| Author | Message | ||
     Rwven |
BRAN has been printed out and residing in a side pocket of my saddlebag liners for some time now. | ||
| Buelet |
I felt the "notchyness" in my rear bearings (don't remember now which side it was) at my last rear tire change at around 22 or 23K miles. I had read the posts about removing the outer seals... so I figured, what the heck. I picked the outer seal out and discovered that the grease was fairly brown and "gunky". I decided to clean all of the old grease out and clean it all up, which I did. Once I had carb cleaned, spun, and air-hosed the heck out of it, the bearing "looked" ok. And it spun relatively freely and smoothly again, so I used a grease gun and shot new grease in between all of the balls, spun it around, and added more grease until I was satisfied that it was sufficiently re-packed. ...That was between 2-3K miles ago and all is still well. (I bought a new set of bearings while I was at the dealership getting the new tire put on, but decided to hang on to them and see how long my fix would hold out. (I kind of like getting all of the good out of things... maybe to the point of a flaw sometimes, but that's just me!) YMMV!  | ||
| Ourdee |
I just thought about this today: Sometimes it takes a few days for my mind to put events together. Here it is, I park my bike in the garage by pushing it in reverse to it's spot. I remember hearing sounds that I attributed to the belt. When it was new and I pushed it back into the garage the belt made sounds. Just before the bearings went out it had started making noise when I pushed it into it's spot. I just thought at the time it was the belt. Tonight I backed it into the garage and noticed there was no noise. Why did I not put 2 and 2 together and pay attention to the fact I had a new sound starting? | ||
| Ourdee |
Etennuly, I too knew to stop because of badweb warning. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Buelet, There is probably nothing worse than removing the grease and then spinning the grease-free bearing with compressed air. You probably galled the balls since spinning them dry with compressed air is analogous to piston rings running without the benefit of oil. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
I removed my back wheel yesterday to inspect and grease the bearings. I first had to clean off the Permetex anti-seize and contrary to the photos way above this post which shows rust all over the bearing, my Uly's bearings were pristine. I finger pushed more hi-temp grease into the bearings, pushed back into place the seals, coated them with anti-seize and torqued everything back together per the service manual. One other thing, the axle was in perfect shape too because it was slathered with Permetex. Everything comes apart easy and absolutely no corrosion. Also, I never clean out the old discolored grease, I just push in new on top of old, as much as possible and then push the seal back into place. No bearing failures in 19,000 miles. | ||
| Buelet |
Electraglider_1997, thanks for the well-meant advice and comments. I also thank you for my first hearty laugh of the day!  While definitely not a service manual procedure, I think you read into what I said I did a little. I only said that I picked the seal out, not removed the bearing. Now picture this (insert humor): I picked the seal out, thoroughly "carb cleanered" the grease away the best I could, and then stuffed my two strongest fingers into the bearing and raised the entire tire / wheel / bearing assy up at a right angle to my body. I then grabbed my super-air 2000 (w/ my best Tim Allen grunts) and proceeded to spin the bearings up to around 20,000 RPM or so, making sure I had removed all traces of oil / carb cleaner.  I hate to disappoint, but that ISN'T what happened. heh heh My cleaning all took place with the tire/wheel assy w/ bearing laying on my garage floor. No bearings were spun with compressed air. I only covered the bearing with an old rag while I blew the grease / carb cleaner mess out of the bearing and repeated until it was clean and grease free again. After that, I used the grease gun to pump grease back into all of the voids. After the initial re-greasing, I turned the bearing with my fingers to distribute the grease and added a little more just to make sure. (Side-note: I did add too much grease apparently, because after the first decent ride after that, the extra grease had made it past the seal and ended up on my previously clean & shiny wheel.) Also: No bearing failures in almost 26,000 miles. Best wishes to everyone for a happy & safe 4th of July!  | ||
| Buelet |
