| Author | Message | ||
     Scott_in_nh |
I should have made the Saab connection but didn't think they had that much rubber either? My brother went to the Barber School at Lime Rock Park when they were using Formula Fords... | ||
| Ducxl |
I got my cylinders/heads torqued into place for the final time today.It's been a long road thusfar sourcing pistons,then modifying them to fit the chamber and then clearance testing/adjusting.Say,Rocket,does your 916 have the drain back hole in the vertical cylinder? Mine was on the cusp of doing away with it as a late '00 model.I could not find a way to insert an o-ring below the vertical cylinder. Rocket,do you think a supertuned 996 will "clean the clock" of an 1125R?  The rest of assembly i've done repetetively over the years and will be easy | ||
| Molly_hatchet |
funny that thing looks nice just like it is...now i dig taking things apart as much as the next guy , but daaamn man ur all or nuthin...been seeing pics of that poor thing all tore up for a while now id like to her all together...looks like a lot of work.. | ||
| Ducxl |
It HAS been a lot of work.And Ducati sucks for sourcing parts. I've been in a sort of suspended animation,so to speak with the issues surrounding the pistons.THis ONE issue has taken from March until NOW...It's DONE.As said,the rest is easy.But i expect another 2 months to initial start-up.Slow and methodical,covering all potential issues redundantly.But alas,i've spent too much money to(i think) be able to enjoy slinging it in the corners  | ||
| Rocketman |
Never had the vertical cylinder off it. And yes, that modified 996 will eat an 1125 if you've got it right. Seriously fast motorcycle, and that's riding not reading the printed numbers. Take my advice when you get it finished Duc. Fit a quickshifter. Rocket | ||
| Ducxl |
What is a quickshifter? | ||
| Rocketman |
What is a quickshifter? Are you pulling my leg? http://www.techtronicsracing.com/ Check out the Ducati section. Rocket | ||
| Doerman |
Ok .. back to comparison. I've pulled 4 pics all direct sideviews and all dressed in black for comparison. 1098:  MV Augusta:  1125R  R1:  My summary of comparison: Overall winner: Yamaha (but wrong motor .. he he) Both 1098 and MV have too much flat surface area on the lower fairing area. Best top fairing (1098 and 1125 - draw) Best tail section MV Best frame: 1125 Yamaha wins due to the best transitions from piece to piece. No individual piece is that cool looking. 1125 has great transitions but misses a couple here and there. Obviously this is in profile. Overall get very difficult to do in any objective fashion. Too many variables and the comparison becomes impossible. | ||
| Ducxl |
Too tough to choose.It's really nice that the new Buell does fit comfortably in the mix though. | ||
| Gregtonn |
OK, I'll give you the first shot. Let's keep it a logical debate. What do you see as the top five problems with the Buell design of the 1125R? Please be logical and objective. So far you've made some general comments about the design. Nothing has been objective, logical or specific with regard to design deficiencies. Please try again. If you can't define five specific deficiencies I'll accept an attempt at three. | ||
| Dbird29 |
Tie between Yamaha & Buell. Ducxl is right about how close they really are in comparison. A lot better opinion than the English man's shite. | ||
| Rocketman |
So far you've made some general comments about the design. Nothing has been objective, logical or specific with regard to design deficiencies. Please try again. If you can't define five specific deficiencies I'll accept an attempt at three. I believe I've been pretty specific regarding my logical objectivity  However, I get the sneaky feeling you're not really up for discussing the three areas I commented on. It sounds more like you wish to argue my opinion rather than argue the 1125 design? How about you accept we talk unlimited the 1125 and leave the attempts to troll me at home? Rocket | ||
| Old_man |
Only considering looks, I think the Buell is the best. But then, I like the (cheese grater) treatment on the back of my Buell. Of course, everyone is free to have their own opinion about style. No one is right or wrong, it's whatever you like and you are free to spend your money as you like. If you don't like the Buell's style, then, by all means, buy what you like. But anyone who likes the Buell style is not "wrong". Just as those who don't like it are not "wrong" It's not complicated. If you don't like the Buell go elsewhere - ANYWHERE! | ||
| Old_man |
 I, also, really like the styling of this new motorcycle. But I'm old. | ||
| Rocketman |
 Not that old! Rocket | ||
| Old_man |
 And this, if you like it a little more modern. (Message edited by old_man on January 06, 2008) | ||
| Crusty |
