| Author | Message | ||
     Jleblanc26 |
Today I was riding on hwy 90 between raceland la, and Houma, la. On my trip I was cruising at 65 and I reached up to clear my shield with my glove(slight rain)and I ran across a nice size dip with What appeared to a sketchy patch job. When I hit It the handle bar jerked soo hard it came out if my hand and and began to do what all two wheel riders fear, it felt as if the the grips of the handlebar was slapping the frame repeatedly from side to side. I thought I was going down. I grabbed the throttle grip and held on as tight as I could to stop the slapping, managed to keep her upright. I've felt the asphalt before hence the icon field vest I never leave home without, don't want to again. So a steering stabilizer will be getting put on soon! Dodged a hell of bullet there. | ||
| 09_1125r |
When in doubt, gas it out. That would have lightened the front end and stopped the perceived tank slapper. | ||
| 09_1125r |
So I reread this again... Damn you lost grip on the handle bars. Steering dampener definitely would've helped out. I remember how much of a difference it it was just dipping into turns between a gsxr1000 with stock dampener and a 900RR without. Good to hear you kept the rubber on the road. | ||
| Tyrroneous |
Please tell me you were relying on more than just an Icon vest for protection? That thing won't do jack accept keep your nipples from getting ground off. Oh yeah, back on subject. I agree that the best way out of a tank slapper is judicious application of throttle. | ||
| Drawkward |
Bad friendly advice, as Keith Code would say. | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
Im with Tyrr - that vest wont do anything. | ||
| Jdugger |
> Bad friendly advice, as Keith Code would say. Oh? Exclude the fact that if the rider were in a true tank slapper and not just a head shake there would be no way to add throttle without breaking his wrist, what would you do to get out of one? | ||
| Jleblanc26 |
It was a true tank slapper. Only thing I could do was grab the grip and push in the opposite direction till I could get my other hand on the opposite grip, she leveled out. I wasn't following any kind of advice, just trying to not bite it. Honestly, I lucked out. The field vest has helped me out before when a car pulled out in front of my 2001 R1, May it rest in pieces,lol. I soared for a good 20 feet and landed square on my back, EMT says it is the only reason I didn't have any kind of spinal injury. Even a little road rash on the spine is life changing. I didn't have my jacket due to this south Louisiana heat, Ill be the first to admit I should have. All is well. I will have it on next time. | ||
| Jleblanc26 |
I did add slight throttle when I grabbed the grip to maintain speed, you could feel the pull of the bike take the shake out of the wheel. Now tht you mention it. It was purely by accident. when pushing against the grip, I unintentionally twisted the throttle. Might have saved me from a really bad day. | ||
| Ccryder |
So because you had an asymetric load on the bars (one hand) and you hit a dip in the road, that is reason for a steering stabilizer? It wasn't the bikes fault the front end started slapping back and forth, it was yours. You actually would have been better off with no hands on the bars and let the forks do their job. Spend the money on the stabilizer if you want but, if the same scenario happens again, the outcome will be the same although maybe not as severe. Next time look down the road before you take your hand off the bars. Situational awareness is key in safe riding. TIme2Ride Neil S. | ||
| Jleblanc26 |
The steering stabilizer would have stopped the stopped the bars from going in the opposite direction. I wasn't leaning on the bars if that's what you mean. I sat up and cleared my shield, the dip caused it without a doubt. I guess it's one of those situations where you had to be there. You dont expect those things on a four lane highway. I wasn't at fault. So your telling me at cruising speeds you stare at the road the whole time? The stabilizer would have helped. This wasn't a discussion on who or what was fault, just stating what happened and what I think would have helped in that particular situation. I got home in one piece, and that's all that matters right now. | ||
| Drawkward |
JD: Adding power to a tank slapper, no matter how vigorous is not the safest way to get it to stop. In a tank slapper you're supposed to maintain speed or slow using rear brake, grip the bars enough so that your hands won't be thrown off the bars and use your arms and upper body to lightly dampen the shake, and I do mean lightly...as in barely. Do not grip it tight as that will transfer all that energy to the rest of the bike...and that's no good. Grip the tank with your knees and use your knees to absorb any bumps in the road. You want to be one with your bike and not make any inputs to it. Your bike will correct itself in a tank slapper without any real help...just watch videos of people falling off a motorcycle in a tank slapper and then about a second later the bike is still rolling down the road with no slapping. I don't know where the idea of doing a wheelie out of a tank slapper came from, but that just adds another unsafe motion to an already dangerous situation. Imagine wheelying out a tank slapper at an angle and not being able to hold the wheelie and coming back down at and angle...we're talking milliseconds here. Slamming on the gas is not the safest way to ride out alive. Also, something no one ever mentions when talking about tank slappers is that after you have recovered from one, pump your front brakes...chances are you upset the fluid in the caliper and will need to pressurize it. You don't want to save a tank slapper just to smash your bike into a car or wall. | ||
