| Author | Message | ||
     Corporatemonkey |
So as some of you know I have lusted after a BMW K1200GT (or the newer K1300GT) for some time. So for the last few years I have been lurking on a couple of BMW forums. My current economic situation would make it imprudent to purchase a $23k motorcycle right now, so I have been looking at used ones. After all it is a BMW... Well that's where my sadness begins. It seems the last 3 or so years of production (basically the new 4 cylinder bikes) are problematic. I know they are an extremely advanced machine, but it seems BMW can't get anything right. It seems they have starting gremlins, shaft drive oil failure (supposed to be a lifetime part). servo brake issues, fast idle (>4000rpm), computer issues, etc... I know we have a few BMW owners here (Jaimec comes to mind), and I am not bashing the brand. I am just curious, WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED?!?!?  | ||
| Danger_dave |
More farkles = more things to break. Viva le simple. | ||
| Corporatemonkey |
Yes but Honda seems to be able to build the Goldwing just fine. No bike has as many "farkles" as the 'wing. | ||
| Pkforbes87 |
My tubers break all the time and they don't even have farkles. I hope this doesn't mean they've fallen from grace. | ||
| Corporatemonkey |
I hope this doesn't mean they've fallen from grace. If you read any press of Buell during the tuber era, Buell only had one way to go, up... But BMW is usually the first choice of bike if one wants to ride around the globe. | ||
| Babired |
BMW's too damn expensive I would love to own a 800S but for the price and everything that is not included its not worth it. you can get 2 Buells for 23,000. every bike is going to have a farkle or 2. | ||
| Aldaytona |
As a long time BMW owner/rider, I wouldn't buy a new one. I also owned several Volkswagen Beetle/Rabbit series vehicles, I wouldn't buy another Volkswagen again either. What made German machines so famous/legendary was their simplicity, reliability, and ease of maintenance. They don't have any of that going on anymore. Volkswagen has a beetle in all of their TV commercials trying to tie that simple machine to the over complicated garbage that they sell today. They, like BMW are trying to win todays ball game with yesterdays home runs. I started with BMW in the "airhead" days and bought one of the first "K" bikes, just after I bought my last airhead. I rode the K until the warranty ended, but still have the airhead. Some of the newer BMWs need a computer to change brake fluid. There is little for the owner to do except change the oil anymore, and forget about chasing gremlins. Overpriced? Certainly. Over rated? Absolutely! Oh, and paying for that fine, precision German craftsmanship, a lot of their products aren't even made in Germany. D'oh! Today when you let them (B)reak (M)y (W)allet, you are buying the sizzle and not the steak. | ||
| Jlnance |
But BMW is usually the first choice of bike if one wants to ride around the globe. Yes, but not so much the K bikes mentioned at the start of this thread. The GS is a tank.  | ||
| Jlnance |
Shamelessly filched from ADV as illustration.  | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Pro-BMW/anti-Buell Buellgrrrl flame job in 3.....2.....1..... | ||
| Greenlantern |
Where did this information come from? I don't know BMW from a Peregrine Falcon, but I do know if majority of the information came from enthusiast forums like this one, I would take it with a grain of salt. How many times here have we read posts from infrequent visitors who are scared of the Buell brand because of all of the problems we post here. Enthusiast forums have the wonderful gift of spreading the gospel and helping the fellow owners of our favorite brand in times of need. The down side of such sites though are the artificially inflated perceptions as to the frequency and severity of problems which such a concentrated group of owners will invariably bring to light. Remember for every one of us with a glitch ( besides the "GLITCH" who we are happy to have here  ), there are dozens more of us riding many a trouble free mile. Then again you can have statistical data to back up your claims, which in that case, never mind. | ||
| Kalali |
I have a couple of friends who have owned BMW bikes since the late 60's and they only own the boxer motors. The four's are not as reliable. | ||
| Xl1200r |
I have a neighbor who used to own a K bike - 2006 model or so. It was in the shop so much getting the trans torn apart he decided to just stop paying for it. Bank called, wanted to repo, he told them to go to the dealer - it was there in boxes. | ||
| Jaimec |