I like that new Guzzi Sport, too. Then again, I owned a '73 V7 Sport that I used to travel on, commute with and I even raced it for a season and a half. I am disappointed that Guzzi doesn't see fit to have the engine produce as much horsepower as my old Sport did. Still, it's a very pretty bike. Not as sexy as my Uly, and not as reliable, either. (My wife has a Breva 750; the same bike with different styling).I'd bet my paycheck that it won't be as much fun to ride as an 1125R, either. | ||
| Gregtonn |
Sean, As I suspected you have no desire for a logical and objective debate. But I'll give you another chance. Your statement to which I have added numbered points for clarity. Working and staying close to the (1. XB platform) design whilst introducing a new (2. liquid cooled engine), and how to incorporate the (3. cooling) necessities involved whilst remaining faithful to Buells 'Trilogy' of design. 1. By all accounts the 1125R is judged to be one of the best handling and most stable platforms available, by those who have actually ridden it. 2. The 1125R engine provides a power band that is unparalleled in its usefulness in the environment for which it was designed. 3. The cooling system is not only protected from road debris damage by its location, its hot exhaust is not directed right back onto the engine it is trying to cool as with other designs. In addition the covers provide protection in the event of tip over and much less expensive to replace than full fairings. Pretty cool huh? Those are logical and objective observations. Are you up to this level of debate? Greg | ||
| Rocketman |
Are you up to this level of debate? Quit the provocation and sarcasm, otherwise no. 1. By all accounts the 1125R is judged to be one of the best handling and most stable platforms available, by those who have actually ridden it. That's a long way wide of the mark. Few have ridden the 1125. You're marrying the attributes praised upon the XB platform. Not the 1125. Whether or not it proves to be as good as an XB only time will tell. As it is at the moment, the 1125 does not share the same geometry as the XB. The chassis is altered. The rake is not as steep. The wheelbase is longer. Fuel capacity is increased etc etc etc. Never mind those who've ridden an 1125 thus far. It's by no means a given the 1125 will live upto the XB's reputation. The 1125 is in danger of being compared to the top handling bikes out there. That said, the handling could prove to be the one and only area where the 1125 really does shine. Then we could argue that the controversial styling at least paid off in the handling department. I'm sure this will be the case, wrt handling, and wrt arguing. 2. The 1125R engine provides a power band that is unparalleled in its usefulness in the environment for which it was designed. I think you'll find it's not unparalleled. And there's a possibility that other engines of very similar architecture and design from other manufacturers could prove better. If that turns out to be the case then it's entirely possible Buells engine will be surpassed rather than unparalleled. But that is not the point I was making. New engine - entirely new motorcycle. I assume I'm not alone in thinking that might have been better. Would a whole new platform have given us far less controversial styling? That is the point I was making wrt the new engine shoehorned into an XB type design. 3. The cooling system is not only protected from road debris damage by its location, its hot exhaust is not directed right back onto the engine it is trying to cool as with other designs. In addition the covers provide protection in the event of tip over and much less expensive to replace than full fairings. Pretty cool huh? All is marketing nonsense. We've had liquid cooled motorcycles for nearly one hundred years. My Granddad, when he was alive, made no mention of his Scott suffering problems from any of the areas you point to as bonuses for Buells design. Likewise the past fifteen years or more we don't here of Japanese liquid cooled bikes suffering from their more conventional designs. That a side pod used for ducting doubles up as a crash protector is pure marketing genius, IF ONLY IT SOLD THE MOTORCYCLE. It won't. Only the Buell faithful will regard it as innovative. Everyone else will see it as part of an excuse for what is essentially a goofy idea that compromises the look of the 1125. End of the day, if an 1125 gets chucked down the road and the 'crash protection' works, then they're going to end up damaged and require replacement along with whatever else gets damaged. Will that be so much less expensive? Has this been proven by Buell? The cooling system remains the biggest headache for the design of the 1125. For whatever reason Buell stayed close to the XB platform, which I'm sure had much to do with production cost as well as hedging their bets that they could alter the geometry slightly yet still hope to retain some if not all of the XB 's recognised handling prowess, it is the placing of the cooling system components that have compromised the styling of the 1125. That's because Buell were unable to place mainly the radiator in a conventional manner yet be able to retain or stay close to the XB geometry, and equally important in Buells eyes, keeping the weight of the components central to the design. Rocket | ||
