be aware of.
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Zac4mac
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 12:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

as far as the chain goes, I'll chime in too.

I have a 2012 1190RS, my first chain drive in a decade...
It has a DID race chain, 530 ERV-3 IIRC, replacement was near $200 and with almost 1000 miles and very hard acceleration for most of it only needed adjusting once, at around 100 miles.

Had to get a new chain to add a few links and move the rear wheel back for more muffler clearance. No masterlink chain....

Z
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Milar
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 02:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'm in the same boat as Dyna. I've owned 5 Buells. I'll be buying a new bike this year and the SX is on my radar. But not sure it can be made into a capable sport touring bike.

Mike
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Dynasport
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 03:46 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I did get a chance to demo ride an SX in Daytona the year they came out. It was a fun ride, but didn't really tell me how I'd feel on a long ride. I know I'd want some wind protection. I have seen the tiny screen I understand will be available at some point from Buell, but it is so small I'm not sure it will do much. I even had issues with my XT screen (bad buffeting) before I added brackets to it that let me adjust it. All good since then. Screen are often a problem, I understand that. But some do work pretty well.

I'm not the handiest guy around when it comes to 'making' things work. I'd like something made for the bike when it comes to a windscreen. Of course, the nice thing about sites like this is that I can learn from the ingenuity of others.

I'd like to buy American. I'd like a sport tourer. That means Motus. I'm riding one next weekend. I hope I hate it, because I don't see how I can afford it. If I love it, I may be selling a kidney, in case anyone is interested.

Otherwise, a BMW or Yamaha may be in my future, as much as I'd like to stay American. Or, I may just stay out of the market and keep riding my Uly XT and keep hoping I can get parts when I need them.
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Theshinenz
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 04:33 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I say stick with the Uly, the SX is a superfighter, you'd be trying to make it into something its not. Plus it would look as ugly as hell with a screen on it and bags LOL.
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Dynasport
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 04:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

No uglier than my Uly.... Besides, EBR apparently agrees as they are coming out with a tiny screen and bags for it, or so I'm told. People tour on Busas and ZX-14s.

But don't misunderstand me. I won't be selling the Uly. I love that bike and plan to have it forever. But I am thinking of getting a new bike sometime in the next year or so. And while I can take the Uly and on any trips, I'd like to be able to take trips on whatever I buy as well.
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Dannybuell
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 07:09 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

toned? or office worker? can you run up two stairs at a time? do you have strong knees? is your body English all over the bike?

Cruiser? The Uly is the Cruiser, right? do you want more top end speed? I would add a gear to the Uly. i have a 96s1 and an 09cr. If I had to commute? the S1. the 11,000 rpm Rotax motor is not made to be a steady rpm plow horse cruiser.

you can make a silk purse out of a sows ear, people do it all the time. a longer wheelbase would be helpful for cruising long distances, right?
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Dynasport
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2016 - 11:02 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Ok got it, seems like most believe the SX should not be my next bike. Not for what I want it for at least. I'm sure you guys are right. Sometimes emotions lead to bad decisions. I want to believe the SX is the bike, but I kind of agree that it isn't.
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Crusty
Posted on Tuesday, May 31, 2016 - 09:25 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Dynasport; before you make a decision, take one out for a Demo ride. The bike that everybody says is wrong might just be the perfect fit for you.

I'm traveling all over the country on a Sportster, and you wouldn't believe how many people tell me it's a bad choice. I've gotten negative comments from BMW owners (naturally), Yamaha and Kawasaki Sport Tourers, Even a Ducati owner was astounded that I would dare to ride a Sportster long distances. (and he was several hundred miles from home!)
I even get a lot of flack from Harley owners. The majority of them think I should be riding a Garbage Wagon.

They are all full of it. My bike is a great choice for what I want and what I'm doing. I was considering an SX before I set out on this trip, but there were reasons the Sportster was a better choice. However, I might just get an SX for my next bike. When I took one out for a Demo ride, it spoke to me in the right way.

Don't buy a bike because of others opinions; take one out for a ride and make your own decisions. Sometimes the bike that's wrong for the job is a perfect fit for the owner.
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Hughlysses
Posted on Tuesday, May 31, 2016 - 10:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Yea, I would not rule the SX out by any means until you've given it a decent shot.

