| Author | Message | ||
     Scarecrow |
It seems Harley is intent on the total destruction of resale values on any motorcycles associated with it. It wasn't very many years ago the dealerships only had a few used bikes on the showroom floors and there were waiting lists for new bikes. You had to wait a year or more to get the bike you wanted but you also had to take what ever color it was even if you didn't like it or you lost out. That kept the resale value up on the bikes and they were almost an investment instead of just a purchase. In 2006 I purchased my Ultra Classic thinking of it sort of like an investment as well as for entertainment. Shortly after that Harley stepped up production and flooded the market with new bikes and opened new dealerships all over the place. The resale value of my 25K+ motorcycle instantly went down the crapper. That shows you that Harley is only interested in their bottom line, not the consumer (no surprise there). They make themselves out to be a way of life and a company who listens to and takes care of it's customers. This is the thanks we get after we purchase their expensive motorcycles and the save them billions upon billions of dollars in advertising as we wear their logo covered t-shirts, sweatshirts, leathers, jackets, etc.... Now they are going after the Buell community. It is a smaller community that than Harley community but is a fiercely loyal group. Now, with Harleys announcement of discontinuing Buell and giving all the "killer" deals on new bikes they have effectively destroyed any decent resale value of Buells as well. It's nice (for a buyer)to get a killer deal when you buy something but it's like they are turning their backs on those of us that made the company great in the first place. I would like to have another Buell someday because they such awesome machines and I have no intention of getting rid of my Ultra Classic (and not just because resale is crap), but it's sad to see a company with such loyal customers (both Harley and Buell) turn their backs on us all. We are encouraged to buy American but why should we when an American company treats Americans (and others) so poorly. Harley is no better and no more consumer loyal than any other company in the world. We've just been brain washed into believing they care. But that's just my opinion! | ||
| 46champ |
With the end of production soon the number of Buells for sale will diminish and the resale value will go up. We will have the last laugh. | ||
| Ourdee |
I won't, I purchased my Uly in Sept 08. I paid the going rate, Over 14k out the door. It now looks like when I'm able to make the next purchase the prices will be back up? | ||
| Smoke |
i wouldn't trade the last almost 2 years of my 1125r ownership for the better pricing today. a friend called the other night and asked if i thought the 1125r was a bike worth the existing prices and if he would like it. he has an xbr as his ride. i told him that the price he was being offered is the same as my payout on my 20000 mile bike and that he would enjoy the 1125 if he got it. Congratulations on the new bike Fran!! i won't be selling any Buells anytime soon. i might have to pick up a couple more though!! i don't seem to have any xb's in my garage. ride safe, tim | ||
| Andymnelson |
Buells have resale value? Seriously, resale values have been in the tank for a long time- XBs have been selling in the $3000s this summer....this won't hurt them any more than they already are. Besides, they were made to be ridden, not invested into and that's just what I'm gonna do...ride the piss out of my X1 and XB9S! | ||
| 1324 |
Buying new vehicles as an investment, quite frankly, amuses me (by no means do I mean any offense to the original poster). Vehicles are depreciable assets and as such, LOSE VALUE. There are a few exceptions obviously, but for the most part, you lose money. Doesn't matter if you're buying a new Porsche or a Hyundai. In fact, many cases show the initial depreciation of higher priced vehicles to be greater than lesser-priced vehicles. If you want to 'make money' on your vehicle, take good care of it, don't ride it much, and sell in many years when there is a demand (if/when). Of course, if you buy today at $5k and sell in ten years at $5k, you still lost money on the transaction. I wouldn't worry about it. Personally, I couldn't afford a new Buell until this happened. Sad, but true: all of my Buells have been used until I snatched up an 1125R. Now, if I HAD the money years ago, I would've supported the brand by buying new. The fact of the matter is that HD is a prime example of supply and demand. Years ago the supply was low and demand was high. Today we seem to have the inverse - but not completely. Remember, HD still makes profit (for today). For Buell, this is the same deal. HD is going to want as much of Buell dead and gone on their books by the end of the year so as to consolidate as much of their losses into 2009 as possible. This means ending production, handing out pink slips, and liquidating new vehicles. This sort of thing happens a lot to consumers. What happened to all those fancy trucks and SUV's that were selling for top dollar back in the early 2000's when the oil prices shot up last year? The owners couldn't support a high payment AND high fuel prices, so they unloaded for a fraction of what they owed. There were many cases where you could buy a 2 year old used full size truck for about 40% of its initial price. If you want something, you're going to pay dearly. Either in an up-front mark-up or in depreciation down the road. Doesn't matter if you're buying a vehicle or an Iphone. If you can wait, you'll save money - every time. | ||