+1 what EG says about the anti-seize & re-torqueing! I always use lots and make sure I coat the entire axle upon re-assembly. Never had a problem with removal, and always re-torque per the manual! | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Buelet, If you put the never seize coating on the outside of the bearing then it would have held in the grease. I stuff my bearings with as much grease as I can. When I reapply the seal the excess squeezes out and I wipe it off completely with a rag and then coat with the anti-seize. That anti-seize stays put and apparently keeps heated up grease from leaking out and for sure keeps water from leaking into the bearing. I've never seen any moisture in my bearings or on the axle. | ||
| Buelet |
Thanks EG, I'll have to try the anti-seize on the outside of the bearing too! Too late for the repack to see if it holds the grease in better, but next time - if my bearings make it to the next tire change! | ||
| Tiberius |
Well, I just put another rear tire on and decided to check under the seals to see what all the hububb was about. Turns out that the disc side bearing was full of red, rust filled grease... still rotated smoothly, but obviously on the way out. My local Buell dealer had to order the part, so I just picked up a pair of 60062RS style bearings from a local bearing supplier. They turned out to be NSK's and the box was had a label "1107 USA". There was no "made in" mark anywhere, so I assume they were either made in Japan or the USA. When I pulled the old bearings, using a 30mm blind bearing puller & slide hammer, I found lots of rust in the bearing seat and a whole mess of water in the wheel interior....disappointing. Anyway, I stuck the new bearing in the freezer and used a heat gun to warm up the wheel a bit. I then used an old bearing and a small hammer to tap them into place. I coated the entire bearing seat & pocket with Anti-seize. It was a lot slower and more difficult to tap in the new ones than it was to pull the old ones. The whole process was less than an hour though. I have a hydraulic shop press, but my wheel won't fit in it with the tire mounted and I made the mistake of having the tire mounted before I did the bearing check....timing.. My bike is a Canadian spec '08 with about 12k miles and I have ridden it in the rain. Most recently I took a 4300 mile trip to Florida via the Dragon last month and the first day had quite a storm. | ||
| Scodill |
I hope it's kosher, but "Tiberius" is dead....changed my user name to align with other moto forums. So below is my bearing story Well, I just put another rear tire on and decided to check under the seals to see what all the hububb was about. Turns out that the disc side bearing was full of red, rust filled grease... still rotated smoothly, but obviously on the way out. My local Buell dealer had to order the part, so I just picked up a pair of 60062RS style bearings from a local bearing supplier. They turned out to be NSK's and the box was had a label "1107 USA". There was no "made in" mark anywhere, so I assume they were either made in Japan or the USA. When I pulled the old bearings, using a 30mm blind bearing puller & slide hammer, I found lots of rust in the bearing seat and a whole mess of water in the wheel interior....disappointing. Anyway, I stuck the new bearing in the freezer and used a heat gun to warm up the wheel a bit. I then used an old bearing and a small hammer to tap them into place. I coated the entire bearing seat & pocket with Anti-seize. It was a lot slower and more difficult to tap in the new ones than it was to pull the old ones. The whole process was less than an hour though. I have a hydraulic shop press, but my wheel won't fit in it with the tire mounted and I made the mistake of having the tire mounted before I did the bearing check....timing.. My bike is a Canadian spec '08 with about 12k miles and I have ridden it in the rain. Most recently I took a 4300 mile trip to Florida via the Dragon last month and the first day had quite a storm. | ||
| Rwven |
Another data point..11075 miles, '08 XT, Date stamped on rear axle 01/10/2008, Orange seals, No water crossings, ridden in rain about 4000+ of those 11000 miles. I decided to not heed my own advice about not stressing about the rear wheel bearings. I pulled the wheel today when I got home from work. It was rather difficult to get the bearings to turn unless I jammed two fingers tightly into the inner race. Turning slowly they felt notchy, turned faster kind of gravely. Not good. I popped the seal on the rotor side. grease was kind of brownish and clumpy looking. I cleaned out what I could with a rag and packed some clean grease in. Turned the bearings until the clean grease turned brownish, wiped it out, lather-rinse-repeat several times. Still felt rough but I pressed the seal back in and tackled the pulley side. The grease on the pulley side looked like a mixture of grease and fine powdered sand. Bearing had a lot of very clean looking water drops in it. I tried the grease exchange method like the other side. No good, wouldn't smooth out. I pressed the seal back in and a big drop of water oozed out that must have been trapped behind the ball cage. I called my local (near work) M/C mechanic (I buy all my tires from him) and made an appointment to have the bearings replaced tomorrow. He has a blind bearing puller and I am going to copy the page on rear bearing replacement from my shop manual to give him for reference. I had a set of new SKF bearings so there will be no trouble with getting parts. I don't think I'll post my thoughts about this right now. I'm not exactly disposed to be kind at the moment... (Message edited by rwven on July 07, 2009) | ||
