| Author | Message | ||
     Wrightd223 |
Hey guys, first time posting here after weeks of checking out the forum a bunch and after finally buying a 2009 Buell Blast from a guy and getting her home. I have ridden the blast a couple of times, just around the city (Boston) to get used to the ride before I take it for my work commute outside of the city. I noticed on my last ride that the bike is "bucking" a bit in low speeds at first gear. It is like someone pulls the clutch in then dumps it after a second or so. All other gears are fine, but it does it in first after a stop sign or Sunday drivers taking in the sights on Harvard Ave.... I read on here that some people solved this problem with an oil change and adjusting the clutch. Is this changing the transmission oil, or just the motor oil checked with the dipstick? Also, to perform the clutch adjustment, do I need a bike stand or can this be done with the bike on the kickstand or possibly with a buddy supporting the bike? I don't want to open things up and have oil spray everywhere because the bike isn't tipping a certain way because it isn't on a stand. I have seen a bunch of youtube videos (thankfully the blast community is awesome about sharing these things) on the clutch adjustment, and how to change the motor oil, so I think I'm good to go with those, but I am not an experienced greaser yet as this is my first bike so I would really appreciate any help. Anyone have any tips or help for a first time biker who just dropped all of his cash on a bike and has limited work space living in Boston?? (Message edited by Wrightd223 on May 23, 2016) | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
First: oil change with filter is 1 1/2 quarts, period. Check only when hot and between the lines on the dipstick is about 8 ounces, not 1 quart. Your clutch problem should go away after warm or the first few starts from a stop. At 3300 miles a primary chain adjustment, full clutch adjustment, and trans fluid swapped with synthetic oil should be done. Engine oil won't chain the clutch function. 3300 miles is low mileage and the bike isn't even broken in yet-so, besides a fluid change and the clutch adjustments, it should NEED NOTHING. There are some things you should do-like change the slow/pilot jet to a #45-that will make starting and low speed running much nicer. DO NOT TAKE THE CARB APART to give it a good cleaning!!! If someone tells you to its because they have no idea what's wrong with your bike and it will very likely just add to any problems you might have. Spark plug should also be replaced, with a better one, mostly because the bike is 7 years old. They last about 10,000 miles-tops. Most of this is just maintenance because the bike is both new (mileage) and old (2009) and once done you can forget about it. The Blast is not high maintenance. You also don't say if it's bone stock or modified (in any way). Put a few miles on the bike first before you rip it apart. Let the old gas flush through and let the primary chain stretch out and keep an eye out for anything seeming troublesome. Lastly, after watching 1 or 2 of these "helpful" videos, I'm suspect to trust any of them  they aren't all bad, but they aren't all good either!! | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
And Welcome!! PS you are likely the best mechanic your Blast will ever have. I assume you have some mechanical aptitude?! | ||
| Wrightd223 |
Wow, thanks for all the help and the super quick response Gearheaderiko!!! My bike just hit 3330 miles yesterday while riding, and I just filled it up with gas right before all of this started happening, so maybe it was just the new gas working its way through the machine after the old gas. I put the high test gas in, as per my dads suggestion (long time Sportster owner, lotta fun!). Being in the city and still getting familiar with the bike and just getting back into riding after not riding for 2 to 3 years, I am only going for very short rides, aside from the 15 mile ride to bring it from the seller back to Boston. It would be great if the bike peps up after being driven a bit more. As for the maintenance you said that the bike should get at 3300 miles, I will ask the seller if any of that has been done. The kid and his dad didn't seem to involved with the bike so I doubt it. I'll comb through the forum for some more details on how to do what you suggested. Aside from some new blinker units I had to replace, a new headlight, and removing the wind screen (dorky lookin thing), the bike is completely stock. I am thinking I will ride it as is to get familiar with it before I start doing anything serious as you suggested. I ordered some clubman bars and bar end mirrors for it eventually, and hope to mod the exhaust (most likely by drilling as seen in this forum due to lack of cash) but aside from that haven't planned too many modifications yet. I just graduated with a degree in mechanical engineering, but that degree gives you an ocean of knowledge that is only an inch deep, so I have plenty of things to learn. Thanks again for the answers. Real quick, if I go to do the clutch adjustment, do I need to lift the bike with a rear wheel stand or drain the transmission oil or anything? | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
