| Author | Message | ||
     Midknyte |
I have an idea for fixing our belts on the road well enough "to get us home". It only requires knowledge (of the glue in question - read on) and a donor belt (something it seems would not be a problem to find around here  ). Ok, I'm putting 1 + 1 together here. Simple stuff. Back at the cycle show in Rosemont Chicago this past spring (and every spring for that matter) a vendor had a two part glue system (glue plus activator?) - honestly I did not pay large attention to it because at the time I had no personal application for it. It was an instant super duper mega glue for bonding rubber to rubber - for on the road repairs. Someone here "must" know about this product... That it works is not up to debate - I saw it demonstrated in person. Part two of this equation is a piece of donor belt (red in the attached drawing) where it is cut clean and a tooth or two at each end has been ground down flat. This piece of belt should be several inches long - long enough to wrap around the front pulley so that the ends of it are not both on the front pulley at the same time (i.e. the front of it has traveled over and past the pulley by the time the other end of it comes to the pulley). This piece of belt would not end up being "too large to carry..." The last piece of this puzzle is a pair of tin snips. More than you'd want to carry with you on the road - but something that could be gotten ahold of with no large effort. Step one - Break your belt. D@mn! Step two - Cut one end of your belt cleanly at a tooth end if it shredded diagonally. Do the same for the other end of it at a point determined by steps that follow. Step three - Bond your repair belt strip to one end of the broken belt. To align things up as best as possible, hold your broken and extra repair belt piece over/onto the rear pulley as you do this. Step four - Determine how far back to cleanly cut the other end of your broken belt to meet up with the other end of your repair piece. Bond it in the same fashion. Now this is not going to be strong enough to ride hard or race back. They're be a little slack and chatter. But it ought to get one home or to the nearest shop... Someone here has to have the knowledge of the glue and someone has to have a belt. The idea is yours, gratis. Just please return the favor by giving me the first kit free?  | ||
| Firebolt020283 |
ive seen that glue on tv and at different events; and if it is as good as they say it might work for that porpus but im like you i dont know that the glue in question is really as good as they say | ||
| Lovematt |
Actually I wonder if there is a way to have something like the belt backing but with no tooth glued the outside of the belt. Something like 1/16 or 3/32 thick, super tough and strong and about the length of the current belt. Just wrap the whole belt with this thing and glue it on the entire surface. Granted the break point will be a weak point but this might be a possibility if the clutch is slipped a lot and the throttle is used with a light touch? Another thing is that I know belts are sensitive to chemicals...some glues have a solvent/etch deal to them so that they act like a flux to whatever is being glued together in order to ensure the best possible adhesion... | ||
| Midknyte |
You'd want to have a length of belt as described to splice in because the belt might not break cleanly. If it shreads - you'd want to cut it back a bit, cleanly, then add this middle piece back in. The belt tensioner would also keep you from getting the two ends to meet back up anyway. Having something as long as the belt itself to go around and reinforce it is not something that could carried around with us & glueing to the entire surface would be unweildy. This is a simple idea akin to having a few inches of chain and some extra master links in your seat trunk. | ||
| Blake |
Interesting you mention this. I was thinking of something very similar, but using plain ole 5 minute epoxy and a strip of kevlar strap. Same idea, use the rear sprocket as tooling to align the teeth while the adhesive cures. Then ride very very gingerly home.  | ||
| Charlieboy6649 |
If no one breaks their belt before me, I'll try it. Please post if you beat me! | ||
| Reepicheep |
