| Author | Message | ||
     Oldog |
A lot has been made of Indian technical prowess It seems to me that If they were so good why do they need us? After using a Indian made device ( Japanese label ) I was unimpressed,( found a huge flaw in the software ) not up to the label's standards. I don't plan to use that kit ever again for any serious equipment project. Sad to see EBR fall like this, not entirely shocked, I bet before its over HD has problems with their Indian manufacturing. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Sorry but if bike sales can't keep you open then maybe you don't belong open. As some who should know have posted, it appears the plan was that payments for EBR's engineering services would support the company until the bike sales picked up. I'd guess EBR had more models on the drawing board (maybe ready to introduce this year) to round out their model line up too. That seems like it should have been a pretty good business model, as long as you can count on people to pay their bills. Of course we all know hindsight is 20-20. | ||
| 86129squids |
 I'm with Hugh. July's issue of Cycle World has a piece on EBR's closure and receivership, with some interesting quotes from Erik himself. It'll all come out in the wash... once the current receivership phase is over, I'll bet $1 it'll be game on again for Erik and the Elves. What we've seen and even suspected for engineering brilliance from Erik and his team will carry them into the future yet- I'm sure of it. | ||
| Poppinsexz |
Sorry but if bike sales can't keep you open then maybe you don't belong open. Seriously????? I guess EBR was magically handed all the tooling, the R&D, the buildings, the parts supplies and the people right off the get go. cause that shit cost a fortune before even the first bike came off the line. much less sold. You obviously don't understand how businesses work. The old adage holds true "you have to have money to make money" None of the bikes were possible without money being invested up front. I bet the payback just to break even was many years worth of selling bikes. 5 year plan? 10 year plan? 20 year? The business plan is what gets your feet off the ground in the first place. | ||
| Snacktoast |
I guess EBR was magically handed all the tooling, the R&D, the buildings, the parts supplies and the people right off the get go. cause that shit cost a fortune before even the first bike came off the line. much less sold. All good points. I don't think a lot of people, outside of those that have attempted this type of venture or have been part of building one similar, have any kind of rational concept of how much work, effort, development and cubic dollars go into just starting it. It is enormous | ||
| Poppinsexz |
people think you somehow make a bike sell it then make another...ect and that it actually pays the bills I bet those first 1000 bikes won't even come close to paying for everything it took to even begin to produce them,much less make a profit. Alot have given EB a hard time that he screwed up. How do we know this? If his goal was a five year turn(no idea here) then funding pulled(bills not paid) in the first year is a guarantied death. If hero withheld as has been stated, then I would think there are legal repercussions, but that won't fix what happened nor bring EBR back. Either way courts and anything legal takes time. Lawyers gotta make a dime too. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
How long have we been hearing about Motus? I think I remember first reading an article in 2007 or 2008. I heard a rumor that the first few bikes were being built. In speaking with the founders of Motus, they said that they needed to be at around 2500-3000 units of their engine just to break even on the tooling and R&D. Their plan was to sell engines independent of their bike builds. Use them for kit builds and custom projects. Interesting strategy to get over the hump. I think it's hard to build a profitable business. Even harder to build a profitable motorcycle business. Add the target of building cutting edge, world beater bikes built in the US, and profitability is a real long shot. Having a trading partner who operates unethically doesn't help. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Well if I squillions on the lottery, I'll be sure to become an ethical investor (for a given value of ethical naturally). | ||
| Oddball |
I think those motus engines are $10K? Interesting but unless someone is building a micro kit car or dropping it in a smart car (which would be cool) they will probably just buy a crate v8 from the big boys. | ||
| Hughlysses |
As Brad mentions above, the July issue of Cycle World has a short letter FROM the editor about EBR closure. There are some VERY positive comments from Erik in the column:
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| 46champ |
Well EBR is to blame for the fact that the Hero HX250R is going into production yet. Information from one of Froggy's favorite websites. http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/bikes/hero-hx250r- launch-delay-2016/#more-88483 | ||
| Ourdee |
Dana, Is that a fact? | ||
| Snacktoast |
I would think that comment is tongue firmly planted in cheek... | ||
| Dave |
Hopeful post Hugh - thanks for relaying. DAve | ||
| Classax |
I would have expected that if Hero contracted EBR to do design and development work for them and then failed to pay for it that as part of the receivership fillings the IP in question would be under injunction until such time as clear ownership, (payment) had been rendered. To be honest IF and that's a big IF... the indications are true that HERO is to blame for this mess I truly hope they come out of the deal unable to go to market with the designs while some other entity picks up the EBR supply chain and begins build 1190s again. | ||
| Froggy |
Indeed it is not, he is joking around because I have been very vocal in the past about "Ass hole and Retard" as I've called them  | ||
| Wolfridgerider |
"Meanwhile, things in East Troy have been extremely quite, with EBR yet to contact its dealer network in any shape or form." that's not good... | ||
| Hootowl |
Extremely quite what? | ||
| Hughlysses |
"Meanwhile, things in East Troy have been extremely quite, with EBR yet to contact its dealer network in any shape or form." (Notwithstanding spelling errors...) I would think dealers would have at least gotten the same letters that EBR owners received, basically stating they should present any claims they have against EBR not later than ~31 July 2015. I'm skeptical this guy knows if the dealers have been contacted or not. | ||
| Steveford |
What it sounds like is Hero tried to force EBR into selling them the remaining percentage by putting them in a financial hole and Erik responded by going to receivership. Kind of like a chess match. This should have an interesting outcome and I think the guys who picked up the fire sale priced bikes are going to be the winners. | ||
| Ourdee |
Froggy thanks for helping me out with that. Really need to get that sarcasm emoticon up and running. | ||
| Sifo |
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| Figorvonbuellingham |
I thought under Wisconsin receivership law hero cant get their nasty little brown curry stinking fingers on EBR. No? | ||
| Ourdee |
Figor, From my understanding you are correct. | ||
| Ourdee |
Designed to keep the owner of a business from erasing debt or paying pennies on the dollar for the debt of the business and still owning it on the other side. Key word: receivership. No, but I too have slept in a Holiday Inn. | ||
| Jon |
Don't let your disdain for Hero Motorcorp drive you to make racist remarks about their brown fingers. Don't be immature in your vexation. It sounds cheap. They suck because they're third world crooks, not because they're brown. Curry's good eating too. (Message edited by jon on June 02, 2015) | ||
| Hughlysses |
Ourdee- what happens when the company comes out of receivership? If ACME Consolidated Transportation Company (or whoever) comes in and buys EBR for say, ~$50M, does $20M go to pay off the debt to EBR creditors, and $15.01M go to Erik and $14.99M go to Hero and they walk away? Or do they have some option to stay involved in the company? | ||
| Ourdee |
Hugh, I won't speculate on all that. I have my guesses. But, that is all they would be. | ||
| Figorvonbuellingham |
They can no longer hold any part of the company. They (Eric) could be hired by whomever ends up with it. They'd be a fool not too bring him aboard as chief engineer. | ||
| Ourdee |
I would hope they leave Eric alone and hire Erik. |
