| Author | Message | ||
     Whosyodaddy |
http://www.motorcycledaily.com/14july04_yami_mt01.htm Looks like Yamaha's design team may have spent a few weekends with an XB. WYD | ||
| Jasonxb12s |
Put me down for one. Sweeeet | ||
| Koz5150 |
It looks heavy. | ||
| Tucsonxb9s |
Check the Quickboard..."Buell inspired Yamaha" | ||
| Whosyodaddy |
doh! Sorry 'bout the double-post. That's what I get for only monitoring the XBoard | ||
| 984_cc |
Has anyone seen Honda's Buell copycat? http://www.sportrider.com/bikes/146_01_honda_nas/index.html Look at the front brake and the exhaust system! | ||
| Bubabuell |
This one seems to me like down right theft...http://www.ghezzi-brian.com/models_furia.htm | ||
| Mookie |
im not knocking this bike but has anyone seen the new american made fischer? http://www.fischer1.com | ||
| Dresden |
I was going to get a Fischer, but they decided to go with a Korean 650 for their first bikes. No way for me. Good price at $10K, but only with a modified Austrian engine like they were originally going to use. http://www.onewheeldrive.net/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=84 | ||
| Tbs_stunta |
Guys, Buell didn't invent the perimeter brake. They don't even manufacture it and belly exhausts aren't anything new. | ||
| R1DynaSquid |
This one seems to me like down right theft...http://www.ghezzi-brian.com/models_furia.htm Been around since 98 or 99. perimiter brake & all. | ||
| Darthane |
No, they were just the first to put them on production bikes - even without credit for the invention, credit is still due for that. | ||
| Anonymous |
Tbs_stunta Then why does Buell have patents on their stuff? Simple, because they invented the stuff that works. Underslung exhausts sure as heck did originate on Buells, as did a truly functional ISO brake, which actually is not rim mounted for good reasons (check out the patent). And even Honda doesn't manufacture their own brakes. However, Buell designed the brakes on the XB from scratch, then farmed out the manufacture. Honda, Ducati, etc. just buy designs from Nissin and Brembo. | ||
| Tbs_stunta |
Fair enough, but its like saying that Kawasaki should get credit for having the first 600 with radial brakes. That also means that Buell has to give credit to the first bike with USD forks. It would be different if Yamaha did a fuel in frame bike. | ||
| Jasonblue |
Yeah the Honda "concept bike" has been around for a couple of years now too. | ||
| Tbs_stunta |
>>Then why does Buell have patents on their stuff? Simple, because they invented the stuff that works. The big 4 all have patents on their radial brakes even though they didn't invent them. | ||
| Josh_ |
>belly exhausts aren't anything new Yer right - Buell's been doing it for... 16?years | ||
| Tbs_stunta |
A couple of the old 2-stroke GP bikes had some of their pipes hang underneath the engine. | ||
| Outrider |
A couple of the old 2-stroke GP bikes had some of their pipes hang underneath the engine. Without a pic, I dunno. However, could be a case where prior art could kill a patent in a out-of-court settlement. Just because you have a patent doesn't mean you were the first with the concept, idea, product. All it means is nobody else bothered to file a patent and it is up to the patent holder to sue for infringement. With HDI's deep pockets and in-house attorney's that may be fun. Just try paying for that on your own! | ||
| Blake |
Tbs, News Flash: Buell was the first production bike to use USD forks. Do you have any clue as to the difference between producing quantities of street bikes versus a one-off show bike or GP racer? Why are you here? To dump on Buells? If so, take a hike. If not, what is your deal? Dyna, That Guzzi and Brian perimeter brake is a joke compared to what Buell conceived. First off, it sticks out beyond the envelope encased by the rim and is thus in harms way and begging for damage. Second, it is not mounted in a reliable floating manner and so will likely suffer all kinds of disk warpage and brake actuation inconsistencies. Slapping a disk onto the perimeter of a wheel is no big deal. Making it work and putting it on a production motorcycle with a front wheel that weigs 7 LBs less than a typical sport bike front wheel assy is HUGE. Third, the Ghezzi front wheel does not take advantage of the perimeter brake. It is a standard heavy front wheel with full torsion/shear webbing in each of its "spokes." In other words, it's all show, no go. | ||
| Dcmortalcoil |
Blake, Why the hostility??? Tbs was merely commenting that Buell wasn't the first with the concept with some of the components used in Buell. | ||
| Court |