No lift needed. Frankly, I would do this stuff whether the previous owner says they did it or not. Were they the only owner?. The Blast shares a lot of Sportster parts, depending on how old the Sportster is. It is essentially a sportster engine minus one cylinder. Trans/primary takes exactly one quart. Drain it hot to get it all out, then throw in a quart. (Near the end of the drain, stand the bike straight up, then lean it the other way, to get it all out. Doesn't make a big difference, but I like it all gone!!) There is a cheater way to do it if you don't want to mess with the clutch cover! | ||
| Wrightd223 |
Awesome, thanks for the info! I am the third owner on the bike, but the guy I bought it from bought it for his dad to get him into riding which apparently he didn't take to so it mostly just sat around. As for the trans oil, does that take the same type of synthetic oil (20-50) as the motor, or what kind should be going in there? Thanks again for the help! Really looking to get this bike running well so I can enjoy it all summer and a bit into the New England fall before we get hammered by snow. Hopefully I can take it to the cape or the Maine coast for a nice ride. (Message edited by wrightd223 on May 24, 2016) | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Harley synthetic 20w-50 was good in the primary, but they might have a synthetic primary specific oil now (for a Sportster). I use Redline trans oil, but it's not easy to find. I can't remember anymore what other engine oil works, but it must be synthetic (if there is any doubt). | ||
| Wrightd223 |
Wow thanks so much for the help Gearheaderiko!! You're the man! I am posting in the new riders thread looking for some details on how to perform the primary chain adjustment and the other early mileage adjustments you recommended. I searched around for details on how to perform these things, but came up empty handed and felt that posting my questions there might not only help me, but other beginner blasters as well. If you have any links to old threads or videos or step by step walk throughs, I'm sure they will help new bikers in my position. Thanks again!! | ||
| Wrightd223 |
So today I had the day off from work. I took the left footpeg system off of the bike so I could access the clutch adjustment. Getting it off wasn't too bad, getting it back on however was terrible. I could get the 3 pegs to go into the holes, I could get the three pegs into the inner plate that is inside the bike, but it took FOREVER to get the three bolts into the side holes of the bike AND the plate that goes inside the bike... anyone have any tips on how they make this easier?? Anyways, I adjusted the clutch as I was instructed (manual, videos, this forum). At what point should the adjustment screww be backed off a quarter of a turn? Right when you start to feel some resistance when screwing (counterclockwise) the adjustment in, or right before you have to put a little strength in the fingers to keep screwing it in?? I was able to adjust the clutch, change the transmission oil, and attempted to adjust the primary chain. I think I need another wrench to do it properly. In the end, is the lock nut supposed to be tightened all the way up at the top of the screw into the bike?? After all of this, bike is working and what not, but now instead of clunking into first, it is a more extreme SNAP into gear. I don't think it sounds good. Do you think its that the clutch is too tight, or sound like more of a primary chain problem, and I should loosen the chain a bit?? Thanks, sorry for all the questions. I'm super new to all of this and really starting to not enjoy this bike too much ahaha..... | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Using long but for threaded rods makes it easier. But that's it (unless you want to take the battery out and disconnect the shock....). But you don't have to go all through that to changes the trans fluid-there is a much easier way. Yes the screw goes in until you just feel some resistance. I've done it dozens of times in the last 30 years and it never comes out the same!! Yes, the large 7/8" nut is a locknut/jam nut and goes tight against the case (just be careful not to overtightening. It is a very large nut for an easy to strip aluminum case. 2 wrenches is preferable. Not sure what you need. By "snap", but if it seems vicious, it probably is. Adjuster screw should have been 12-18 "flats" out-not 4 1/2 like the repair manual says. It's always going to be worse the first start if the day when cold, especially if the idle is high. But it doesn't sound good what you describe. Warmed up and ridden, the shift into first should be effortless and with out consequence. Once you get the primary chain Down and clutch adjustment, you won't have to worry about it for a very long time. It just has to be done on a low mileage, old bike. | ||
