| Author | Message | ||
     Steeleagle |
I think you'll see a flurry of the "Screw Hero" recommendation. Your version will probably be the nicest way to put it. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Speaking of Hero has anyone seen them launching the new 270 cc bike that EBR designed? Should have been on the market this past summer. I'll bet their failure to get that to market cost them 5X what it would have cost to keep EBR in business. | ||
| Steeleagle |
I'll bet their failure to get that to market cost them 5X what it would have cost to keep EBR in business. We can only hope. | ||
| Steveford |
Intercourse Villain and the goat they rode in on. You just know those guys are going to pop up again. | ||
| Ratbuell |
I'd like to thank Bruce for speaking - beats the hell out of blind speculation! Good luck, sir - you seem to be a strong business guy, and you definitely appear to have the drive to make this happen. Hopefully this is a "bump in the road" as opposed to a "death knell"... I tell customers this all the time - my personal experience is, if the purchase process is a nightmare...ownership is going to be a breeze! That's the way it's always gone for me, and hopefully that's the case here as well  If there's anything a schmuck from Maryland can do to help out...let me know. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Someone did cover a piece of info from the court last month that appears to be related to the new info, although I didn't realize it at the time. This was posted in the EBR sub-forum last month. I bolded the key statement:
Link to original post: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show .cgi?tpc=713493&post=2513182#POST2513182 According to this, a court date is scheduled for December 14. Hopefully that hearing will approve and settle the outcome of the re-auction of December 10. Oh yea, hopefully Hero paid up for the assets they purchased, and at least that money has gone towards paying Polsky and company and the former employees. (Message edited by Hughlysses on November 15, 2015) | ||
| Oddball |
Just have to hope that villain or someone in their camp doesn't show on the 10th to outbid everyone and pick the carcass clean. | ||
| Hughlysses |
IIRC, both Villain and EBR are prohibited from bidding. | ||
| Court |
‘your eyes can deceive you, don’t trust them.’ | ||
| Oddball |
Hugh, Hence why i said someone in their camp. Not technically villain but an associate. Court, Use that on villain. "These are the plans your looking for" (motorcycle stick figure drawings by a 6 year old) | ||
| Office_buelly |
This isn't going to be a popular post, but it needs to be said. Instead of being pissed at Hero, people should be looking at them and taking notes. They might not have the engineering prowess that EBR has but those guys know how to run a business. EBR is responsible for the deal they signed with Hero, EBR is responsible for letting things unfold the way they did. Erik has always been a great engineer but less then ideal on the business side. Unfortunately the lessons that should have been learned during the Harley era weren't learnt otherwise we'd be talking about what new models are coming out for the spring instead of asking if any parts will be available for the bike I mistakenly bought. Can only hope that a real player ie Polaris/Can-am pick up the pieces that are left at this point. my 2cents. | ||
| Zac4mac |
I am a lot more at ease after what Bruce said. Hoping I read him right as a non smoke-blowing kinda guy. I know the "old Buell" is gone, but its legacy doesn't have to be. I flipped when I started riding my new 1125R 8 years ago... that girl scared me. Now I've seen almost 173 mph on a basically stock 2012 EBR and I'm giggling again. I'm not ready for this ride to be over, please. Z | ||
| 86bgn |
"but those guys know how to run a business" I don't see it.... That's how you run a business? Take what you need, then back out of the deal? That's not how to run a business, and that's not what Americans stood for years ago. Seems unethical and weak for HERO to not to follow through with what they promised. Chumps, not good business men | ||
| Classax |
Sorry but western minds often struggle with dealing with the eastern psyche in a number of areas one of which is business. There's a reason Honda left them. "Hero" now has a bevy of complaints against them for all sorts of issues ranging from commercial extortion to industrial espionage. All of them cropping up in the last two years since the departure of Honda. The reality in some parts of the world lying and corruption and infidelity are culturally, perfectly acceptably business practices when and where necessary. | ||
| Court |
When I was in the Marine Corps I was highly trained and well armed . . . . . but, I still wore a flak vest. | ||
| Buelliedan |
"The reality in some parts of the world lying and corruption and infidelity are culturally, perfectly acceptably business practices when and where necessary." This is unfortunately too true in Asian business practice. Nothing gets approved or built until the proper hands are greased which usually results in someone else getting screwed over as they look the other way. | ||
| 86bgn |
So how did they get away with this in America.... They owed money on work that was done, so how do they walk away with anything until the balance owed is paid? Sorry if this was covered somewhere already. | ||
| Budgolf |
I've stayed off the boards for a few months but the whole episode saddens me. I traded my 1125 in on an 1190 a while ago, and the company went tits up a month later. Which was the second time for me, since Buell shut down about a year after I bought the 1125. I wasn't saddened by the situation at the time though because the 1190 was so much better than the 1125. I didn't believe it would be, but it was. It really was. About 2 months later It was destroyed (along with my back) when an oncoming driver failed to yield. I hope and pray that things work out for Erik and Bruce and EBR. Because America needs EBR. And I wish the best for everyone here that is still involved, or still has skin in the game. I know that kind of money can keep you awake at night. My life on motorcycles isn't over, because I'm gonna live my life even if it kills me, but I imagine that Im done with sport bikes, just because of the riding posture. But either way, I don't have the energy to deal with my companies and warranties being pulled out from under me anymore. I'm a Soldier not a businessman, so I'm not passing judgement on anyone, especially Erik Buell. I just want to freakin ride. And it shouldn't be so hard to do. And to those looking to get their 1125 or 1190 serviced...go ahead and take it to a "custom shop" that will "give it a try". Don't cry when the improperly adjusted valves go shooting through your airbox or drop through a piston though. Get a manual and do your own work. I think that's what a Bueller ought to be doing anyway. | ||