| Court |
>>>I'm not exactly disposed to be kind at the moment... Understandable. When time and time dictate, please share. | ||
| Arkaybee |
You're pulley was on backwards. That's what my non-denomintional (not factory trained) mechanic greeted me with when I went in to check on the tire/bearing/belt replacement process. The lip was on the outside, as were the directional arrows cast into the pulley. I confirmed this through photos in this thread. Having a hard time imagining it having been done other than at the factory as no dealer has changed the tires and neither I nor any tech at the 1,5 and 10k noticed it. Will post the bearing report when I receive it tomorrow. The bearings were not happy either, so they were replaced. Will have a more in-depth conversation with him tomorrow when I pick up the bike}} | ||
| Snub13 |
Ok, I need someone (or all of you) to talk me off of the ledge that I'm now standing on!!!!!!!!!!! Some history; I have a 2006 black (faster) Uly with a race kit. I purchased the bike in Oct. of 2005. I have 20,753 miles on (as of yesterday) In 2006 my wife and I were in Jersey (we met Erik, Court, the guys from Queensryche...you know, a great trip!) until our bearings went way south (rotor side) and we had to rent a U-Haul to get home. We had a fantastic experience with Buell / H-D and how they took care of our problem. In 2007 we flew to Alaska and rented a Uly (2006, black) from Alaska Rider Tours. Went to the Arctic Circle (see profile pic) and had the trip of our lives. Truly, this is a MUST do trip, you have NEVER seen scenery like this. Seven days into our fifteen day trip the rotor side bearing seal started to pop out and grease was coming out. We called AK Tours and they swapped out the Uly with a 600cc V-Strom (the only bike they had left and a very poor substitute!). When we returned to drop off the V-Strom, they told us "it's a good thing you noticed that, when we took the wheel off all of the bearings fell out and rolled around on the floor, you saved us a good bit of money" Fast forward - Yesterday I dropped of my bike at the shop to have a new rear tire (owner supplied) mounted in preparation for a trip to Skyline Drive and the Blue Ridge Parkway. We leave no later than 07:00 Friday (7/10), reservations made, course plotted on a map and programed into the GPS, Ipod charged and ready, the whole nine yards. I called the dealer this afternoon to arrange pick-up and was greeted with "when we took off the wheel the bearings fell out of the races. You need a new wheel, we can get you one in seven to ten days.....oh, and the cost for the wheel is around $400. Do you want us to order you a wheel or not, we can't order anything until you give us the go ahead. So, now you all know why I'm teetering on the ledge.... What has held me to just teetering so far is; I LOVE that the guy whose name is on the tank (ok, air cleaner cover) is so approachable and will talk to anyone and is a genuine nice guy. Try that with anyone from Japan or Germany or anywhere else! I LOVE the feel of this bike! I LOVE the sound of this bike! I LOVE that this bike is American made! I LOVE that nobody else has ever heard of Buell! I LOVE that there is this fantastic Buell community out there! I LOVE THIS BIKE! BUT; I CANNOT continue to wring my hands about these stinking bearings every time I go more than twenty miles from home! This is the second (and a half) trip that has been shat upon because of bearings. Really, I'm pissed!!!! I know that there are going to be problems with anything you buy. Machines break, I get it. But this is driving me bonkers. From the looks of things (five pages on this thread alone) I'm not the only one going nuts over this. I don't know what the hell to do! As noted I love this bike. In addition to that, I can't afford to buy a new bike, not to mention that I don't have any idea what I would buy if I could and (this is a big one) I don't WANT another bike. on the other hand, I can't afford to pay for a bike that collects dust in my garage because I don't have the confidence that it will make it home! So, I ask once more.....what the hell do I do now? We are still going on the trip, that's a no brainer. At least the wifes car is a convertible, but I have a feeling that the Tail of the Dragon isn't going to be the same. yes, the new wheel is being ordered. I didn't tell the service dept. but I hope they order new bearings at the same time...might as well get a new spacer too. I need someone to either push me really hard or pull me back into the collective! Sorry for the rant.......HELP! Tim | ||