| Wrightd223 |
Cool, thanks for the info Gearheaderiko. I think I might not have left enough play in the clutch so any time I let the clutch out it was grabbing and lurching the bike. I will readjust the screw today after work hopefully and be very careful to stop turning it right when I begin to feel some resistance. I also bought some more wrenches and pliers, so now I should be able to adjust the primary as well. | ||
| Wrightd223 |
Soooo I adjusted the primary. Found it kinda difficult to here much difference in the noise the bike makes when you tighten or loosen the adjustment screw. I checked out some of the youtube videos which show both the box of rocks sound and the high whirrr if its too tight. I think I heard the box of rocks, and tightened until I didn't here that anymore, but its tough to hear over the rattle of the bike... I attached a pic of where its at now, can someone let me know if that looks to be in the right range? Took the bike for a quick five minute ride to see how it felt. The bike goes into gear much better, but it is still bucking on me in first gear. I don't think its the clutch, because even when the clutch lever is completely let out it happens. It sounds like something is slipping when I roll on the throttle and the bike doesn't accelerate. Then when I got back, the bike didnt want to go into neutral. After rocking it back and forth pulling the clutch, I got it to go into neutral. After turning off the bike, I tried to start it again and it didnt seem to want to start. I got it to go, but then as it was idling the bike slowly died. Any ideas on this new issue and if maybe it is connected to the first gear problems?  | ||
| Wrightd223 |
I am considering taking the bike to a shop and maybe just having them taking a look at the bike... I am getting a little overwhelmed with the it and feel like I am way over my head with this. Anyone have any ideas how much money inspecting the bike might cost me at a shop? If it is something like the dogs are worn down or something, I have no idea how I would check that type of thing out, so the best thing to do might be just having a shop check it out and shove more money into this bike..... | ||
| Kenny_gilgore |
Your primary adjuster bolt looks too tight to me. The space in my Blast is about 7/16". The factory spacer was 3/8" IIRC and no one has ever had any trouble with the spacer in place. If I were you I would wait to see what Erik or Ed say after they look at your picture. Kenny G | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
3/8" between nut and bolt head would say you are close (6/16" - 7/16" close enough). But being that you have a new problem since adjusting tells me its too tight. Back off one half turn. Until you go in and do the "shifter pawl adjustment", you're likely to continue to have the first gear slip and clunk. Usually it only happens with the first cold start of the day or so. Generally it goes away after that. Yes, you could have internal damage-which isn't worth fixing. Learn to expect it and it will seem like nothing. Sounds lame, but I've had your problem for years (only on one of my Blasts). Proper clutch and chain adjustment, the correct amount of synthetic fluid and the problem is near non-existent. Never ever put more than one quart in the trans/primary. DO NOT take it somewhere. If you've gotten this far on your own, you are more qualified than 99.9% of the people you would take it too. Only if they say "I WORK and have WORKED on Blasts" is the only way I'd say to take it to someone. IT IS NOT the same as a Sportster or twin Buell or Harley. Most horror stories are from people who took it to the dealer or some other "qualified" shop. I'm not kidding and it is sad and discouraging to say it. The Blast is very simple and most wont take the time to learn about it. Notes: Premium fuel? 20w-50 oil? Oil not overfilled? You are better with the "box of rocks" than too tight. (make small adjustments). | ||
| Wrightd223 |