| Ceejay |
I don't much agree with the cooling issues for which you bring up, but I do wonder about the chassis dimensions and why they were changed. Many twins put the rads on the sides of the bike due to size differences. Twins are inherently thinner longitudinally than their IL4 counterparts. IL4's are also not as long thus there's more room up front for rad placement. Nothing really new there, other than buells decision to cover them up with pods vs. a full fairing or some other less controversial method. while the chassis changes somewhat tie into the length of the motor I'm wondering why the change from the 52 to 54.5? It looks to be mostly from swingarm differences but I'd have to see overlays to really tell. If it is just swingarm difference than I can understand to some degree why they are doing it as it will really help with sensitivity and the squat characteristics as well as possibly eliminating some front end dive properties when ridden properly. As it stands now though it looks more like the XB series was the bike which needed to have marketing hype to get off the sales floor, and thus had the dimensions it had while being used as a proving ground for future chassis designs. | ||
| Court |
Wow . . . a lot of that is very inaccurate. I hope folks don't read that and mistake it for fact. | ||
| Rocketman |
I disagree entirely. The XB design is in proportion as a whole. It's also easy to recognise as a good looking motorcycle by the mainstream, even if it's not the motorcycle for the mainstream. How many bikes do you know that put the radiators on the side? It's far from many. Rocket | ||
| Rocketman |
Wow . . . a lot of that is very inaccurate. I hope folks don't read that and mistake it for fact. A lot? Wow, guess that means some is fact. I'm curious. Why would it concern you that some might mistake what I said as facts? I smell a cover up. Rocket | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Everyone else will see it as part of an excuse for what is essentially a goofy idea that compromises the look of the 1125. I thought the real benefit of the side pods was to mount the engine further forward? | ||
| Rocketman |
I thought the real Rocket | ||
| Dbird29 |
"Never mind those who've ridden an 1125 thus far." The Ugly Englisman Well there's a debate stopper right there. So you do not want to base your arguments on anything but the bile spewing from your ass? You are the Master Debater!  | ||
| Ceejay |
Court-this is a very long thread, what is inaccurate, and thus I'm sure there's lots that could be miscontrued as fact or not so much. Isn't that up to the reader? On side pods I only know what I see and ride with and on any given day during "riding season" it's about a 50/50 mix of front mounted to side mounted in my lot. I don't much agree that putting the rad under the steering head is the best or only position, as the only benifit I can see, other than the "that's the only place we can put it", would be that the rad with it hoses and fluid now has it's wieght more centrally located lengthwise...Why else would it be done? | ||
| Scott_in_nh |
Ok, no point arguing whether they had to mount it more forward or not, do you believe there is an advantage or disadvantage in having more weight on the front end? I can't go digging for the numbers right now, but I believe the forward weight ratio is at a higher percentage (by 1 or 2 points?) than the 1098? Also, is the longer swingarm this allows and advantage is disadvantage? | ||
| Ceejay |
Rocket-It may be easy to recognize the XB as a good looking motorcycle that is in proportion and I really like the design enough so that I spent my hard earned money to put one in my garage. That does little to tell me as to why Buell engineers decided that a 52" wheelbase wasn't good enough to stick with anymore especially when it was marketed(properly or not) as the best handling bike because of it's geometry. I do think the swingarm given it's lenght and pivot placement is a turn for the better, but that brings up the question, was it impossible to keep the wheelbase length at 52" given desired swingarm length/pivot placement and engine layout? | ||
| Ducxl |
I love the fact that they shoehorned this Helicon into the XB like chassis.They kept it tight and confined to a small space. That was also a design consideration on the old 916-998 Ducati.Just view one ASSEMBLED without the bodywork.It's very BUSY. Wherelse to put the radiators and keep a short wheelbase? |
