| Author | Message | ||
     Badlionsfan |
Just saw this. http://www.motorcycle.com/news/hd-to-buy-out-mv-ag usta-80621.html | ||
| Glitch |
Last Summer H-D was supposed to buy Ducati. http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2007/06/14/ducat i-considering-harley-davidson-merger/ | ||
| No_rice |
that wouldnt be to bad to have those sitting in my shop beside the buells! but rumors are rumors until it happens (Message edited by no_rice on June 07, 2008) | ||
| Badlionsfan |
And we think we have dealer support issues. If this were to happen, we wouldn't be the most hated customers at the typical dealer. | ||
| Jaimec |
http://motorcycledaily.com/06june08_hdandmv.htm But here's a thought... Buells would get OUT of the HD showrooms and into the same showrooms with MV Agusta. That wouldn't suck... | ||
| Just_ziptab |
Well, it ain't like they haven't dealt with Italians before........Aermacchi! | ||
| Ducxl |
I thought the Castiglioni's (Ca-Gi-Va)bought the remnants of Aermacchi when H-D sold it off. Funny how it could come full circle | ||
| Spatten1 |
Man, MVs are the most beautiful bikes I've ever seen in person. Every square inch of the bike has fascinating details. I used to just slowly work my way around the bike like you would a radical custom. I hope the rumors are true, if nothing else, just to keep the marque alive. | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
I don't see the logic - 300 million dollars is not chump change. What do they get for this?.. a company that worked itself into deep debt selling expensive motorcycles. What's the upside for HD? In case they haven't noticed, the economy or consumer confidence in the economy is sinking, fast. Considering HD's demographic is aging, one would think they would dedicate their efforts to attracting younger riders and build brand loyalty instead of spending millions on a boutique brand. Besides, that is 300 million that could go to improving HD and Buell. | ||
| Madduck |
Its basic marketing, you can't sell someone something if you cannot get him/her through the door. Having an expensive Italian motorcycle next to the Buells is a good plan. Buell = 98% of performance for 40% less. The Buells can be made in larger volumes than can the MV Agustas but they will have their own appeal to the people with more money than sense. Most of us Harley riders. Should be a relatively simple way to double Buell sales and bring more traffic in the dealership, traffic they normally wouldn't see. | ||
| Nevrenuf |
they're probably looking ahead a little if they do until the new president is sworn in and things get back to normal. election years always suck. | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
Basic marketing? You must be joking. I doubt HD would buy MV just to lure people into the showroom so they can purchase a cheap Buell. You have any idea what Buell could do with 300 million dollars? They could produce an entire line of world class motorcycles and goldplate the restroom faucets and still have money left over to go racing. (Message edited by ferris_von_bueller on June 07, 2008) | ||
| Jaimec |
I'm thinking they WOULDN'T sell the MV Agustas alongside the Harleys, but leave them in the dealerships they're in now. With one sportbike line now independent of the mothership, they could put Buells into the SAME dealerships (and away from the chrome driveway jewelry). That way you'd have more floor traffic from people actually LOOKING for sportbikes with a difference (otherwise they'd be at the local HonKawYamSuz dealer). After drooling over the boutique priced MV Agustas, they could then check out the more real-world priced Buells. At least, that's the way I'd do it. But I'm not a business major, so what do I know? I'm not even a construction worker... | ||
| Xl1200r |
Jaimec, I think you've got the most rational idea there. I can't see Buell or MV Agusta affecting sales numbers on either marque (since they don't really compete with one another directly), but surely with both in the same showroom, independtant of a brand many loathe, traffic should increase, and with it interest, knowledge, word of mouth and SALES. I'm no economist, but I'd like to coin this theory as the "Captain Planet Effect" - "When our powers combine, we are CAPTAIN PLANET!!!" (Message edited by xl1200r on June 07, 2008) | ||
| Slaughter |
I can only hope you are correct - that if the MV Agusta thing comes to pass that the Buells are sold with the MVs in separate showrooms. People who WANT a Harley know where to go. People who WANT a Buell might finally be able to go to a shop where true enthusiasts are on the staff. Of course, the MV die-hards will very likely be turning their noses up at the Buells - but I really don't see any conflict in any of the products. It just looks and smells good. We'll wait and see. | ||
| Just_ziptab |