Dannybuell notes the "Rotax engine is not made to be a steady RPM plow horse cruiser". I owned a 2009 1125CR for a year, and I'd agree. OTOH I was surprised at how much more tractable the ET-V2 seemed at low speed compared to the Rotax. EBR has made significant changes compared to the Rotax. I think it'd be perfectly happy being ridden gently. And one good thing about chain drive is changing the final drive ratio would be a snap.

The other thing that I noticed compared to the 1125CR is the ride seemed much more "plush". Those Big Piston Forks apparently work as advertised.

I think the engine and chassis have great potential for touring.
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Ffbuell1
Posted on Tuesday, May 31, 2016 - 11:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Hi all, I have a 2014 SX and have 5600 trouble free miles so far and love it The only thing I would change is maybe a seat with more padding, otherwise a great fun bike.
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Dynasport
Posted on Tuesday, May 31, 2016 - 11:00 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I have ridden an SX. I did a demo ride in Daytona a couple of years back I guess it was. I really enjoyed the bike, but the demo was not all that long and was pretty spirited. It really wasn't a good indication of the bike's tourabiity for me. But it was at that demo that the EBR rep told me about a screen and bags that were in the works way back then. Then EBR closed and the world went dark.

One concern that no one has addressed yet is the maintenance interval. I take from some of Froggy's posts that it is short and expensive (or difficult). That could put a damper on things.
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Dynasport
Posted on Tuesday, May 31, 2016 - 11:33 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Oh and Crusty, when people give you crap about your Sportster tell them a few years back a guy came in third in the Iron Butt Rally on a Sportster. I can't remember the year, but It'd be easy enough to find. I have seen the bike in person. It is currently at the Wheels Through Time museum in Maggie Valley.
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Froggy
Posted on Wednesday, June 01, 2016 - 11:30 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)


quote:

Anyway, first, any idea when the promised SX accessories such as bags and windscreen will be available?




I asked that today, I was told "we're busy!"

The company just hired its 12th employee, so hopefully the answer will be soon. Lots of things going on behind the curtain.


quote:

Second, I have seen Froggy mention he doesn't ride his SX long distances because of chain maintenance and bike servicing. Is the chain that difficult to maintain? And what is the service interval for the bike and is it difficult and/or expensive?




Well that is part of the reason I tour on it, but not the main one. Primary reason is that with the luxury of having seven bikes in the fleet, I can afford to have one setup for touring, one setup for commuting, one for constant fixing, one for special events and so on. I simply don't need to turn the SX into a touring bike, regardless of what the bike is capable of. Iíve toured on my XB Lightning, 1125R and CR, in addition to Ulys and a Blast. All of them were quite capable after some basic mods like luggage, GPS, and comfort tweaks.

I can see touring being fine on the SX. Stock seat is comfy, so no changes needed there, just add some decent luggage and high mileage tires.

I personally find the chain difficult to deal with. You need to remember though, that I lack experience with it, so it is new to me. Iíve ridden somewhere around 200k miles on belt driven Buellís, and other than replacing a few belts it has been painless. No lubes, no adjusting, no futzing around, just ride and swap it once in a while. So from that, going to something that needs even an ounce more attention is a step backwards, but I will adjust to it, or at least pay someone to adjust it.

I had to buy some lube. I felt like an idiot at the Cyclegear, because there I was, not some noob who just got their license and a Ninja 250, but as someone with tons of riding experience, yet I knew nothing about chain maintenance. Anyway thankfully the guys there were helpful and got me the right stuff (I think). Iíve watched some videos on YouTube, so I think I got the cleaning and adjusting procedures down, but it is one of those things that I donít feel confident about.

Anyway, I donít recall if there is a specific service interval for chain maintenance, so Iíve been doing it at every 1k miles. Regarding the rest of the bikes service intervals, one thing you need to remember is that there is a valve adjustment check every 6200 miles, unlike the 1125s which were every 12.4k miles. On the other hand, doing the valve inspection is easier than on the 1125s as you donít need to rotate the motor, but if you stick to dealers for scheduled services it still will get expensive fast. I canít imagine the valves needing frequent adjustment if it is seeing touring duty. My 1125s are still untouched at around 22k miles each, Iíll see if they finally need adjustment at their 24.8k services. Those who run the bikes hard or do frequent trackdays seem to need them adjusted often, sometimes even more frequently than the book states (possibly a reason for the shorter interval on the 1190s).