My take is that BMW is introducing far too many new models too quickly. And they seem to be in some kind of "contest" with Honda to introduce technology that serves no clear purpose other than to say "Looky what we can do!!" Everyone asks me when I'm going to replace my K1200LT. My answer right now is "NEVER!" Probably the LAST of the old style, RELIABLE BMW K-bikes. I gave up on them after the 2005 model year when they introduced that STUPID power-assisted, linked braking system of theirs. The added horsepower just wasn't worth it. I'm approaching 126,000 miles on it now, and it shows no signs of slowing down. In a lot of ways, it is my most reliable and dependable piece of transportation. | ||
| Jaimec |
By the way, my 1985 BMW K100 was probably the most reliable motorcycle I've EVER owned. Ten years and 158,000 miles before it was stolen. It was the PERFECT do-anything, go-anywhere-but-offroad motorcycle. I could mount the lockable hard bags and go cross country, or remove the bags and go sport riding. It was the first bike I rode coast-to-coast, and it was the first bike I ever had on the track. Losing that bike was like losing a limb or other body part. Still makes me sick to think about it. | ||
| Thetable |
WhoTF steals a bike with 158k miles? Oh, never mind, if they were that bright, they would having a freaking job. | ||
| Bbbob |
Enthusiast forums have the wonderful gift of spreading the gospel and helping the fellow owners of our favorite brand in times of need. The down side of such sites though are the artificially inflated perceptions as to the frequency and severity of problems which such a concentrated group of owners will invariably bring to light. I've owned BMW's since the mid 90's, all K bikes, currently I have an '01 K1200LT. I've been reading the forums for years & at times have stressed about whether to get rid of any of my BMW's before any of that stuff happens. I have never spent a penny on anything other than scheduled service, worn out tires & brake pads & the occasional bulb on any of them. I have no intention of getting rid of the LT until I too old to ride it. Four mos. ago after 3 yrs of selling Harleys & Buells I got a sales job at the local BMW/Ducati/Triumph dealer so I now have a broader prospective of BMW's & their "reliability" issues. I do believe in most cases the frequency of these issues is overblown on the internet. I think customer expectations are such that nothing should ever go wrong with a BMW, if something does "the sky is falling". I've seen groups of 15 or more BMW owners gathered at the dealership spending a half hour discussing the one minor problem one customer had on his one bike. As far as the new K bikes, I have seen a few that have had bad kill switches & turn signal modules, most caught when the bikes are readied for delivery, a couple went bad while in the customer's hands. Of those all were fixed quickly under warranty. | ||
| Jaimec |
Thetable: My thoughts EXACTLY! Ten years old, faded paint... the bike was really only of value to ME. I was thinking of getting it repainted in '96 (the second repaint, I had it repainted once before) before it was stolen. Naturally, I DIDN'T have theft coverage because I believed no one (but me) would want it! All I got out of it was a refund on the unused portion of my insurance (about $35 if I remember correctly since it was at the end of the year). | ||
| Jaimec |
Bbbob: BMW's reliability reputation went into the toilet at the last Iron Butt Rally, when every single BMW with the new rear bearing (the big hollow axle deal introduced on the R1200GS) failed to finish the event. But I agree, I've seen some pretty STUPID "issues" raised over the years. The one I'll never forget is the "Rear Brake Issue" of the early K bikes. The BMW Riders Association wasted SEVERAL issues of their "On The Level" magazine discussing it. They posted photos, they had people writing in, and they were upset over BMW's official response which was (I'm paraphrasing here): "Learn how to ride properly." The issue was: IF you applied the REAR BRAKE ONLY forcefully WITHOUT squeezing in the clutch, the rear end would start hopping uncontrollably. I'll leave it to you readers to figure out what is wrong with that scenario and why I agreed with BMW NA's response. | ||
| Slipknot |