300 million? Would that even put a scratch in Harley's check book? I think they spend their money .....where they want, when they want....and obviously don't want to spend much on Buells. MV is probably just a new company "toy" and gives them something to do.....after all,what's left in the H-D line that ain't chromed? They pretty much have "peak chromed" their current platforms........... | ||
| Ducxl |
and obviously don't want to spend much on Buells. Ouch! Harley,that's supposed to be MY line  "peak chromed" their current platforms Funny connection to "Peak Oil" | ||
| Just_ziptab |
"peak chromed".........I may have to lay a claim to fame for coining that term......  | ||
| Mainstreamer |
Suppose that V4 motor finds it way into a Buell! Suppose the management, marketing, manufacturing, skill at H-D could produce the MV marque at 1/2 the current price! Would you be riding a 1125r or a F4 R 312?? | ||
| Jaimec |
MV Agusta has a V4? | ||
| Zane |
I'm a rookie here so I have to ask. What technology does Agusta have that Harley might want? There has to be more to a 300 million dollar purchase than "maybe" it'll increase Buell sales. What specific advantage would the HD/Buell world get from having access to Agusta's processes, technology or products? I just don't see it. | ||
| Jaimec |
It's not technology. It's acquiring one of the most revered names in motorcycle sport bike history. | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
It's acquiring one of the most revered names in motorcycle sport bike history. It appears HD is looking to apply their marketing formula to the sportbike world. Perhaps, Buell would be regarded as the "beginners" bike with MV being the premium brand bringing with it all the built-in history and heritage equal to HD, in that respect. However, it's not as if HD would be purchasing a solvent company - MV is deeply in debt and one must ask how and why they got themselves into that predicament. I don't see any significant technology transfers | ||
| Xlcrguy |
Ferris, you don't think MV could benefit from some transfer of Buell technology??  | ||
| Zane |
If acquiring the name is all they want, why not wait until they go under and get the name for much, much less. We all here have to admit the people at HD are world class masters at PR. They don't sell motorcycles so much as they sell the fantasy of motorcycles. All that open road and livin' breathin' torque at your command stuff... When people tattoo your company name and logo on their body, you know the PR department is doing something very right. We all know it takes more than PR to build a great bike. Still, it never hurt... Are Agustas really that good? Years ago my sister had a Jaguar XKE. World class car, right? Except if the humidity changed it needed to go into the shop for a carb adjustment. So some who is dispassionate answer the question: Are Agustas really that good? I just wish that HD would turn the PR geniuses loose for Buell. They've already to a great product to work with. It might take another 5 or 10 years to build but image people lusting for a Lightning or a Ulysses like everyone does for a Road King or VROD? The product is there, they just need to get behind it with some of their marketing magic. Heck, in 10 years you could be seeing guys with Firebolt tattoos. Edited because ever with a word processor, I can't spell. (Message edited by Zane on June 09, 2008) | ||
| Rfischer |
Cagiva is already broke. It effectively went bust [for the umpteenth time] when Proton of Malaysia pulled out 3 years ago. At that time Gevi, an Italian investment bank with some links to Claudio Castilgioni took majority ownership to secure Cagiva's debt. All Harley is offering is to assume some of that debt - no cash. Gevi is holding out for a smaller discount on the paper. | ||
| Brumbear |
What happens if they aquire MV Augusta and make Erik Buell CEO and give him cartblanche but they drop the buell line entirely and meld it into the racing tradition of MV and start a bastard if you will MV BUELL what happens to the xb line does it go the way of the dodo. | ||
| Jaimec |
As fanatical as Erik is about his trilogy of tech? It'll NEVER happen. | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
"All Harley is offering is to assume some of that debt - no cash" In other words, it's akin to paying off a gambler's debt only to see him back in debt tomorrow. | ||
| Spatten1 |
Are Agustas really that good? In many respects...YES. Reliability, no. Performance, yes. Cache, higher level than Ducati. Check one out if you get a chance, these are high quality machines that look as good as the price would indicate. Jaguar was a good analogy. How many times in the 80's did you hear something like this: "I know it's in the shop 50% of the time, but when it runs it is the most beautiful experience you can imagine" I'm not saying that MVs are as unreliable as a Jag was, but I am saying that the buyer for that type of bike is willing to spend a lot of dough and put up with some crap because that machine is so damn beautiful and awe inspiring. |