| Hughlysses |
^ Here's my synopsis of the situation: From what I saw of letters sent out by the court, it boiled down to there wasn't iron-clad documentation to show that Hero hadn't paid for all the work that EBR did for them. Hero claimed they didn't owe EBR anything, while EBR claimed Hero owed them something like $20M. Hero finally agreed to pay $2.8M for the stuff that they said EBR "owed" them. The court said this settlement was in the best interest of all parties as otherwise it could have resulted in an extended, expensive legal battle during which time EBR couldn't be sold. | ||
| 86bgn |
"improperly adjusted valves go shooting through your airbox or drop through a piston though. Get a manual and do your own work." Not wanting a debate, but couldn't someone with a manual, and their own bike, do that too? I think I would still rather take it to a reputable shop, where someone might even have some factory training.... Just saying | ||
| Buelliedan |
Valve adjustments on the water cooled Buells/ EBRs is quite complicated and not something I would recommend someone with little mechanical experience try to do. Most shops,much less a guy in his garage, are not going to have the correct shims to do the job to begin with as these bikes use a very unique size. And yes if done wrong it can cause huge damage. | ||
| Budgolf |
Well, I did mine, and many others here have done the same. That's the way it is without factory support. My point is, it's not like it's an inline four. If I can't find a shop that speaks Buell, then I'd rather screw it up on my own then pay someone to screw it up for me. For a long time, this community right here has been all we've had as far as support. And it looks like that's all that will ever be. | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
"There's a reason Honda left them. "Hero" now has a bevy of complaints against them for all sorts of issues ranging from commercial extortion to industrial espionage" Maybe that's something that the "Fiercely Independent" EBR should have looked into before getting into bed with them. Little late now, but it's a shame that our beloved EB got mixed up in such an odd company. Maybe poster above was right about " Erik has always been a great engineer but less then ideal on the business side" Maybe. But hopefully this all gets ironed out sometime soon. | ||
| Classax |
I would suppose since "Villain" had until 10/6 to claim what they say was theirs, they be in the process of figuring out what is left to actually auction, and that upon achieving that have set a new auction date of 12/10/15. I think we were all shocked that Bruce was able to get it for under $3M although it will likely take three times that to resume operations(production), I wonder if anyone new will show up on the 12/10 with a wad of cash looking to score and even further gum up the murky path Bruce and his investors were trying to tread. I would hope Erik has been on the phones non stop with suppliers trying to salvage relationships in order to get going again when the dust finally settles. He may not have the cash to pay them, but he has a legitimate reason why, and it will take a miracle for a few of them to think of supporting anything with EBR or Buell associated with it. I find it interesting that just as people across the EBR customer and dealer base were starting to speak openly about the silence, that we learn the deal died on the closing table. While I love this forum, I think it would have done more for Erik's cause had we all learned about this through what remains of the dealer network instead of via a few forums and facebook. Not a criticism just an observation. | ||
| Ratbuell |
It appears that this is a fairly recent development, the null-and-void auction decision. I think we learned about it not long after the main players did... | ||
| Needs_o2 |
A little bit of new insight. http://www.jsonline.com/business/erik-buell-racing -motorcycle-company-deal-hits-a-roadblock-b9961675 4z1-350596331.html | ||
| Rsh |
Except for Bruce, It's sad that there were no other real bidders that thought an American sport bike company was worth investing in. Hard to get investors when you have a limited product line and previous sales were tepid at best. | ||
| Classax |
The Question is WHY were sales tepid. Let's set aside your "I never buy first year of anything buyers" The narrative and communication were not there. If the WSBK effort narrative had continued to stress the fact that they were racing the bike they sell and not a one off prototype with a graphic showing what they change vs the competition and cost the running order would have been more digestible to the public. If the Moto Mags who crowned the Panigale the second incarnation the previous year hadn't given bikes by their own accounts a dead heat tie in performance an "OK for a first try " reviews and the factory had hand picked a bike with out any niggles or spent time investing in real marketing. The bike they gave to the guy in Cal through Amsoil could have been sent to MotoMags to flog in test after test. Lot of what ifs were directly in EBR's control though a few key ones were not. Sales are the result of Marketing. EBR was piss poor at it. Anyone who owns a bike will tell you its not the bikes performance that's the problem its the way its presented. I'm wishing them all the best but I'm running out of stars to wish upon. | ||
| Ralph |
Take notes from Hero? Back in the eighties everybody talked about taking notes from the Japanese. Those notes got thrown away a long time ago. I doubt anything gleaned from Hero would last even that long. | ||
| Sprintst |
From this potential buyer's standpoint, I don't care about the racing side of things. I'll do some trackdays at some point, but I'm a street rider, and I feel most track performance isn't relevant to the street, and it's on highly tweaked racing machines anyway, which doesn't mean all that much to what you actually purchase. Now racing does improve the breed, but I would wager how a bike does in the magazine reviews means more than how it does in an untelevised racing series |
