| Author | Message | ||
     Jblomberg |
I am a fairly new rider who just bought a 1998 S3T. I love the bike, but one thing has come to scare me: I noticed several times yesterday when I was riding, that my rear end wanted to slip away from me when I was leaned in a turn. I know that there is enough tread on the meats to keep me up. I'm just wandering if A)I'm leaning too far, B)the surface was just slippery, C)some adjustments can be made to the suspension to prevent that, D)All of the above, or E)some thing else is the problem. Please help me before I go too far and wipe out on this beautiful piece of machinery.  | ||
| Spiderman |
What were the road conditions? Were they new tires? Were you WOT in the corner? Is the rear end real springy? A little more detail will help. | ||
| Dueller |
Check those tire pressures...front and rear. Sounds like over inflated rear/under inflated rear. | ||
| Buelliedan |
The suspension doesn't really do much in a fully leaned over turn so I doubt thats the problem. Tire pressure is more than likely the culprit. I like to have my rear tire inflated between 38-40lbs. Also how worn are the tires? Its amazing what new skins can do for a bike. If the tires are the originals no matter how much tread they have you should replace them. They get harder as they get older and loose a lot of grip. | ||
| Jblomberg |
Sorry, what does WOT mean? maybe I will change the tires, I bought it with 8400 miles on it, and I don't know if the guy ever replaced them. I'll try the tire pressure thing, thanks! | ||
| Dueller |
oops...meant under inflated front | ||
| Shot_Gun |
WOT means wide open throttle. You will usually drag the pegs before losing tread on the rear. Cold weather,asphalt and tires can also contribute. Like the guys said: CHECK your air presures!!! If your fairly new to "Buelling" They all kinds of tourq so alittle caution should exibited til you get used to it. SG | ||
| Thunder |
Jeremiah , have you looked at the rear isolators? You have the older swingarm from the your picture. I know one way to detect isolators going bad with the newer swingarm if you look down behind the passenger pegs the swingarm will look scatched from rubbing against the frame. Mine were actually digging into the swingarm. Do you notice any increased vibration in the foot pegs in turns?? Hope you find it. Jeff  | ||
| Josh |
Replace the tires, verify the pressure, set all suspension settings to factory, correctly adjust belt deflection and preload. If you still have problems breaking the rear tire loose on dry pavement, make sure the wastegate is working properly on the turbo... A friend recently bought a 3 year old low mile SV650. I noticed on a brisk ride that he kept falling behind. So we switched bikes. First corner I went into I slid both tires. Seems the 3 year old Dunlop 205s (or what ever the stock tire is) had plenty of tread but were rock hard. Said my buddy "yeah I'm not as comfortable sliding the tires as you guys are." We weren't, he was. Josh | ||
| Buelliedan |
Josh, Turbo?? WTH are you talking about??  | ||
| Josh |
Just speculating how he could be inadvertently breaking loose fresh tires. Ya know, that Hypercharger could just be adding too much HP. | ||
| José_Quiñones |
J, What are you doing with the throttle while you are leaning? Are you gradually increasing the throttle through the turn? Or are you snapping it open OR closed? | ||
| Buelliedan |
Jeremiah, I see your from Hales Corners! I grew up in West Allis and watched Alan Kulwicki as a kid at the Speedway!!  | ||
| Dynarider |
You definately are not leaning the bike over too far, Watched you ride at battletrax & you still have a lot to learn about leaning & turning. Id agree with either the air pressure adjustments or the possiblity that the tires were simply not warmed up & you were getting on the gas around corners. I know I can make my X1 swing the ass end way out if I want to. Kinda fun sometimes . | ||
| Ferris |
the suspension doesn't do much when leaned over in a corner? dude, you've never ridden with ME! i'll bet $10 that if i gathered up ten Hooligans at random and checked rear suspension sag, there wouldn't BE any due to having the rear spring wound up tight. everybody i've ever talked to that made this a common practice reasoned that they needed to set their suspension up "heavy-duty" to actually ride heavy duty. and everyone who's ever taken my advice to back a WHOLE buncha preload outta their spring has thanked me later for transforming their machine. Mr. Blomberg, there isn't, of course, any way any of us can know exactly what your problem is, but you've gotten some excellent advice already, and bone up on dialing in your suspension (your owner's manual will be of some help in this regard, the appropriate Knowledge Vault thread here on BADWEB will be even more so)--it's amazing how spooky a motorcycle can be when the boingers aren't set up right. and..............ride to lean  Ferris Bueller | ||
| Spike |
Jblomberg, First things first, get rid of the D205s! The others here are right: It's a hard tire and it doesn't age well. With the stock D205s on my Cyclone I would slide all over the place until they were warmed up. Hell, even if they were warm they'd occasionally spin when shifting from 1st to 2nd. With good tires it should take something really dramatic to make the bike slide in the corners. Tire pressure is important, but as long as you're within 32-40psi you should be fine. Suspension adjustments will make the bike feel better, but I don't think the stock suspension could be adjusted poorly enough to make the bike slide that badly. Basically my advice is to double-check your tire pressures and get a different set of tires. In the mean time practice being smooth with the bike and keep battletraxing. It's amazing what you can learn by being timed in a parking lot Mike L. '99 Cyclone (12k miles) | ||
| Jblomberg |
Hey thanks everyone for the advice. It's great to have something like this to learn from. If anyone else wants to put in their two cents feel free. | ||
| Blake |