The stock tires on the SX are fantastic for grip. They grip so much that if you got them hot enough you could probably park on the ceiling. But the tradeoff is short life, Iím at 2500 miles and am almost at the wear bars on my rear, and the front looks like a trapezoid. Again tires are an easy fix, swap on some Angels and 10k a set is more likely.


quote:

I am thinking about an SX, but I want it to be as comfortable as my Uly XT on trips and I am skeptical that it will be. I also don't want to spend an arm and a leg every time I turn around on maintenance.




Honestly I feel that in stock vs stock, the SX is more comfortable than the XT. Every ass is different, but I find the riding position and seat on the SX to be near perfect. The bars on the SX are too high in my opinion, but not a big enough deal for me to do anything about. Nice thing about the XT is the factory luggage and general roominess, which allows you to easily add more crap behind you. But in terms of ability to soak up the miles it just feels easier on my SX. Then again, Iíve not done any 600+ mile days on it, but shorter trips feel more comfortable, I donít feel drained or hurting like after similar rides on my Ulysses.


quote:

Oh, one more question, that I hesitate to ask. But do you guys think buying and EBR is a big risk considering the track record of EBR having a hard time staying in business.




Well that is the great unknown. Third times the charm as they say, and look at how many times Triumph and Indian have closed and reopened. Even Harley had hit hard times back during the AMF era if I recall right. It appears that LAP is committed to keeping EBR going. They are keeping everything as small and cost effective as possible, one of the things that hurt EBR the first time around was growing too big too fast to sustain.

Iím not worried about parts. Many engine bits can be sourced from Harley or other bikes (hell Iím running an 1125R oil filter on my SX), and for everything else the community will figure out something. I do understand your concerns though, there is a very real possibility that something unique to the EBR could break, and it could leave you down for an extended period of time or possibly indefinitely, if EBR was to go under again.


quote:

tiny screen I understand will be available at some point from Buell, but it is so small I'm not sure it will do much.




While not as effective as the barn doors that many have on a Uly, a small windscreen can make a difference. Laminar Lips for example are short and do help deflect wind quite a bit.

The SX is a great bike, but in my opinion you should add it to the stable, not have it replace the Ulysses. The Uly is a jack of all trades, the SX is an ace of being a super streetfighter. They complement each other quite nicely.

Iím sorry for going on and on and posting a wall of text, Iíve been thinking this up for the last few days after seeing your post.
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Dynasport
Posted on Thursday, June 02, 2016 - 07:29 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thank you Froggy! I really appreciate the time and effort you put into your reply. I respect your opinion and experience. Except when it comes to comfort issues . I'm a much heavier guy than you and did not find the 1125 nearly as comfortable as my Uly XT.

After taking a step back for a minute, I have come to believe that I would love to have an SX, but it is probably not the bike I want to ride cross country on.
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Qurtrn10
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2016 - 09:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I enjoy my 1190SX on distance riding more than I did my xb9sl. The seat, although it looks much thinner, was more comfortable after an hour or two. (The longest ride I've gone on was 3 hours each way in the same day.

Bags and windscreen should not be a problem. The demo bike at the Relaunch are available from OGIO. Although they don't have the EBR logo, they are the same bags:




In fact, I've already done the tank bag. It does require some modification to the bag to make it work, but nothing major. (There's a DIY on EBRForum):


I'll do the saddle bags next month when my bike is put back together (having paint work done).

I'll probably tackle the windscreen after the saddle bags. There are plenty of universal windscreens available that you could use, and even cut down into the exact shape you want. I find that the lack of windscreen starts to matter when I get above 80, so I'll get/make one, but depending on looks, might only put it on for highway riding.

Hope it helps,
William

P.S. - yeah, the chain in a pain coming from a belt driven Buell, but it's just part of the cost of ownership. Keep up with your maintenance and check it every once in a while, and you should be fine. I think most of the problems arise when something got out of alignment and wasn't caught before lots of miles were added.

(Message edited by qurtrn10 on June 03, 2016)
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Hughlysses
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2016 - 10:11 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

You may want to check in on this thread regarding this week's Homecoming meet in East Troy:

http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/406 2/778424.html?1464959197

Crusty has a post implying he heard that a more touring-friendly bike is in the works. There's also a link to an audio interview with Erik in which he implies the same thing.
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Reepicheep
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2016 - 10:29 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Boy is that a pretty bike.
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Terrys1980
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2016 - 11:17 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Erik always follows that they are solely focused on getting good dealers and not spending money on new projects. He said the same in the 650ib interview.

