| Author | Message | ||
     Phillyblast |
I'm not sure who I'm mad at more - the dealer, for effing up my bike, or me for not doing the work myself. Long story short, I ordered a big box of goodies for the S2 over the winter - heads, cams, pistons, cylinders, etc. I stared at them taking up space in my living room for a few months, and then moved to the new house. After calculating how much time I was spending at work, and how scarce shop time was at my buddies shop, since he's really busy this time of year, not to mention unpacking boxes every free minute, I let myself get talked into letting the local dealer - who shall remain nameless for now - do the upgrade on the bike. I was assured it was a piece of cake, they're familiar with the bikes, they have a guy on staff that pretty much does nothing but performance upgrade, ad nauseum. Since it needed an inspection sticker it would have to go in there anyway, and the front brake was making a thumping noise, I figured what the hey. I've reached a point in my life where I can actually afford to have the "experts" take care of stuff on odd occasion, instead of doing everything myself, and I just wanted it done. my mistake. I got the bike back last night, and on the way home - babying it the whole way since it was still in break-in - I cracked the throttle open a little. Nothing extreme, just a little taste to make sure I was varying my rpms. HUGE detonation noise from the rear cylinder. I limped it the rest of the way home, needless to say it was heating up pretty badly by the time I pulled into the driveway, and got off to look it over - the factory rivets are still in the timing cover. So they put cams in the bike, and never set the timing? ?????? Then I took a closer look and sure enough, there are the base gaskets that I specifically mentioned probably wouldn't be necessary if they set the squish according to recommendation from NRHS Did I mention the front brake still vibrates like someone put a quarter in the bed at the No-Tel? So they obviously didn't bother to take it for a test ride, or they would have noticed the brake and not passed it for inspection. Oh, and the choke wasn't tightened it came off in my hand and dangled between the cylinders for most of the ride. And when I got to the dealership it was parked downhill, partway over on the sidestand, about to fall over. Couple of problems, as far as I see it - It was detonating the entire ride home. 50 miles total, give or take. So I'm asking that the top end get taken back off and I want to inspect the parts for damage, including piston damage, microwelding on the rings and damage to the cylinders. Did I mention they didn't change the oil? Or that they made me wait a couple of extra days because the tech got "pulled off to work on another job"? I'm chanting Court's "polite but firm" over and over but it's getting tougher and tougher to maintain a calm demeanor. And they can't find my old parts, either. Any suggestions as to how to proceed? I'm thinking at this point I want a refund on the labor and new pistons and rings, and I'll throw it in the back of the truck and take it to see odinbueller. what do you think the chances are off that happening? I'm enjoying a cold one and trying to concentrate on the fact I'll be in the Bahamas this time Friday. It's helping a little, but not much. This is my S2, my baby, so maybe I'm overreacting, but I think not. Any thoughts? | ||
| Odinbueller |
Wow dude! First, I'm sorry you had a "less than satisfactory" experience at the unnamed dealer. Second, I am flattered that you mention me for follow up. I've always been an advocate of letting the person that did the original work afford you the opportunity to make it right. They know what is involved in the original job, and will have the best knowledge possible to fix any problems that arise. Remember, you always get more with honey than vinegar, so suggest a compromise to make sure the bike is right. Try to pursue all diplomatic avenues with that dealer before resorting to going to another dealer. I know how you feel, I LOVE my S3T just below my daughter, wife, and family (I'd even have it sit next to us at Christmas dinner if it weren't for these darn hardwood floors  ), but remember, we're all human and prone to make mistakes. If I were the technician that performed the original work and knew that the customer was dissatisfied with the performance of their motorcycle, I would implore them to bring it back so that I can look into it personally. Keep up with the diplomatic approach, and again, I really appreciate the vote of confidence. | ||
| Phillyblast |
Chris, If Court says you kick azz, and you take care of his S2, that's all the endorsement I need. Seriously. And I get the impression that if you were the tech that performed the original work I wouldn't be "dissatisfied" Like I said, I'm trying very hard to maintain "Polite but Firm" right now. One of the reasons the dealer is "unnamed" is I'm trying to be fair and not drag anyone through the mud before the situation is resolved. | ||
| Odinbueller |
Well, to be honest, Njbuell took care of Court's S2, but we're all in the same shop (I helped with some frozen isolator fasteners) I appreciate your position on the dealer in question, and I believe that you are doing the right thing. I try to think of the dealer network as a family. Sometimes dysfunctional, but mostly we all need each other for support. The diplomatic approach is the way to go, don't let the situation get you down. I am happy to help any way I can. | ||
| Tramp |
i say you kick their  es | ||
| Odinbueller |
Oh Tramp, lets let cooler heads prevail here. Funny emoticon though. | ||