Despite what Spike contends, I've found the Dunlop D205's to be very good tires, even performing respectably on the track. JBlomboerg, you may be running onto unscrubbed portions of your tires' edges where the mold release compound is not yet worn away. That portion of an older tire is diconcertingly lacking in grip until the shiny stuff is worn (scrubbed via riding) away. I experienced the exact same sensation as you when I bought my used '97 M2. The bike had never been leaned very much and the tires were maybe a year old with only a thousand miles or so on them. I put a few creases in the seat getting those tires scrubbed in. For some reason, new tires don't give me the same trouble, maybe since I go through a specific scrub-in ride on a well known road. It only takes me a couple miles to get new tires scrubbed in. Thanks to a day at the local roadrace circuit, and some rear-sets, my D205's are devoid of any hint of chicken strips. | ||
| Buelliedan |
Ferris, Once a bike is leaned over more than approx 30 degrees the suspension is basically worthless. the swingarm, isolators and frame do all the work. this is why we don't have rigid frames in sport bikes. There is a measures amount of sideways flex built into the bike for this. If you build a bike too stiff it will not corner! Honda learned this on their race bikes the hard way before the RC 51. The 45 was too stiff. Now your approach into a turn has a lot to do with your suspension settings and it directly influences your confidence in how far you will lean it over. But the suspension just doesn't do that much once you are truly committed to the lean. If it did then highsides would not happen. The suspension would dampen it out before it got so out of control. | ||
| Anonymous |
This is humorous. | ||
| Anonymous |
crashin is learnin! just kidding | ||
| Buellzebub |
very true words anonymouse, at least if your a racer... you never know where the edge is until you've crossed it | ||
| Spiderman |
Just take some Isopryl Alcohol (the kind in your bath room) pour it on the tires that will get all release compound and other slick nasties, then take 1000 grit sand paper and scuff up the tires, bada boom bada bing,  Your Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man | ||
| Blake |
Use 1000 grit sandpaper to scuff tires? You meant 100 grit right? I would not recommend subjecting tires to any kind of solvents if you can help it. JB, It could also be that the prior owner saw fit to apply something akin to Armor-All to the sidewalls. That is a big no-no. The stuff will bleed onto the tread. That might have been what was wrong with the tires on my '97 M2 that I spoke of above. Dan, Trust me, the suspension ain't doing "nothing" even at extreme lean angles. The more you lean, the more the suspension is loaded. At extreme lean angles the suspension is carrying close to double what it does when upright. It's true that when it comes to soaking up bumps, the suspension becomes less effective as lean angles become more aggressive. But the suspension does a whole lot more than just soak up bumps. The effect on ridability wrt alteration of your line, braking, and acceleration while leaned over is significantly affected by suspension setup. Ferris, What was the static sag set to on your S2? I had my '00 M2 set up at the high end of the factory's sag recommendation and still ground pegs and shift lever on the Blue Ridge Parkway. Any less preload would have severely hampered leanability. Of course that was with a load of gear and my 210 lb carcass on board. Heavier springs would have helped I'm sure. And yes, I do remember the tale of you running in a BTrax competition, grinding your shift lever and getting an unauthorized shift into neutral. Show off!!!  Question: Do the adjusters on the stock Buell suspensions govern the low or high speed damping? Low speed affecting suspension response to cornering, braking, acceleration and dips/rises in the road. High speed affecting suspension response to sharp bumps and such. | ||
| Spiderman |
YEP 100 grit sorry but straight rubbing alcohol leaves no residue but gets rid of all, it evaparates to fast to stay on the tires i all ways do it to my new tire and never had a problem. And by the way blake even with my 180 on the rear and with a broken shock it still didn't affect my times in Battle Trax | ||
| Ferris |
BuellieDan, i couldn't disagree with you more, but that's what makes democracy and BADWEB so great! i assure you that when I'M leaned over more than 30 degrees, my suspension is earning it's keep and then some. and somebody bitch-slap me if i'm wrong, but aren't many/most high-sides caused by the tire/s sliding/slipping then "catching" suddenly? if i'm right, the suspension would have a tough time dampening this out before it "got out of control". we DO agree on the "too stiff, harder to corner" logic, altho this adage isn't set in stone, either. that said, i've found for MY style of riding i want the rear shock to be VERY relaxed and contented, not all constipated from having the adjusters maxed. Blake, i don't recall what my static sag was, but i never really used that as a reference, anyway. by trial and error i found that i could corner with more confidence, on a MUCH happier mtorcycle, with the adjusters backed as far out on the rods as they'd go without the nuts flying off. keep in mind i'm not the world's biggest guy (geez, even my wife and 15 year-old daughter are taller than me...), so i can't give a setting that will work for all. trial and error, that's the key. suspensions are adjustable for a reason. that little "unintentional shift in neutral" episode you mention is all true, garnered me a Top Time of Day trophy, and...................a few extra gray hairs ride to leannnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn FB | ||
| Ferris |
hey first Anonymouse, WHAT is humorous? you got anything to add besides sarcasm? somebody asked an honest question, and everyone is giving honest answers. what do YOU have to say about Mr. Blomberg's question, hmmmmm? best, FB | ||
| Moderator |
Yeah, what FB said. I had to really bite my lip to keep from lambasting the wise ass anonymous comments. Grow a spine anony weenies! You ARE abusing the intent of the "anonymous" button. End of lecture. Let's RIDE!! | ||
| Anonymous |
The humour is that you can have two people ride the same bike over the same course at similar speeds and get two distinctly polar reviews of the bike. Tastes great, less filling, and all that rot. Lighten your humor tension a little there guy. Think I'll go find a road and tune my springs some. | ||
| Spiderman |
Quote "and all that rot" if that aint a British comment i dont know what is |