| Scarecrow |
My point is not about buying a bike as an investment. I know buying a vehicle is not an investment (except in a very rare instance). If you've never owned a Harley you might not understand but it was a bike you could sell (if you needed to) for a decent amount of money even used. No, you didn't "make" any money, but you sold at a lot higher price than you can today. The only way to "make" money on a vehicle is to buy something rare and tuck it away in storage for (usually) a long time. Then it might be rare enough and you "might" make money on it. But, what fun is that? Buy it to ride it, drive it, sail it, race it, fly it, and just downright enjoy the hell out of it. Buell, like Harleys now, will never go up in resale values now because there are just too many of them out there. The goal of any company is to sell as much of their product as they can otherwise they go out of business. It's just too bad the way it has to happen is all I'm sayin. (Message edited by scarecrow on October 24, 2009) | ||
| 1324 |
I agree with your take on the purchase. However, in the case of prior HD products, many people - myself included - felt HD products were overpriced to begin with. Is this a market correction? I don't know. Maybe. Either way, the recession is deepening, despite what the nightly news would have to believe. Selling anything in these times will only leave your wallet sore. Best only to acquire during these times...if you can afford it. In my unwarranted opinion, Buell XB models were overpriced. I think the 1125 was priced right for its competition. Despite the new model's price point, old brand perception and a weak market are difficult to overcome. Throw something in the mix like last week's news, and well, things are bleaker than ever for the brand. Only time will tell. For now, I'm going to ride the piss out of my bikes. After having totaled on bike on the track last year (XB9), every time I leave the house I understand I might return with a pile of worthless scrape metal...if I return at all. | ||
| Newxb12ss |
Investment? Way of life? Company clothing? Brand loyalty like that is nothing more than an overpriced "social club". Buy what you like and enjoy riding. Worrying about corporate moves has nothing to do with the riding experience. | ||
| Scarecrow |
You can't tell me it wouldn't bother you if you paid top dollar for an 1125r one week and then the next week you find out their closing the company and people are getting the same bike for thousands less. If that dosen't bother you I've got a bridge I'll sell ya. It's in San Francisco and it's "Golden". Sell for cheap!! Hardly used and has a new coat of paint.  Oh, and by the way, I agree Harley parts have always been way overpriced (including their bikes) and most of the parts aren't even made in America anymore. (Message edited by scarecrow on October 24, 2009) | ||
| Augustus74 |
I agree with Champ - this is just a market flucuation right now. After all the new bikes are gone, the resale will go up on the used ones. Just look at the prices dealers are asking for used ones...more then new ones, cause they know if they sit on them for a little while, the market will return. | ||
| Iamarchangel |
You're frustrated and expressing it poorly. Relax. Getting a fair deal at the beginning and losing the investment "gamble" is not the same as being cheated at the original deal. Just for fun, what you're upset about is called the "philosopher's stone" argument/paradox: if everything could be turned into gold, then gold would lose its value. If the resale value of HD/Buells were guaranteed good, then resale prices would stay high against new and there would be no market for used unless the resale price was dropped. Just a fact of life, tough. | ||
| Iamarchangel |
BTW: branded clothing, Buell was probably the only company that had quality branded clothing for lower price than non-branded competition. Price out an AGV Tech 4 versus a Buell AGV Tech 4 helmet, for example. | ||
| Oddball |
Perhaps, if the craze to buy is sustained after all remaining new are gone. Unlikely. That too will drop off. | ||
| Kurosawa |
My 12R is the best bike I've ever owned and I'm gonna ride it into the ground. | ||
| Scarecrow |
"You're frustrated and expressing it poorly. Relax." Thank you Obiwan!! Who do you think you are criticizing how I say something. I love my bike (Harley) and no longer own a Buell so I don't have to worry about their resale value anyway. I was just making an observation base on the trend over the last several years involving Harleys and Buells. If you don't like what I have to say then move along but don't try to psychoanalyze me. If you all want to believe your resale value will return then that's your right. I hope for your sake it does (If you plan on selling), but from what I've seen, don't count on it. It's too bad you can't post anymore to express your thoughts without some know-it-all coming along and spoiling the conversation. | ||