Cool thoughts. What about a 5" or so strip of belt, but with "teeth" on both sides of it? This patch would go *inside* the old belt, not outside it. The teeth on one side of the patch piece would glue on and anchor down to the old belt. The teeth on the other side would now become the new teeth to run on the sprockets. Heck, make it a sandwich and use what Blake describes on the outside of the belt to hold it together and add even more strength. The thickness of the belt would be more when it is on the sprocket, but it would be easy to just adjust the rear wheel all the way into the swingarm to give plenty of slack. There would be a lot of driveline lash, but it would get you to a place to fix the belt. This could be easily made by gluing two pieces of an old belt back to back, and just having a 5 inch piece of it stashed on the bike with some glue and cable ties. The cable ties would hold everything snug while the epoxy cured. Any good recommendations for good flexible epoxy that will cure quickly? It would be great to have a patch kit for the belt on the bike. | ||
| Glitch |
Has anyone tried these?   | ||
| Midknyte |
And here I figured you guys would be busting my chops for this idea  My idea relies mostly on finding that glue I saw demonstrated again. Might have to wait until next years' show to roll thru town again. It was a one or two part spray on bonding stuff that reacts specifically with rubber - getting it on your hands or something else causes no harm (to my recollection). Other than that, simplicity. You could not use just a flat strip of kevlar over the back though because there is no guarantee that your belt will break cleanly (not shred). Also, I suggest using a length of scrap belt to connect your old belt back together because I would expect that you could not get the two ends to meet back up anyway because of the tensioner. | ||
| Charlieboy6649 |
Could this be the stuff you speak of? http://www.americansteel.net/coolchem/rubber.asp Sure sounds like it. I'd be wary of using the sprocket to line up the glue joint. THIS STUFF BONDS TO ANYTHING> Feel pretty silly if you glued your belt to your bike now wouldn't you... LOL. Anyway, I'm going to order some. IF MINE BREAKS BEFORE YOURS, I'll be the guinea pig... (Message edited by charlieboy6649 on August 02, 2004) | ||
| Rick_a |
A good fix for a belt...A CHAIN! | ||
| Captainplanet |
Glitch, They don't have anything for the xb. | ||
| Newfie_buell |
I have the perfect thing, A CHAIN, Thats how I fixed my belt | ||
| Midknyte |
Yep, that looks like the stuff Charlie. I take back what I said about aligning it on the sprocket - I thought it was rubber to rubber only reaction. Align, mark, then bond... Anyone got a broken 03 belt they'd be willing to divy up into 8 to 12" sections for us? | ||
| Blake |
Chains suck!  Bradley, Carry a knife and trim any ragged edges that might impede a tidy joining of the broken belt. Also, no need to worry about spanning a gap of a few missing teeth on the belt. Having a missing tooth or two will not be catastrophic in a "limp-home" mode. The teeth of the patch section in your sketch above would not be able to engage the sprockets. Moving a tooth even just slightly outboard/away from the sprocket will render it unable to engage the sprocket. So I guess a revision of the concept would be...  The trick with getting any adhesive to work in flexure is to get the bondline as thin as possible to prevent high bending stresses. There are other options. On the tougher XB12 and tube frame belts, simply using some screws to fasten a repair strip may also be effective, but that approach would also require drilling counterbores into the teeth of the belt to allow the screw heads to be submerged below the normal surface of the tooth into which they are screwed. | ||
| Midknyte |
Knife good. Revision good. What do you propose to use to join the belt as above? | ||
| Hootowl |
Glitch. Way cool. I wonder what those pins are for and how they attach? | ||
| Midknyte |
Agreed. Cool. Very cool. But more than can be stored underseat to have with at all times... | ||
| Crusty |
Why not keep it really simple and put a chain on it? | ||
| Blake |
Five minute epoxy in the self mixing dual syringe form. Available at my local Walmart for $2.95. Super glue. That stuff you mentioned. Whatever works and cures quickly. | ||
| Outrider |
Not that Harley knows anything about belts, but did any of you check out their emergency replacement belt kit? | ||
| Crusty |