I recall that the current version of the Gold Wing was released we saw: bad oxygen sensors, bad timing plate something or other, cracked frames, poor quality control on the body work, especially the saddle bags and trim. As for design, try putting your feet down without hanging your pants legs on the pegs. I owned one. I sold it. BMW, like others has their issues but the original post about servo brakes is so old news that I didn't bother to reply to another sad troll. Servos went away long ago and the problems with the rear drive is so overstated it could be a Buell bitch item. And for around the world rides, BMW is still the choice because it offer an enormous number of options, light weight, one of the largest carrying capacities (weight), ease of maintenance, comfort, parts availability (if not on site, many overnight options from dealers-I personally sent orders to Africa, Asia, Central America, and the UK when I worked for a dealer), and instant respect from people all over the world which translates into offers of accommodations, assistance and friendship. Try all that on a Lead Wing or Pee Strom. I'd like to see Buell go after some of that market but until Eric cuts that ••••• Harley brand loose we can only hope. I've owned about 35 bikes in my life and the most trouble free was the ST1100. Both my own experience and owner surveys. But still I had to replace the bank angle sensor and fork seals. Welcome to reality. Once you get off mommy's tit the world is never again perfect so stop your whining. | ||
| Court |
Hey . . it's the internet . . . why don't we just say they released EVERYTHING prematurely to try to meet an anniversary date? . . . that rumor always seems to gain traction. I think they also did themselves a disservice by now showing at Americade. . . IF. . that is true. | ||
| Jaimec |
BMW or Honda? Neither they (nor Suzuki or Triumph) were there this year. BMW HAS confirmed they will be at the MOA National in Tennessee next month though. I'll be there listening to Delbert McClinton Friday night, July 17th! | ||
| Ferris_von_bueller |
The problem isnt just with their motorcycles. | ||
| Prof_stack |
CorporateMonkey Jamie, You should get over to Moto International and check out the Moto Guzzis. Best shop in the USA and great prices. | ||
| Jaimec |
Big problem with MotoGuzzi is parts availability and dealer network. I do like they're styling, but I've ridden a few and they don't do anything for me, I'm afraid. | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
If I may be brutally frank, the dear old Bayerische Motoren Werke has been pretty much on a down hill slide since they dropped the R69S. My nephew Ben has one. Looks and runs like new. Here is a photo of me on mine some years ago. I rode a similar one from Munich to Madrid, but that's a story for another day. Of course this one might have a few mod.s here and there. Just couldn't leave well enough alone in those days. Still can't.  | ||
| Corporatemonkey |
Big problem with MotoGuzzi is parts availability and dealer network. As the Professor has stated before if you are in the Seattle area parts and service is a non issue. The local dealer is the best, but if they were ever to close up shop MG owners would be in for a world of hurt. | ||
| Corporatemonkey |
As for BMW reliability, the first clue I got was not from the internet. When I originally looked at the K1200GT ironically the same guy that sold me my Buell, now works for BMW Northwest. He is a no non-sense straight shooter. Well he was showing all the features/innovations, and I asked about maintenance. I looked carefully over the service books, and honestly there wasn't much to be done. I actually figured the yearly service cost to be less than my Buell. Now flash forward a couple of years, and things have changed. The once "sealed for life" drive shaft is now a regular maintenance item. The first service is at 600 miles. Now when it comes to the motorcycle forums, yes they can skew the image of a brand, but when you have a fairly large bmw forum, and over 50% of the owners have reoccurring problems something is a miss. The final thing that raised eyebrows was a industry auction. I had an associate at one for misc reasons, and he stated a small fleet of new-ish BMW came through the auction with edited titles. They were mostly from CA and had been lemon bikes that BMW bought back, fixed then auctioned off. Maybe I need to start looking for an older BMW.  | ||
| 86129squids |
Jon- that is a brilliant photo. YOU MUST frame that for your garage if you haven't already. I have an '82 R65 for sale. His name is Crusty. Would benefit from a mild rebuild- don't evar put too much motor into one of these, it destroys the BALANCE. I learnt Deals Gap on my bike. Whuutt? | ||
| Kurbennett |
I own a BMW G650X Challenge, had it for almost a year. Great dual sport bike and garage mate for my Uly. I havent had any issues with it. When meeting with the local BMW group they are still upbeat on the brand. BMW still has a hugh percentage of the adventure bike category with their GS1200, even with the problems. |