To me all the "in the works" stuff is what is left over from when they had cash from Hero.
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Dynasport
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2016 - 11:49 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Maybe they'll just sell me the yellow bike with everything already done to it.
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Snacktoast
Posted on Friday, June 03, 2016 - 11:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'm sure everything is available at the right price
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Mnscrounger
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2016 - 01:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I wasn't sure where to post this. But since you brought it up, here is as good a place as any. ( Forum administrators feel free to move it wherever you think it should be.)

My SX test ride review:

On day 2 of HC I was at the lunch table with Erik, Mike, and Steve yesterday, (I believe essentially the executive leadership of EBR). I may have been a bit selfish for taking that seat, but after a year of speculation and rumors, I wanted to get the straight truth, and their vision for the future. I didn't expect them to open the kimono for li'l ole me, but they asked all of us what we ride, and why we chose that product. We also got to ask a lot of the question's they've heard a million times before. While no one pointedly asked about the AX specifically, to Crusty's point about what is coming. It was what they didn't say that was the loudest. There was a lot of body language, (glances awkward pauses), that suggest we are being heard, and our opinion counts. That's a little scary, because I don't have building a multi million dollar motorcycle company in my resume, and these guys have done it two or three times, ( depending on how you see it). Fate kicks them over, they get back up and get back to work. and continue to improve the product every time.
I told Mike I didn't see an SX in my future because I am a 52 year old touring guy. I can't ride a sport bike for more than 40 or 50 miles before I need a break. The lack of bags and a windshield was a deal breaker for me. Mike then asked me straight up "Have you ridden one yet?" I told him no, I've sat on the RS at the IMC two or three years ago,and the SX at the open house, but with no local EBR dealer in the Twin Cities I never got the chance. Mike then asked me "How can you make the decision it won't fit you if you've never ridden it?"

He was right. and I and to concede it. He said "Since you are here today with a dealer only minutes away, You should go over to Action Powersports in Waukeshaw and go take a test ride.They would love to demo it for you."
Long story longer, I did.
James From Action Powersports met me with a big smile and a friendly "We've been expecting you."
After a brief conversation before the ride about my experience level and how long I had been riding Buell products,
James had set the traction control at 4. He said this setting would probably keep me from getting into trouble but allow me to probe the edges of my skills with the bike.

At first, I rode and shifted the bike the only way I know how, just like my S3. My S3 is all I've ridden for 4 years, and I have very limited experience on all out sport bikes. Driven that way, the SX wasn't the evil biting torque monster I feared, or a twitchy turning thoroughbred. It was a nimble, smooth handling bike that turned easily in low speed maneuvers and never felt like more bike than I could handle.The clutch action was smooth and moderate in feel. The seating position was a lot more comfortable than I expected. (I'll come back to that in a minute, but more on the ride.)
After a few miles I became more comfortable with the clutch feel, braking, and gear lever motion. I began to push the acceleration more and more. The power curve feels linear (I know that a curve can't be "linear" but that's what I felt) from about 2000-7000 RPM in that what you twist on the throttle is what you get, and what you get is always "more". At about 6500 it starts making a growl that's like a barroom challenge (I'll do this if you really want, but remember you asked for it!) I honestly don't know what happens much above that, because I always either caught up to my host, ran out of road, or ran out of courage. as an aside despite the rookie managing the throttle, short shifting and forgetting to downshift, the MPG reading never dipped below 50 while I was looking at it. It might have during a few near WOT's but my eyes were mashed too far back in my head to see.

Conclusion: Is it my S3T replacement?

Probably not. The seat, while comfortable for a short ride is still too firm for my poor soft backside. The position is a lot more upright than I expected, but having no fairing or windshield gave me the feeling of sitting too far forward. I'm sure leaning over and putting my weight more centered between the wheels partially accounted for it's nimbleness. The pegs felt too high and the bars too low for my back to enjoy an all day ride. and without a place to pack my jacket shell, or liner, (or tonight's takeout) I'm afraid it's not quite ideal for me.