Thanks for the input Kenny_gilgore and the continued help Gearheaderiko!! I will take a look at the spacing measurement tomorrow with some calipers and see if it falls close to that range. I was hoping there was some general range that it should fall in, that way I could check to make sure I wasn't wayyyy off. I haven't even heard of doing a shifter paw adjustment until just now, so that is something that I definitely never even considered. If this is out of adjustment it could lead to this bucking/possible slipping?? I found this writeup (http://buellridersonline.com/forum/showthread.php? t=6827) a guy did and he has a youtube video of adjusting it as well. Sure looks intimidating ahaha. I'm assuming you will need to drain your transmission fluid before doing this correct? Gearheaderiko, I haven't ridden the bike much more than 10 minutes in city suburban traffic since I have tried to solve this problem, so not sure if it goes away after a bit of riding for the day. I have been scared that any riding will make things worse... I have heard that the blast only gets better and smoother the more it is ridden, but I want to make sure the bike can handle it before I really lay into it, so I have been babying it a bit. -I filled up the tank with premium fuel once since I got the bike, thinking some new gas running through the bike would do it some good. Any comments on some fuel additive that might be benificial to run through the first tank of gas, because I'm not sure how much the last owner rode the bike. -Yes 20-50 mobile 1 oil has been used for both the motor oil and the primary oil -I did look when I turned the bike off the other day and it did look like the oil was overfilled a bit. Took some out with a turkey baster, but will confirm again after letting it warm up before I test ride it again. I was probably a bit too impatient with letting the bike warm up before refilling it. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
1.5 quarts is what it takes after oil and filter change. 1.75 qts will be at maximum oil capacity. 2 quarts will be over full. So if you put more than 1.5qts in, it's probably overfilled. The manual says 2.25 qts oil capacity and you will only get to that if you drain the crankcase too (which is not advisable). Your primary looks close, so I'd back the adjuster bolt off a half turn. I mark mine with a sharpie or knife so I can tell a full rotation (it's much easier than trying to keep a running count). | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
1.5 quarts is what it takes after oil and filter change. 1.75 qts will be at maximum oil capacity. 2 quarts will be over full. So if you put more than 1.5qts in, it's probably overfilled. The manual says 2.25 qts oil capacity and you will only get to that if you drain the crankcase too (which is not advisable). Your primary looks close, so I'd back the adjuster bolt off a half turn. I mark mine with a sharpie or knife so I can tell a full rotation (it's much easier than trying to keep a running count). You can run "seafoam" through the tank, but that's it. IMPORTANT: DO NOT take the carb apart "to give it a good cleaning". This is rarely ever needed and often leads to more problems. But undoubtedly someone is going to tell you to do this, if they haven't already. (It's because they have no idea what's wrong and they hope it fixes your problem). In case I haven't said this yet !!! | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
You'll also have to refresh me on exactly what your current problems are. I've got too many bikes in my head that I'm trying to help people with and im losing track of progress  | ||
| Wrightd223 |
When I got the bike, I rode it back (about a 17 mile ride, mostly highway) without a problem. Took the bike out again, and filled it up with gas (premium). It was s real short ride, maybe 3 miles city traffic, so never really moved passed second or third gear. Bike seemed fine on the way to my destination, where I stayed for a couple of hours. on the way back, the bike started "bucking" in first gear. It felt like after rolling on the throttle, someone had grabbed the clutch, then after half a second would dump it lurching me forward if I didn't back off the throttle, then would repeat immediately after lurching me forward. This only happened in first gear usually after a red light or traffic stopped, so typically only at the low/medium rpms. After this, I hit the internet and read that some people smoothed out their ride with a clutch adjustment and primary adjustment. Seeing as I didn't know the last time the kid before me changed the oil, I also decided to change the oil, new filter, drained the transmission oil and refilled after adjusting the clutch. After all of this, I rode up and down the driveway, and the bike would snap into first gear once I rolled the throttle a bit, but a quick second adjustment of the clutch seems to have fixed that. After adjusting the primary chain the other day I took the bike out to test the ride, and it went into first much better, but still had