| Jdugger |
The key to getting out of a true tank slapper is to disrupt the mechanical feedback mechanism of road, tire, forks, bike, and weight that cause the oscillation of the front end. A wheelie/gas is the best way out, since it unloads the front completely allowing the rider to regain control. But in a truly violent tank slapper, it's unlikely any rider can get to the bars. Another way that might work is to lean hard into a turn, and add counter steering. Again, disrupting the mechanical feedback mechanism is what's key here. Dampers can help -- they work by essentially adding loss to the feedback loop, hopefully keeping from becoming self-sustaining. But, too often here dampers are seen as a solution for a rider problem, as in the case with the litany of threads declaring the bike's need for a damper because of what the front end does under hard throttle. And, that's why I like ccryder's comment. A damper might save this from happening again, but might make your day, when it does come, way, way worse because you haven't learned to provide right kind of input, or none at all as may be the case. So much of the time, the right answer is 'do nothing' -- the bike will sort itself. When do nothing isn't the answer, generally, 'roll on a little bit of gas' is. The 1125r in stock trim is a bit twitchy and 'talks' to the ride a fair bit -- it took me a lot of getting used to, honestly. On my track bike, I have a Penske with adjustable ride height. The suspension guy that set my bike up put the fork tubes with just 5mm showing above the top triple clamp, and then used ride height to compensate and keep the rake roughly the same. The result is a bike that has more cornering clearance, but is also MORE STABLE because of the extra trail, even as I feel like it handles better and "talks" a little less now. | ||
| Jdugger |
> the dip caused it without a doubt Then probably doing nothing would have also sorted the issue. As long as you have momentum, a bike's preference is to go straight and upright. | ||
| Jdugger |
> Adding power to a tank slapper, no matter how vigorous is not the safest way to get it to stop. Agree to disagree.  > grip the bars enough so that your hands won't be thrown off the bars Ok, that's NOT a tank slapper. I've gotten mine twisted up enough times to know when she gets squirmy, she wants some gas. (Message edited by jdugger on June 14, 2010) | ||
| Jleblanc26 |
My arm was shaking with the grip I didn't want to put too much pressure and throw it off. Every time it came to the right side ofthe bike, I pushed slightly. I can verify the caliper fact. Afterwards when I went to turn off the highway, I was taking the loop to go back under the highway and when I went to hit my front brakes they depressed all the way to the grip with no resistance, I used my back brake to slow down and pumped the front at the stop sign, it came back. I stopped at the gas station to make sure no lines was ruptured, all good. Almost went into the wall, two bullets dodged. | ||
| Jdugger |
> Also, something no one ever mentions when talking about tank slappers is that after you have recovered from one, > pump your front brakes...chances are you upset the fluid in the caliper and will need to pressurize it. > You don't want to save a tank slapper just to smash your bike into a car or wall. Huge +1 Buddy of mine recovered a tankslapper (gas, no less ) only to wad it in the very next corner when he got a handful of bar instead of brake! | ||
| Drawkward |
[quote]Agree to disagree. ; )[/quote] Agreed. Any chance you're going to TWS at all this weekend? (Message edited by drawkward on June 14, 2010) | ||
| Jules |
Buddy of mine recovered a tankslapper (gas, no less ; ) ) only to wad it in the very next corner when he got a handful of bar instead of brake! I can relate to that! My first ever track day nearly ended in tears as I had a bad crossup when the front wheel touched down coming over a rise (my fault obviously) and it took half of the front straight to get it corrected, I decided to call into the pits (to check my underwear) and almost took out 2 other bikes when I suddenly found a lot less braking than I expected! (Message edited by jules on June 14, 2010) | ||
| Jdugger |