But that motor....
and that handling...

Since I had the ear of EBR once yesterday, I'll continue to pretend that I alone can drive design, product development, and marketing, (What the heck it's my fantasy)



MY 1190 SX would have about 2" more distance between the seat and the pegs from where they are now. I'm feeling generous, so I won't tell EBR whether to put more tushycush in the seat (a bonus),drop the pegs, or a combination of both (a double bonus). The bars would be taller so I can sit up with my back straight, the way momma taught me to sit, (but leaning in politely, so people know I'm engaged).
Nothing on an EBR is there without reason for being. Everything on the bike does something, and some things on the bike do more than one thing. One thing I would prefer to live without is the secondary canister. I know it makes horsepower AND helps meet EPA noise requirements, but let's be honest. Your bike already makes gobs more horsepower than a tumbleturd like me can effectively use. I'm willing to give up a couple horses as a slave to keep clean symmetrical lines of the bike.
Seeming contradictory to my clean line desire, MY SX needs a set of bags. (one on each side so we can at least maintain symmetry) When I mean bag I mean grocery bag size bags. They should open at the top, and hard mount to the bike so I can overload them with way too much crap like I do my current ones. They don't actually have to close when overstuffed if they open at the top. I'll forego a passenger peg and and by default the passenger if it gets me a solid mounted bag that doesn't droop into the drive chain.

(Seriously I have an idea for a bag design if you're not working on one already)

HMM the drive chain... if a 1700 pound 175 horse(more with a turbo) Slingshot with a 255 tire can get by with a belt, could you get one to fit on MY SX? I understand them to be quieter and less maintenance than a chain. My S3's belt certainly did.
Quieter... MY SX would have, if not a fairing and windscreen, an honest to God windshield.

I need to get the wind out of my jacket and helmet.

So at speed...

I can hear...

that motor.

that motor......
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Dave
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2016 - 08:11 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Glad you took the SX for a spin. I'm excited to see what's coming. Like ya said, lots of body language, smiles, extended pauses, glances, measured responses, etc by the EBR guys. (and rightly so)

Maybe confirmation bias or the demographic of the group but a common theme seemed to echo the desire for an street based sport touring 1190ST and a street biased all roads (Multistrada) EBR.

DAve
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Dannybuell
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2016 - 10:05 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

"leaning in politely, so people know I'm engaged"

ha, Ha, HA
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Hughlysses
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2016 - 10:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Mnscrounger- thanks for passing along that info on hints dropped by EBR.

In case any of you didn't see the link, Erik did an interview with Wheelnerds last week, and he sort of drops some hints too:

http://wheelnerds.com/e/consequences-and-buell

Erik comes on at about 35 minutes in.
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Froggy
Posted on Monday, June 06, 2016 - 12:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I haven't had a chance to post again as I just made it home from Homecoming only a few hours ago, but as I was at the same table as Mnscrounger I can confirm what he observed.

Good things are coming, maybe not all the ones we want due to their limited resources, but some tweaks to the existing platform to make it more appealing to those that want something other than a super streetfighter. Changing things on the bike changes things in ways most won't have considered, and it often isn't as simple as bolting on some off the shelf part. Just look at the problems with leaky luggage and bad latches on the stock Uly bags. EBR appears to be listening to our feedback, so hopefully some great things are in the works.

Before this week I was only considering my SX to be a dedicated twisty eating mountain carving super streetfighter, but now I suddenly have the urge to throw ST tires on, change the gearing, add some luggage and take it on some long weekends.

After literally seeing the bikes being built and discussing the maintenance intervals and such, I'm no longer as worried about it. It is not that much different than dealing with than any other Buell I own, it isn't some crazy exotic Italian bike that needs to be pampered every other time you fill the tank, or some super high strung drag bike that needs a rebuild after every pass. I'll just shut up and ride the motorcycle. Court was on to something with his lap of America, perhaps I should follow in his footsteps.
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Mnscrounger
Posted on Monday, June 06, 2016 - 10:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I agree Froggy. One walk down the assembly stations and the bike was no longer that mysterious techno wonder. just a well thought out and compact execution of a clean sheet design.