The Emergency Belt is only good for 200 miles. It costs as much as a regular belt; or did last time I checked. Twice, when my drive belt broke, the E-belt wouldn't have got me home, as I was considerably farther away than that. I think you're all underestimating how much stress a belt undergoes. Five minute epoxy wouldn't last five minutes. It's too hard and it would be flexed quite a bit each time it passed over the sprockets, especially the front. One of my belt failures was when a majority of the teeth were ripped off the belt. It's inexpensive and easy to convert to chain drive. Go to your local H-D or aftermarket repair shop and tell the person behind the parts counter that you want a 23 tooth front sprocket with the accompanying spacer and seals for a 1992 Sportster, as well as a rear sprocket for the same year. Get a high quality O-ring chain like an R K or Tsubaki, and you'll never have to fear gravel or road construction ever again. I've never had a chain break and leave me on the side of the road; four times belts have done just that. | ||
| R1DynaSquid |
Gotta agree with Crusty, I dont see anyway that epoxy or superglue or any other quick fix method is going to last more than a minute or 2. | ||
| Outrider |
Hey, I don't like belts anymore than you two. I was referring to the fastening mechanism that Harley uses for there emergency replacement belt kit. Looked interesting on their website. | ||
| Blake |
Yeah, you're right; probably not worth even trying. Never mind. What were we thinking trying to come up with a simple, quick, cheap roadside limp-home repair for the drive belt? Crusty, You think it is "really simple" to swap an XB final drive from belt to chain? Go for it Bradley. Get yourself some heavy duty kevlar strapping and give it a try with various adhesives. | ||
| R1DynaSquid |
I like the HD belts, hell 60,000+ trouble free miles with mine. Not real sold on the XB setup tho. After seeing Easyfliers broken belt last weekend, its apparent there are may be some issues that need resolving. | ||
| M2me |
I thought they resolved some issues with the XBs. Didn't they change the belt system with the 2004 models? I love the belt drive on my M2. I have just under 17,000 miles on it but it doesn't look any different than when it had 500 miles on it. No maintenance, quiet, etc. Maybe it'll snap on me tomorrow and I'll have a different opinion. But it's just as likely to last 50,000 miles. I think that some kind of adhesive repair system could work. It could last 200 miles. If you're 600 miles from home it could get you to a shop and a motel room within 200 miles. It doesn't have to get you home. | ||
| Outrider |
I hope this concept comes to fruition as I would be much happier with a belt repair kit in my tank bag. Is just a personal thing. I have not experienced any problem with a belt but ride alone and like to contingency plan. To date, that has been easy with a chain and not a concern with a shaft drive. A quick simple "limp home" fix for a belt would be just what the doctor ordered to get me out exploring the OutBack again. One confidence builder for many of us would be to know how long the failed belts lasted on the respective models and the riding techniques and conditions employed by the owner. Abuse, weather, whatever would help make a more definitive study of the situation. Any ideas? | ||
| Bomber |
casual perusal of the data presented appears to indicate that belt life is unrelated to models, riding habits, conditions through which the rides occured, and karma I'm sure there ARE corelations that would be useful, but they don't seem to be clear from the info posted big twin belts seem to last a great deal of time, as do sporties -- interesting, since, I believe, sporty belts and tuber belts are the same, and tubers have a lot more "issues" than sporties | ||
| Easyflier |
On my 2003 XB9R the first belt lasted 10,800 miles to include the wheel bearing recall and one tire change. The second belt lasted about 7,200 miles to include one tire change. I ride my bikes hard but don't think it borders on abuse, and I do like to downshift for fast curves. I did not change the idler pulley at the 15k service interval but the dealer that has the bike now (awaiting belt) is going to check and make sure the bearings weren't shot. Don't want to change belts with each tire change but am beginning to think it might be a good idea, to prevent breaking out on the road somewhere. I have noticed that a few hundred miles before each breakage the powertrain felt different. The only way I can describe it is that it is similar to the feeling you get in an old leaf spring muscle car without traction bars on a hard launch. I should have done something when I started to feel it this last time but it is very subtle and I wasn't positive that it was an indicator, in the future I'll know better. |