| Tramp |
i kid. i'm actually an incredibly diplomatic fella in person. getting a bad situation resolved is a far bigger challenge and greater achievement than kicking | ||
| Ingemar |
I'd say you can either try and have the dealer resolve the issue. For that, you need to be polite and firm. Hopefully they realize they made a mistake and make up for it. Or, suck up the loss, take your stuff to the other shop and don't look back. | ||
| Court |
Man.....a couple of these items are pushing the "wait, how could you have missed that" envelope. First - I agree with not naming the dealer. Concern, for the instant, lies with a tech. Dealer may be sterling, take responsibility and straighten this out. Second - I'm quite satisfied with Liberty....where I think EVERYONE tried to get the isolator bolts out. I had one concern when I did my test ride of the S-2; it was promptly rolled back in and addressed. Class act. Third - I think (although the busy part of me leans toward the "cut your losses and take it somewhere to be done right"  that you need to visit with the dealer, sans an audience, review the information in your post and provide an opportunity for them to be heroes. Keep us posted. Court | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
There is a difference between an honest mistake and gross negligence. Of course from this distance, I can 't really tell which it is, but it sure sounds like the latter. If I am wrong take Court's advice. If not, take your own counsel, and get the bike out of there. I have found over the years that mistakes can be rectified, negligence rarely is: I don't like to give a bum a second chance any more: never seems to work out for me. I would publish the guys name to protect the rest of us, and take him to court, preferably small claims. | ||
| Phillyblast |
>>Man.....a couple of these items are pushing the "wait, how could you have missed that" envelope. Let's just say I started getting bad vibes early on in the process. But they've done some minor work for me in the past (tires, etc.) and I had a good experience, and by the time I started to get worried about the process they already had the bike apart. I'm maintaining polite but firm, near as I can tell from my end. I talked to the service manager this AM, and they're tearing it back down this AM to check for damage. I've taken steps - some obvious, some not so obvious - to ensure that I'll know by looking at it if it's been torn down. And if they say "no damage" after inspecting it I want to see for myself. I re-iterated the list from above, and mentioned how all the little stuff that got missed is what leads me to doubt the "big stuff" got taken care of properly. I'm supposed to hear back this afternoon, we'll see how it goes. I'll keep you posted. | ||
| Wardan123 |
My father had a difficult time dealing with our local HD/Buell shop when servicing his 2005 Softail Standard. His front spoked wheel was pinging (a couple of spokes needed tightening) and he asked for the fix. When he got the bike back - wheel not trued service marginally completed (they didn't replace his dipstick and they never found it---comped him a new one from parts once he pointed it out!). When paying he asked the service manager "Don't you guys have any @#$%* idiots working here?" to which the service manager sheepishly replied "It appears we do have some @#$%* idiots here." My dad sneered "Nah! A @#$%* idiot would have done a better job." That's my dad --- always making friends. | ||
| Blake |
David, Are you certain that the timing cover rivets are the originals? Some shops re-rivet the cover; in fact I think most do, so if you are basing your conclusion on an expectation of seeing screws in place of the rivets, you may well be mistaken. | ||
| Phillyblast |
Blake, I hear ya, forgot about that possibility - like I said, trying reaaalll hard to keep cool on this and sort it out amicably, but I'm a little, well, distracted. When I inspected it the timing cover looked completely undisturbed, and the rivets were pretty dull - didn't look like new rivets at all. You could be right, we'll see what happens. Given the lack of attention to other details and the incomplete work done on the bike, though, you can understand how I suspect it wasn't checked, and the tech just marked the timing plate assuming all would be good when he put it back together. The bottom line is the bike barely ran when I got it back so how they could say to me "took it on a test ride and everything's fine" with a straight face I have no idea. | ||
| Fullpower |
impossible to have changed cams on S2 without removing timer cover. sorry about the bad service. hope they are able to make it right. (Message edited by fullpower on June 23, 2005) | ||
| Fullpower |
where are your old cams? | ||
| Phillyblast |
They're still looking for the old parts. They couldn't find them when I picked up the bike. grrrrr | ||
| Shazam |
better question might be where are your "new" cams.... | ||
| Phillyblast |
New cams are definitely in the bike. They are (I was warned) kinda noisy. Got a call back - the Dyna2K was set to curve 1 - the most aggressive - instead of 4 - I swear it was set at 4 when I got it, and Justin said they set them all to 4 before they send them out just for this reason. Also said they riveted the cover back on. Claims they took for a "long" test ride today and it "runs great" so I'm going to get on a plane, go to the Bahamas, and pick it up next week. I don't think they pulled the heads to check for damage, which was something I understood from the phone call this AM was going to be done. I know for dam sure I don't trust them, and I don't feel comfortable my bike was done right. I'll probably pull the heads myself after I get it back and see what it looks like. For all I know, the tech could have done a bang-up careful job, and just screwed up the ignition setting. But all the little stuff that got missed just makes me wonder. 43 miles on the tripmeter when I dropped it off the 2nd time. We'll see how long the test ride really was. | ||