One more thing: While the SX may not be the bike that fits me perfectly, the readjusted pricing makes for those people the bike is right for, a relative value.
Now I need to try to convince a local shop to consider a "tier two" dealership arrangement with EBR.
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Finedaddy1
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 07:27 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I believe a tweaked SX for the sport touring crowd is the way to go and would be a big hit. I would be more excited if EBR went this route than I would the AX. Sorry, but "IMO" the ADV street bikes are going to run their course soon and people will re-discover sport touring again.

If I could have that yellow SX w/ a belt drive I would be more than satisfied!
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Hughlysses
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 07:41 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

You know, the other "hint" they may have dropped about this was the 650ib video where he picks up his bike at the factory and goes riding with Erik and Mike Kirkpatrick. Erik mentions a couple of guys have been working on his personal bike, and how he's installed higher bars on it. On the audio interview, Erik mentions how the stock gearing is a little tall for every day usage.

With the tiny staff EBR is working with, I can easily imagine Erik being the default "factory test rider". Erik himself may be developing the next iteration of the 1190SX in plain sight.
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Dannybuell
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 09:13 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

...great thread.

Hughlysses
I saw that 650ib vid, didn't take as hints!
Now that you mention it... :-)
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Crusty
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 10:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I saw Erik's bike. It has taller bars and lower (Knight Design?) foot pegs. I didn't look at the sprockets or count the teeth, but Froggy rode an SX that had slightly different gearing and really liked it.

I don't think they're going to come out with a belt, which is a pity. I really like belt drive, especially over Chain drive.

I think EBR should just take a page out of the H-D and BMW rule books. Make the basic bike and offer the accessories to turn it into the bike that fits you. Harley offers every accessory under the sun for their bikes and I don't think there's a BMW that you can't get hard bags for. An SX that I could set up the way I've set up my Roadster would be one hell of a sweet ride.

(Message edited by Crusty on June 07, 2016)
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Hughlysses
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 11:14 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I saw Erik's bike. It has taller bars and lower (Knight Design?) foot pegs.

By Jove, you're right:

erikFP


Mike has some sort of rubber-covered footpegs on his. I think these were a Buell accessory for the XB's:

mikeFP
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Hughlysses
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 04:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Another pick of Erik's footpegs:

peg


Erik's handlebars:

erikbar


Mike's stock handlebars:

mikebar


All these pics are screen caps from 650ib's ride video with Erik and Mike.
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Froggy
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 05:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Those screencaps are so low res! Someone should go to East Troy and take some pictures! Oh wait, I did! : D

















Mike's bike is running the stock SX bars, but with Acerbis Handguards with LEDs built in, also titanium folding levers. Mike's bike has a bunch of other tricks like a 44 tooth rear sprocket and Ohlins suspension, and Buell Traction footpegs.

Erik's bike is running Protaper bars that are higher, but I don't know how much, also with Knight footpegs.
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Moosehead89
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 07:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I've emailed protaper to find out what bars those are. I'd like to have a set of both the bars and the footpegs!
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Froggy
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 08:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

http://www.knightdesignllc.com/Products/Motorcycle /Buell/XB9S/Buell-XB9S-1-Front-Foot-Pegs.html

I'm pretty sure those are Erik's footpegs.
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Hughlysses
Posted on Tuesday, June 07, 2016 - 09:09 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

OK, now all we need is brackets for hard bags and a decent windshield.
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1313
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 01:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I've emailed protaper to find out what bars those are.

I don't know how much it will help, but from the riders point of view between the handlebar clamps is printed "Adventure". I know I took a pic of the bars showing this, but won't get a chance to get near my pics until sometime tomorrow.

I'll post as soon as I can,
1313
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Dave
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 11:37 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Mike indicated that they are planning a 44 tooth sprocket & chain kit.

Re Erik's bars


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "Tech"
Date: May 23, 2016 09:48
Subject: RE: Erik's 1190SX
To: "Dave N"
Cc:

They are ProTaper adventure bars.

I almost forgot (Erik reminded me) you need a longer clutch hose too.

Thank you,

EBR Tech


DAve
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Mbest
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 12:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I want those adjustable, folding levers, are they the EBR ones or?
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Crusty
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 12:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Now, I heard that the magnesium seat subframe won't support the weight of hard bags, so they'll have to come up with a stronger subframe. As long as they're doing that, they could also come up with a seat that's comfortable for a longer period of time.