| Ourdee |
Tim, There is too much love too leave. If I had a wife that burnt my food regularly, I would have extra food on hand. Get 2 wheels. Keep one at 100% ready on the shelf all the time with new bearings in it. Put it and a new belt on just prior to any long trip. Have the other wheel set up 100% and put on the shelf for the next long trip. Carry the used belt as a spare. You can't leave us now. | ||
| Rwven |
Tim, I feel your pain. It's past time for the factory to do something about this. I had my bearings replaced today ($25.00 for the labor, obviously not at the Harley shop...). My mechanic told me the hub had a lot of water in it. The hub side of the bearing races were rusted to crap. There is rust and water inside the bearings. It's time to redesign and recall these wheels or at the very least modify (by Buell with their blessing) them not to hold water. I'm heading down to the Dragon next week. I am so glad I decided to check the bearings out yesterday. (Message edited by rwven on July 08, 2009) | ||
| Someday |
I'm wondering, is the water on the inside of the hub from condensation? I find it hard to believe it's getting past 2 rubber seals on each bearing. Although if people are popping the outer seal and finding water droplets in the grease I guess it could happen. Thoughts? | ||
| Court |
Tim: Send me the name of the dealer who has your bike. Court | ||
| Rwven |
 "contact your authorized Buell dealer" | ||
| Hughlysses |
This thread makes it appear we're having another rash of rear wheel bearing failures. The $40 question is "Are any of these the new black seal bearings made by KBC?" If not, MAYBE Buell has fixed the problem. Get the new bearings and hopefully your bike is good to go for a reasonable amount of time. | ||
| Rwven |
How long have the new bearings been in service? My bike is an '08 that I've had a little over a year. It was built after 01/10/2008 (the date stamped on the rear axle). Is it too early to tell if the new bearings solved anything? | ||
| Crusty |
Don; I had half a cup of water in my rear hub when my bearings died, and I never messed with the seals or screwed with the bearings in any way at all. I'm wondering if the water could have found a path along the axle and through a gap between the spacer and inner race. My bike sat parked in the rain all day long at work for many days, so there was ample opportunity for water to find its way into the rear hub. Rwven; the original bearing problem surfaced pretty early in 2006 on some bikes. The black bearings have been out for nearly a year with no reported failures. I'd say that the chances are that the new bearing will cure the problem. | ||
| Scodill |
It's the frickin' water in the wheel that pisses me off. Frankly, I haven't figured out the cause, but it seems to be common. That's a lot of water to get through the bearing..... | ||
| Rwven |
I've got "black" bearings in mine now, but they are SKF's. I'll be running a little test of my own... | ||
| Dynasport |
Sorry for my ignorance, but is this a problem only with the Uly or does it happen on other XBs as well? Is the only difference in the Uly and the other XBs the wheel? I am just trying to understand what is going on here. Sorry if this has been fully discussed already, I have only been casually following this issue and could have missed this information. | ||
| Ourdee |
 "contact your authorized Buell dealer" | ||
| Motorfish |
Snub, I recently had a "U-haul" incident myself. I feel your pain $$. Tomorrow will be 2 weeks since I ordered my bearings from the dealer. I will call and find out what the story is. I have not rode in weeks of prime riding season. | ||
| Xbimmer |
Snub13... weren't you the guy a couple years ago posted about this , with the pics of the trashed races and all? No doubt you'd be disenchanted, what with two failures on your own bike and also a rental. I'd dig deep with BMC on this, multiple failures on the same wheel...? Please someone PLEASE from BMC, convince us out here that the problem is solved with $16 Korean KBC bearings with facts, not PR statements. That the problem is because of the NTN's and WHY, and NOT the wheel and/or spacer design/ manufacture/construction/assembly. I can't really complain because my original bearings made it past 50K and I replaced them with the factory KBC's, but somethin' still ain't right with bikes with early mileage and/or repeat failures. |