| Odie |
The way I feel when I ride and how I long to go ride every day (especially in Suches) equates to a return on investment that is immense. I spent the same cash on my Harley and it is no where near the same return dollar for dollar. I have gotten my moneys' worth and then some and plan to continue for a long time to come.  | ||
| Iamarchangel |
Oh, the Big Guy rant/vent in a public place thing. Pardon me, I thought it was a discussion board. Carry on. | ||
| Scarecrow |
It is a discussion board, NOT an insult board. | ||
| 1324 |
You can't tell me it wouldn't bother you if you paid top dollar for an 1125r one week and then the next week you find out their closing the company and people are getting the same bike for thousands less. If that dosen't bother you I've got a bridge I'll sell ya. It's in San Francisco and it's "Golden". Sell for cheap!! Hardly used and has a new coat of paint. Would it bother me? I guess it depends on how you mean 'bother'. Like buying/selling stock or real estate during the past couple years, there are winners and there are losers. Sometimes you find a deal, other times you don't. Realistically, the same situation we're going through here can happen to any brand. Given the level of corporate greed we've witnessed recently, maybe this will happen more frequently. No one knows. I treat the money I spend on toys like motorcycles to be money GONE. All it does is fuel my happiness. If I get anything out of it later down the road, BONUS for me. | ||
| Augustus74 |
I think the XB market will return to what it was. As for the 1125s', it may only return if they make/support more Rotax powered bikes??? | ||
| Scarecrow |
Your right 1234, you just have to consider it money gone and just enjoy the bike for what it is-fun. | ||
| Bratigan |
May I interject?... thankyou. Something that everyone should think about. There are three billion people in the world. That's a big market for anything that is for sale. Harleys are so abundant that when you check various advertisements you may see several pages of ads for a huge variety of Harleys for sale. We have something in the northeast called the Wantadd Digest, never seen so many Harleys. Harleys do not hold their value anymore because there are so many of them. Buells on the other hand are rare already. In 25 years time only 125,000 were made. They are not all on the road and some are more desireable than others. Collectors will seek the rarest and best of the bikes when the time comes. The Buell pedigree is already legend. The increase in future value is already built in. Enjoy your Buell, this is a time to be sad and a time to rejoice. If you have a Buell charish it and protect it, it has more value than you ever thought. Bill Ratigan | ||
| Daddyojohnston |
True words Bratigan, true words. | ||
| Trevharding |
I agree with Bratigan. Enjoy it but repsect it. Look after it and it will look after you. I think these bikes are the coolest around, and I will never change that viewpoint. | ||
| Bobbuell1961 |
i bought the 1st uly that came thu the doors knowing the resale sucked and i plan on running it in to the ground. i hopefully have a CR soon and i will have the same mindframe. in 30 yrs of street riding this has been the most enjoyable bike i've owned so resale be damed! | ||
| Swordsman |
I don't give a rats ass about resale. I didn't buy the bike as part of an investment portfolio. My ONLY concern about resale value is what the insurance is going to pay out should something happen and my bike get totaled. ~SM | ||
| Blackm2 |
"I didn't buy the bike as part of an investment portfolio" That's the truth, certainly not a new bike at least. If you want a Buell investment bike, RR1000, RR1200, RS's and RSS's are the ones you want. | ||
| 46champ |
The S2's could be added to that list. The important thing to remember for collector value is KEEP THE STOCK PARTS. You don't have to use them but when you get ready to sell they go with the bike. | ||
| Eicas |
Hopefully anyone who bought a Buell bought it because they wanted the bike to ride, not as an investment item. If you paid top dollar for your bike you probably thought it was worth it at the time, .... don't look back. Enjoy what you have. Sure you could have had a better deal if you could have seen into the future, and it was no secret that this economy is in the dumps, so this should not be a complete surprise, but most can not live their life trying to get the best deal since we are limited by time and resources. Same thing is now happening to cars, boats, airplanes, houses, college degrees, everything. Many people are taking a much harder hit, and they do not have a Buell to enjoy. Given enough time, the value of a Buell may come back, wish I had my old Norton Atlas and BSA Spitfire now. So hang on to your Buell, keep it stock, and enjoy it for maximum return. |