Voila! Instant Sport - Tourer. (and one happy Crusty old Tramp!)
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Emufriedchicken
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 04:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Would those bars fit a 1125CR too...they look a lot higher than my factory high bar kit I have on my bike???
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Moosehead89
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 05:09 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

1313- Thanks, that does indeed help, the adveture is one of their models!
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Anonymous
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 05:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

FYI, you need longer throttle cables, brake hose and clutch hose to install the Adventure bars. These are not (yet) available from EBR.
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Anonymous
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 05:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

And the Knight footpegs do not fit without rework.
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Ds_tiger
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 05:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

^^

good to know!
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Hughlysses
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 05:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

^ +1. Thanks for posting!
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1313
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 07:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)


Adventure bars
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Moosehead89
Posted on Wednesday, June 08, 2016 - 09:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Heard back from KD, Alicia asked for some measurements for both the pegs and spool and axle sliders. I will get those done Sat and will keep everyone posted.
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Dannybuell
Posted on Thursday, June 09, 2016 - 09:33 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

online sales... cool

how about a 'local motors' crowd sourcing platform for EBR?

Contests and Prizes Too!
put an SX subframe cad file out there, ask the crowd to take their best shot with the SX's bagger subframe issues...

Engage #1. Engage.
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Reepicheep
Posted on Thursday, June 09, 2016 - 10:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Nice!
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Sprintst
Posted on Friday, June 10, 2016 - 12:23 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

With much of the support for Buells drying up, as witnessed by the closures of so many of the Buell specific vendors, such as American Sportbike and most recently 5-Odro, I have big concerns as well

The Buell's still have factory parts support, and there are a lot of parts bikes out there. You can get most anything off ebay

How many parts 1190's are there? Not many.


IF, and yes, it's a big IF, EBR is parted out and sold off after LAP sells off the work in progress (finish producing the left over inventory) then you EBR owners are in a tough spot in my mind

The sprocket issue alone seems like a show stopper. If there is no more EBR, in as few as 2500 miles your bike is parked

IDK, love my 1125R, think I would love an 1190, but it's still got me hesitating
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Hughlysses
Posted on Friday, June 10, 2016 - 10:32 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The sprocket issue alone seems like a show stopper. If there is no more EBR, in as few as 2500 miles your bike is parked

While I'm sure lack of availability would be a royal PITA, it wouldn't really be a show stopper. Worst case, I'd think you could machine the worn sprocket portion off the assembly, take an off-the-shelf sprocket, bore it to fit the assembly, and weld it in place. If you don't have your own machine shop and aren't a skilled welder, it could be a pretty expensive proposition. OTOH I can imagine someone like Twin Motorcycles would do these on an exchange/rebuild basis if there was sufficient demand.

Let's hope it never comes to that.
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Ebrfan
Posted on Friday, June 10, 2016 - 06:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

You Buell owners have just as much parts availability for the 1125 as any EBR owner does for the 1190; more so now for both bikes that EBR is back in business. So why hesitate in purchasing an EBR. The more of them that exist the more the demand for parts goes up. Demand then requires a steady supply of parts, and EBR continues to be a viable American brand that isn't likely to be shut down again.
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Ducbsa
Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2016 - 05:13 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

This may not be apples and apples now, but when this http://www.voc.uk.com/vocschist.php was started in 1975, Vincents were not mega buck machines. It would be nice for EBRs, 1125s and XBs if somehow the OEM suppliers of isolators, frames, etc. were contacted and asked to please save the design and production info for possible future use. My buddy with a Vincent tells me that the dies for the late model diecast cases were scrapped after production stopped in 1955, nice to avoid for EBR & Buell.
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Dannybuell
Posted on Saturday, June 11, 2016 - 10:46 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Ducbsa makes an interesting point about file sharing for the oldies. In the age of 3D printers there is likely anything that could be reproduced at home! share CAD file.

if you already have an 1125 there is nothing to worry, been there done that. Right?

if you don't have an 1125, buy one. If the 1125 works for you after 3,000 miles buy an EBR. My 1125 CR is a fine bike. The EBR is half the price of a Ducati and American made. if you use all of the 1125s HP on a consistent basis and find it lacking? Buy an EBR.

nervous bitches can be exciting,and also tiresome. there is no 2,200 rpm parade, traffic crawl like a HDB. the 1125 version turns out to be a sliding clutch action, half way out and pull it back in. even more fun is the save the clutch version; half way out, pull back in, neutral, release... Buy an IL4? same thing.

want to get out and let her fly?
buy, Buy, BUY
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Mnscrounger
Posted on Tuesday, June 14, 2016 - 05:46 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

All this talk about parts supplies drying up and worry about support reminded me of another comment Steve Smith made while at the Homecoming Friday lunch table.