| Odinbueller |
Enjoy your trip, try & relax, and keep us posted when you get back. Liberal amounts of rum for medicinal purposes, so prescribeth Dr. Odinbueller | ||
| Phillyblast |
they scratched my fork tubes aaaaargh rum it is. | ||
| Sarodude |
Philly- When I first got my bike I went through a dealer 'experience' as you may recall. Motor made a terrible racket and eventually dropped a valve before the 500 mile break-in. Dunno if they were related... This having been my first new vehicle, I decided I'd let the dealership handle my problem under warranty. What ensued was a series of half assed attempts at getting rid of a Blast purchaser with a minimal amount of effort. Every time they went to fix one problem, the caused another - that I would notice when riding the bike home. On one occasion they even swapped my UNSCATHED mirrors with scratched up pieces 'o crap. My efforts to allow them to make it right spiraled into a buy back on that Blast. As I took my new Blast the service manager approached me with a card good for a free service. I tried to tell him as politely as I possibly could that nobody at that place would ever be allowed to even look at my bike from afar. My opinion: Cut yer losses. You've got an S2. Don't let someone cheese up a nice bike. Do what you know in your heart is the right thing to do for your bike. It ain't about savin' money. -Saro | ||
| Odinbueller |
If things snowball into what Saro describes, then I can not blame anybody for cutting their loses & going someplace different. You have to give that technician & servicing dealer a chance to make things right, but if they compound problems, then extrication is a viable option. There are moments in the middle of the night where I sit up in bed from a sound sleep and exclaim "Oh crap! Did I remember to do this on that bike I was working on?!", and then that morning I promptly go check out the situation. Almost all the time everything is fine & I'm just being paranoid. Sometimes there are things that I miss (valve stem cap forgotten after checking tire pressure is something I hate to do), and fortunately these things have been minor & I learn from them. Most technicians see a comeback as a possible hassle in my experience, the truly good techs will be concerned, address the issue, and retain that info for each and every job thereafter. That's what I try to do. I can only hope that this unnamed dealer & technician will do the same thing for Phillyblast. | ||
| Court |
Philly: Keep me posted Court | ||
| Phillyblast |
Court (and everybody else) Got back from my vacation last night, went to pick up the bike tonight. It is (drumroll please) not ready yet. Despite the call Thurs. before I left telling me it was running great and good to go. So why am I not too terribly pissed? Because the reason it wasn't ready was they decided it was still running a little rough, and took the timing cover off to readjust, then put it on the dyno to make sure everything was okay and futz with the timing some more. So it seems at least someone over there decided maybe they should take a look and make sure the bike was right before I got it back. Like I said, and I said to the service manager on a couple of occasions, I didn't expect a perfectly tuned bike when I got it back. I expected to break it in and then put it on a dyno. But I didn't expect it would be unrideable with stuff falling off it. I've trusted this bike to take me most of the way across the country and back, and it's going to take some doing before I feel like I have that same trust in it again. Knowing they put it through the ringer and made sure its right before I get it back makes me feel better, even if its the second time around. So hopefully they'll drop it off to me tomorrow and all is right with the world. And I can finally put some miles on this thing. I'll keep you posted. | ||
| Tramp |
they're jerking you off | ||
| Odinbueller |
Let us all know how it turns out. I'm hoping that they have done the right thing and taken care of your beloved bike. Go through the factory recommended break-in, which means riding it a lot like you just bought it in a short amount of time so that if anything does come up, you can make a note of it and let the repair facility know about it. Keep us posted. | ||
| Court |
Philly: Keep us posted. If you want, I'll pick it up and take it for a ride and write MY account of how they did. All, make that ALL, anyone expects them to do is what they are paid to do and make their living doing....no more, no less. It's a fading American concept....THEY ARE RESPONSIBLE. Keep us posted and I commend you on your demeanor...it'll likely contribute, in the end, to things being made right. | ||
| Tramp |
your bike's sitting off in a corner while they have "night trains" (reg. tm) & "bad boys" (reg. tm) on their lifts, for installation of kuryakyn Chrome and concho colostomy-bag mounts inscribed with "ride to live, live to ride".... | ||
| Bomber |
at my first wrenching job (Bud & Art's Standard), they used to call that a Wall Job -- park it by the wall, wait three days, call the owner with any luck, Philly's bein well taken care of -- I, too, am looking forward to the next installment of this passion play |