>>>>Buell didn't invent the perimeter brake. They don't even manufacture it and belly exhausts aren't anything new. That is an inaccurate statement. In fact, you make a good point. Others had TRIED to work the engineering bugs out and were unable to. You can extrapolate and make a strong case that the perimeter brake was pioneered by a bicycle firm years ago. Making it work (Honda tried by the way and there are a couple Honda engineers who were impressed when Buell sorted the whole spoke, rotating mass thing out) on a PRODUCTION STREET BIKE is an entirely different thing. Show me one other manufactuer who has made, let's just use the round number 500, prodcution bikes, sold though a dealer network, certified by DOT in terms of "fitness for purpose" for sale to consumers, who has a perimeter brake, underslung shock or fuel in frame. Don't get me wrong...there are sporadic examples of folks who want to, try to and talk about. Erik Buell DOES. Court | ||
| Court |
Dresden: I tell ya what, I ride my Fischer everyday and love it. Korean or not, you may want to consider it. When I heard, two years ago, that I'd be able to buy one in 3 months I was overcome with joy. I belong to the INternation Assocoated Fischer Owners Group (IN A FOG) and love to ride to scenic places with twisty roads and hang with other FOG-heads as we call ourselves. Sometimes I feel used like my Fischer is just a ploy by the mothership to get me to move up to a REAL motorcycle.....THE WHALER!  Fact is the Fischer and the Honda NAS, both debuted several years ago, are concept bikes relegated to stay concept bikes. | ||
| R1DynaSquid |
underslung shock Which Buell dumped for a conventional setup with the introduction of the XB. That setup while innovative, never proved to be any better than a conventional mounting & through the issues over the years with shock mount issues, leaking shocks, recalls related to the shocks, etc etc may be a huge part of the stigma still surrounding Buell to this day of being "unreliable". Maybe..just maybe if they had gone with a "normal" shock the company would be perceived differently by the masses today? Blake, never claimed the Ghezzi setup is any better...never ridden one, hell I havent even ever seen one in the flesh. Does look pretty cool tho. Didnt PPIA have a similar setup on his S1? From what I recall it does work pretty damn well, but I imagine the weight penalty of unsprung weight is huge. | ||
| Outrider |
I think that Honda is a beautiful work of art. Too bad I am too old and stiff to ride it. Wonder if they are planning a "sport touring" version with some relaxed ergo's?  I trust somebody here will get the joke. | ||
| Bomber |
there's a dealer in Huntley Ill that has those little Korean scoots the Fisher is gettin it's motor from -- look like pretty good SV650 clones, and pretty cheap, if memory serves -- they might make a really good starter bike or commuter, but, as a person who escaped buying a Laverda from Sears by the skin of his teeth (and the fact that I couldn't afford one), I'd be more than a little concerned about parts availability in a while, as things tend to enter the Bomber Motorpool, and not leave | ||
| Phillyblast |
Dyna, I think the underslung shock was there to allow a shorter wheelbase. Moving the oil tank to the swingarm freed up the space needed to use the conventional shock without increasing (and actually decreasing) the 55 inch wheelbase. | ||
| Brucelee |
The thing that strikes me about the verbiage is that they present the specifics of the bike AS IF THEY DESIGNED THIS STUFF DE NOVO in their labs. Obviously there is a lot of stealing going on there and all they had to do is to back off the "invented here right now" rhetoric to avoid looking so silly to us. | ||
| 984_cc |
Using the perimeter brake is coolest when the weight savings advantage is taken. That is what Buell has done. In the latest Fuell newsletter magazine, they did an article on the front wheel design. It shows what was involved in getting it so light and still be strong enough to take severe impacts without warping the rotor. They are the first to use this 'integrated design' in production. The overall concept of the bike (the whole package)has attracted the attention of other makes. Copying is the ultimate form of flattery. It also creates direct competition. The Japanese are very good at copying ideas or designs and making them with a very high build quality. Since Buells are in a class by themselves, and Yamaha is just joining the party, they will be considered the 'Copycats' by me. Especially since they are using that big 1700 cc pushrod V-twin (with a 5500 rpm redline). I do like the Kodo, though it looks heavier, bigger and not as clean as the Lightnings. The torque should be awesome. The Suzuki B-King is a bike that could go in this category, and it's an original thought. It uses the Hayabusa engine with a supercharger. http://www.mickhone.com.au/Special/bking.htm http://www.thebikesite.com/suzuki_b_king.htm | ||
| Jasonblue |
I remember when they introduced the B-King concept. I hadn't seen it in a while. That is a beautiful machine. |