the bucking problem. Also, now I could hear a clicking, maybe like gears slipping or something?? Anytime the bike would catch the throttle the clicking stopped, but whenever it felt like someone was grabbing the clutch the bike would click. Upon parking the bike, I did check the oil and it looked to be a little high, so I turkey basted some out so it now looks to be within the proper range. So that is the history of the issue. Hoping that because the problem got audible and slightly worse after the primary adjustment, maybe loosing the screw back a bit will help solve the problem and smooth out the bike. All of my rides since bringing the bike to my place have been really short, because I am scared of damaging the bike. Do you think I should take it for a longer ride and see if it works the bike in a bit and makes it better, or does it sound like something wrong with the first gear and something that will do damage to the gear or the belt if I ride it? What about the shifter paw adjustment. That looks to be a complex job accessing that area of the bike, but do you think that would be worth trying to do?? Thanks again for the help Gearhead, I would probably have given up at this point if not for your help! | ||
| Wrightd223 |
I will measure the gap in the primary adjustment screw today, and maybe pick up some seafoam for the gas tank soon as well. I also plan on double checking the oil level to make sure it still isn't too high. | ||
| Wrightd223 |
So took a look last night, and the adjuster bolt was spaced about 1/2" from the lock nut. i loosened it up to where it is around 6/16" and will see if that is good or if I should go more, making small adjustments as you said. Didn't get a chance to test it out, seeing as I work kinda late and dont like the start the bike up after dark because of my neighbors new baby. Can someone explain a little bit more about a shifter paw adjustment? At what mileage should this be done, or is this something that only needs to be done if a certain problem arises? From the videos it looks like it mainly affects how the bike locates the gears and would help if the bike gets stuck in certain gears (hopefully in my case that was only because my primary chain was too tight, as it only happened once I tightened that). | ||
| Wrightd223 |
A quick note I thought to mention on here while talking with my daddo, when I drained the primary oil I didn't see much for loose metal shavings attached to the magnetized end of the plug. I've heard that some loose metal shavings on the tip of the plug is normal and totally fine, so that should be an indication that my gear isn't/wasn't grinding down causing a slippage right??? | ||
| Wrightd223 |
Finally got a chance to ride the bike a bit today. Still a bit of chain chatter or slippage in first gear, middle to low rpms and especially after slowing down stopping at a light. Oil level looked perfect after the ride, so looks like taking a bit out worked out nicely. This issued DID however get a bit better the more I rode it, and didn't seem to occur later on, or if it was it was way more mild. The bike did feel like it wasn't as torquey as I have read to expect the Blast to be. After leaving a stop sign or a light, I can take off in first gear no problem, but after middle rpms it feels like the bike just won't reach its ceiling. Even if I try and really take off from a stop, the bike will go go go, but never really taps into that upper range of first gear, even though it sounds like I give it more throttle and more rpms. Anyone have any insight on what a pretty much stock Blast can do from a dead stop? | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
1st: really unclear about your primary measurement. 1/2" to 6/16" doesn't make any sense. It didn't look like 1/2" and if you tightened up beyond the picture, you are too tight. It should do 32mph in first gear. If it "just won't get there" your chain is likely too tight. Your "clutch slippage" sounds common, as I've said. Ride it and expect it too happen. As you've found out it seems to go away the longer the ride. If you are actually having a slipping clutch, then you've probably done all the damage youre going to do. A slipping clutch doesn't usually bang or clunk into gear. You generally hear the engine slow down to catch up with the trans or the bike speed up to catch up with the engine. If the clutch is slipping, it doesn't have enough friction to clunk or grab. Do you have a manual? Do you have clutch free play at the clutch lever? | ||
| Jetlee |