Disclaimer: I'm going to paraphrase Steve's comments heavily, and while not exact quotes, they will give my take from the conversation I'm referencing. Hopefully some of you will recall it better.

Talk was drifting toward legacy products and the declining (sometimes begrudging) support we see from HD regarding parts. Steve mentioned how he would love to start a division to support the XBs, 1125s and even possibly the tube framed Buells in the future. I asked why he thought that was a good move for EBR. His reply was pretty straight forward.
" While motorcycles are the product, EBR is in business for the purpose of making MONEY. While we can't afford to go there right now, I think it makes a lot of sense. There were around 150,000 Buells produced. If HD doesn't want to make $5.00 selling you a turn signal, because its too much of a hassle to keep the part number and sourcing info, I would love to make that $5.00. Most of the parts sourcing knowledge is either still in our file cabinets, or the memory of our employees. As far as tech support, the guy who designed and wrote the map for your bike's ECM works for us now. The same is true for all aspects of the Buell bikes. If Harley Davidson doesn't want to earn your business, and your dollars, I sure as heck do!"
I asked if he had any worries that keeping the older bikes on the road would cut into his prospective sales. He smiled and asked aloud, "Who here has more than one Buell, and who has the most?"
We went round the tables and while I don't recall the exact numbers, It proved out that most had multiple examples. He turned back to me with a smile and said "There's always room in the garage for just one more with these guys. If we can serve them well with the EBR/Buell bike they already own, when they're ready for a new one, they're more likely to buy one of ours."

I REALLY like the way the leadership of EBR thinks..
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Dannybuell
Posted on Tuesday, June 14, 2016 - 08:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Mnscrounger - great post!

now if we can outsource within the community by doing what Tesla did. instead of placing a trove of patents into the public domain, release a few of the tuber auto-cad files to the community. e-bay was getting $60.00 for used tuber rear isolators that just happened to have the billet inner race bushings. The remaining set of bushings were at $80 last time I looked.

What greater contribution could there be to the sustainability of these bikes than
--group orders and
--outsourcing production to Buellers?

This would also serve as a timeless commitment toward the future sustainability needs of Buell owners.

A data dump framed as a sustainability commitment would release data in the event of any unforeseen circumstance.
This may have a positive influence on the person considering the risks associated with a $15,000 bike made by a maker that has regularly risen from the ashes of destruction.
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Dave
Posted on Tuesday, June 14, 2016 - 11:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Spot on Steve

DAve
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Hughlysses
Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2016 - 08:30 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Sounds like more hopeful developments out of EBR.

Here's an interesting factoid I discovered last night: the yellow color ("strike yellow") shown on the SX in the post way up above (link), is apparently not yet in production. If you go to the page to order an SX in this color, this shows up at the bottom of the window:

quote:

This item is not currently available. When you add it to your order it will be placed on backorder and an update will be sent to you regarding timing. If this is a motorcycle deposit, we will contact you directly to discuss alternate color choices that are currently available or when we expect to have your model/color choice in the production schedule.



So I'd guess availability of this color depends on how many people want it and/or how long you're willing to wait.
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Dannybuell
Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2016 - 09:12 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

group order-are you yellow or not?

ha Ha :-)
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Qurtrn10
Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2016 - 10:11 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Strike yellow SX available at Freedom Rides Powersports in northern CA.




I would assume the backorder just means they don't have yellow panels in stock. If someone puts down a deposit, I would be curious to see how long the backorder would be. I'm guessing just long enough to send them out a batch of panels for paint.
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Froggy
Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2016 - 11:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Only the blue SX has real paint, the rest of the bikes use colored plastics like the XB and 1125s
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Qurtrn10
Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2016 - 04:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Good call Froggy - I was think of our blue bikes.
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Froggy
Posted on Thursday, June 16, 2016 - 09:20 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Will, it turns out I was mistaken, the Sidewinder Silver on the 2016 RX is painted, and of course the 5 limited edition American flag 1776 bikes.
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