> Any chance you're going to TWS at all this weekend? Nah, I'm doing the thing at Harris Hill in San Marcos. I've heard really good things about that track and the Elite Trackdays organization that runs it, and wanted to try it for a while. I'll be in Level 1, since they don't let anyone in the higher level until they select you to move up -- that will be very interesting for sure. You ever make it to ECR or Cresson? Those are close to home, and tend to be where I ride the most frequently. ECR in particular. | ||
| Stirz007 |
Let me think back a ways - on that stretch of road, you sure that wasn't a nutrea? They've given me the tank slap before.... | ||
| Drawkward |
Not yet. I decided to do TWS because Ridesmart was offering it at 50% off so I'll check it out in Level 1. I did however pick up a Ridesmart credit for 100 bucks that's good for any day so I may have to take a trip up to Cresson or ECR. I'll let you know if/when I do though. | ||
| Jdugger |
I've come way around on Ride Smart, but historically I would not have recommended them for a first track experience. To their credit, though, they have worked hard to not over sell the track, police the chaos much better than before, and generally run a more organized, more pleasant track day. The last two I attended at ECR with RS only had one crash each. I've seen Ride Smart days with nearly 30... yes 30 (!) crashes. Literally the crash truck would get more track time than anyone. TWS is a smokin' fast track. It makes my labia tinge just thinking about that place. | ||
| Jleblanc26 |
Stirz007- LOL. You never know whats gonna cross the road on that highway. Defenitely a faulty piece of wonderful south Louisiana highway. | ||
| Stirz007 |
John Errol - You got that right. My personal favorites for roadkill mecca of the world are LA 1, Hwy 71 (anything south of Rapides Parish) and US 190 (almost tagged a bobcat there). Glad to see you're still with the 1125. | ||
| Freight_dog |
JD: Adding power to a tank slapper, no matter how vigorous is not the safest way to get it to stop. In a tank slapper you're supposed to maintain speed or slow using rear brake, grip the bars enough so that your hands won't be thrown off the bars and use your arms and upper body to lightly dampen the shake, and I do mean lightly...as in barely. Do not grip it tight as that will transfer all that energy to the rest of the bike...and that's no good. Grip the tank with your knees and use your knees to absorb any bumps in the road. You want to be one with your bike and not make any inputs to it. Your bike will correct itself in a tank slapper without any real help...just watch videos of people falling off a motorcycle in a tank slapper and then about a second later the bike is still rolling down the road with no slapping. I am curious to know where you got this advice. A slapper is impossible without the front end loaded up. Unloading the front end removes one of the forces necessary for a slapper. The reason a bike stops slapping after a rider falls off isnt because it stopped the rider adding bad inputs, its because removing the rider removes the weight from the front end. Using even rear brake is going to increase the force on the front end and continue the slapper. I don't totally disagree with CCryders input, but even Kevin effing Schwantz gets the occasional slapper. Its not necessarily a function of poor technique, but of pushing the envelope of the bikes stability. Lets face it, Erik designs his bikes to be responsive and while they are surprisingly stable for the short wheelbase and steep rake, you must give up some stability for better maneuverability. There is a reason pretty much every other sportbike comes with a steering damper as standard, I would think the 1125 would have had one too if HD didn't insist on designing to a price point. (Message edited by Freight_dog on June 15, 2010) | ||
| Redduck124 |
I have a metal plate in my shoulder courtesy of a tank slapper on the racetrack on a bike that was equipped with a damper. Granted, it was the notorious TL1000R with the rotary rear shock, but the slapper happened under hard acceleration while leaned over coming out of a turn. I tried shifting my weight but the bars were ripped from my hands and I have no memory of what happened after that until I woke in the hospital. I don't even remember the expensive helicopter ride. My problem was bad suspension/chassis setup (my fault) and not riding technique. Just a little aside as to another factor in what could cause the problem. | ||
| Dbolemiss |
Got to love our roads down here,lol. | ||
| Jleblanc26 |
dbolemiss- i just came from your area, i work for a company out of the port of west st mary. lots of family over there. stirz007- haven't seen my middle name used in a while. i knew when i was in trouble when i was young on how my mom called my name. that usually meant trouble,lol. | ||
| Stirz007 |
Jleblanc - I grew up in your part of the world and you are right. The only time I heard my middle name was when my Mom was after me for something or other. I can't remember how many times I had to pick bugs (not those itty bitty's like they have outside the south) out of my face after a ride through south La. Had a big-azz beetle almost take me off the bike once - dead centered my head at about 70. |