If the clutch is slipping, adjust the engagement at the ramp. This is the center screw when you remove the small cover on the primary. If it's whining or rattling, adjust your primary tension. My method is to get the engine warm, then loosen the lock nut a lot. Use your bare fingers carefully; loosen the bolt until you hear clatter, then carefully tighten the bolt until you feel it vibrating as if there's constant pressure from the tensioner shoe. It's a distinct feeling, you'll know it. Continue tightening until the clatter just barely goes away. Tighten the lock nut. Distance measurement on the tensioner bolt isn't reliable in my opinion (Sorry ErikO) because you can have almost 3/8" worth of wear in the shoe alone. | ||
| Wrightd223 |
Sorry for the confusion. You are correct originally the space was not measured at 1/2" but rather more likely at 1/4" (4/16"), which I then loosened to about 6/16". From the sound of my speed problem I might even loosen it up a bit more. Not sure if I was able to get up to 32 mph as my speedo is having some trouble (checked the error codes and it reports a speedometer power over voltage) so I wasn't able to see how fast I was going. Jetlee, thanks for posting on my question on the speedo thread. I will try to probe it with a multimeter somewhere to find out what the reading is. Jetlee, I agree with you that a measurement of the distance between tensioner bolt and the head of the screw isn't super reliable and I'm sure ErikO would agree. I just wanted to check to see if I was anywhere near the right range, and seems I was definitely still too tight, and might still be. I was having trouble using the sound method over the rattle of the bike. I have been using the manual links posted here and elsewhere. Looking at my clutch, it looked like I had plenty of free play, but I might let even more out, as switching from gear to gear is a little rougher than I would expect. I think maybe loosening up the play may help the clutch fully engage?? Jetlee, I have done the clutch adjustment taking the cover off and playing with that spring bolt lock twice, but I might just keep making it a little bit tight. I don't think its a clutch slipping as much as it feels more like the teeth on my first gear are worn down and might not be grabbing the chain all the time and it feels like it's just spinning then catching, spinning then catching. This all happens without even touching the clutch lever. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Just to clarify, the chain isn't slipping. The dogs on the gears aren't fully engaging and that is what's probably causing your "slip". A shifter pawl adjustment would probably help. Proper clutch adjustment certainly helps, but giving more free play in the clutch won't. That will make it crunch more. There are certainly other things that can go wrong, but we focus on the most common causes on the Blast. The "slip" is common and I've personally experienced it and it's exactly as you describe. You turn the little screw until you just feel resistance. Not tight, just the beginning of resistance. I don't think in thirty years I've ever had it come out the same way twice! When it's perfect, you know it (but don't expect it to be)!! If in doubt, read over the instructions and make sure you haven't mis-read. Once you get the clutch, chain and cable adjusted right, you won't have to worry about it for a very long time (unless you're abusive-slipping the clutch, burnouts, wheelies, etc.- you can ride it hard though). | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
I didn't say it was reliable, I said it was an indicator. Most Blasts without issues will run at about 3/8". That's only an indicator if your adjustment is close and within the norm. I, in no way, meant it was a substitute for adjustment or should be adjusted to that measurement. If the adjustment isn't at about 3/8", then why? Too loose? Too tight? Busted or worn shoe? High mileage or abused chain? Spacer still there? 24 ft lbs instead of 24 inch lbs? So, if some how people are getting the idea that this is a valid adjustment, please correct them. It is ONLY an indicator. FWIW: for you, me, EZ, etc. the "by ear" method is a no brainer. For those who are new or haven't had the practice or haven't been through this over and over like we have, "by ear" may not simply not that easy. They need a base to start from. Adjusting per the manual, 12-20 flats out (instead of 4.5-7) is a good reference point that they can always go back too, if they are in doubt or just cant hear it. At some point you have to assume people have done the work. You then have to try and diagnose from there whether they did the work right. Unless I can find a valid reason, I can't tell someone to go over and do the same procedure again and again. They'll just sell their bike, because a bike that needs that much work isn't worth it. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
"I've been adjusting Sportster chains and clutches since before you were born"! Oh Crap, I'M OLD. When did THAT happen!  |
