| Author | Message | ||
     Blasterd |
I wanted to get my new bike from a reputable dealer ala Dave but couldn't afford shipment to Florida. And since I have 3 Buell dealers within an hour from my house I opted for one of them. It was not the same one I had bought my other Buell from but I had heard some good things and my buddy bought his night train from there. So I did it, bought the city X, got it home and noticed the bearings and most of the exterior bolts were rusty. There were scratches all over the airbox cover and flyscreen, the battery was completely dead, and the bike didn' run right. I charged the battery for 6 hours @ 10 amps to get it to start and went for a ride, but the bike shut off 3 times within a quarter of a mile. I called the salesman and told him I was not happy and he said it ran fine at the dealer, how I don't know since the battery was dead but anyway they sent someone to pick-up the bike and supposedly fix it. I called a couple of days later and they said they had to order a new ECM and that it would be a couple of more days. A couple of more days went by and I called and they said they got it mixed up with another bike and all it needed was a TPS reset a couple of times. Why didn't they call me?I asked if the body work and bearings had been replaced and they said the bodywork was replaced but all the bearings were like that on their Buells because they kept them outside and thats just how they were. I said I didn't buy a 2005 for it to have rusty bearings so get to work. I picked it up the next day and once again it was dark because it was after work so I loaded the bike up and took it home. The next morning I backed it out of the garage only to see the same airbox and flyscreen on the bike, still scratched, and they had sanded the rust off the bearings, (actually only the rear bearing I must add). The punk service manager lied to me about the bodywork because he told me he changed it out himself, he said he had to reset the TPS multiple times and they didn't replace the battery because it was charging. Fine, no big deal I just want my bike and want it to run. What the hell is wrong with these poor-a$$ed excuse for dealers that we have? OK, just wanted to vent because now I am going to call their lying snake in the grass a$$es and tell them what I think. Ken By the way, the cityX rocks! | ||
| 12bolt |
Sounds pretty typical to me. its a shame. | ||
| Wyckedflesh |
just an fyi, the battery used in your XB should not be charged at a rate higher then 2amps/hour. Gelcell batteries are finicky that way, and actually prefer a trickle charge of 1/4amp/hour when being charged by something other then your vehicle chargeing system. | ||
| Cataract2 |
What a way to screw up your chance of getting future customers. I feel for you man and hope things get straightened out. | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
Unfortunately, this is the Harley way: total disrespect for their customers, especially Buell owners, and gross incompetence in the service department. Part of the problem is that the regular Harley customers aren't really very interested in motorcycles per se, and the dealers have no interest at all. Please post the name of the dealer so no other members will be victimized by them. The phone number for Buell Customer Service is:1-414-343-4056. Ask for Renee. Don't expect much. Now you know why so many guys have ordered the Shop manual and Parts book from Daves, and do their own work. I consider the average Harley Dealership to be enemy territory, and I wouldn't let them lay a hand on my bike. Of course there are a few very notable exceptions, problem is they are so far and few between. I still would like to see a list of "Real Buell Dealers" put together by our members based on real life experience. | ||
| T9r |
Why... I do not know but it's not just HD or Buell dealers, it is any mechanic shop/dealer you might deal with. I'd say the more important thing is to resolve the issue personally, keep written details of conversations with people so you can refer back to them at a later time. Let them know your not a jerk but expect quality service and quality support for a quality product. If they are not able to provide you with quality service and support, then they have bigger issues. I feel your pain~  | ||
| Court |
>>>Unfortunately, this is the Harley That's an inaccurate statement. It's spiteful, vindictive and you have done nothing to move this fellow one step closer to a solution. >>>The phone number for Buell Customer Service is:1-414-343-4056. Ask for Renee. Don't expect much. My compliments. Your myopic answers are, if not helpful or accurate, at least consistent. Ken (Blastard) please call 1-414-343-4056 and ask for ROGER ROESZLER. Roger holds his own share of Land Speed Records aboard a Buell and knows them inside and out. There appear to be a handful of components/questions in your post. Roger and the good folks at Buell Customer Service are perfectly capable of sorting them out. That's their job and they are good at it. By the way. Let me offer you a suggestion based on 20 years of riding Buells peppered with some success in business. You have a choice to make. So far you've been offered the "••••, moan and whine on the internet" choice. Play that card if you think it's wise. I'm going to suggest just the opposite. When it comes to BUELL CUSTOMER SERVICE I say EXPECT LOTS! You are the most important thing in the world of Buell. When you plopped down your hard earned money for a Buell, it was a vote of confidence in each and every person who designed, built, shipped, set-up and will maintain your Buell. I know these people. They struggled through periods of limited resources and getting to where they are today has been akin to climbing a steep oiled mirror. They are not where they are going yet, they have made huge strides. With each "don't expect much", you turn the clock back months. You hurt you, you hurt me, you hurt all of us. Don't do it. Don't get sucked into the "life's a bitch, then you die" stupidity. The place is populated with the small minded, who require a victim to blame for each perceived wrong in their life. Most started out griping about their taxes and have now graduated to their recreational products. Pick up the phone and call Roger. He'll be aware of this by the time his phone rings. If, at any point in the resolution process, you have questions, feel free to drop me a note. Court | ||
| Reepicheep |
You would be amazed at how much damage you can polish out of the 9sx plastics. It will take time and work, but they really clean up nicely. I think you have two questions to ask here... Q1) Do you want to do business again with that dealer? A1) Obviously, no, unless you have some sort of sweeping apology and manager / owner intervention. Q2) What should you do about the bike? That's really the only remaining question. Don't confuse a holy war regarding Q1 with the answer to Q2, otherwise you will ruin a perfectly good motorcycle just fighting for principal. An XB9SX is simply too wonderful of a motorcycle to be sacrificed on the alter of principal. Get Dyna's X1, and sacrifice that one (again) instead, but keep riding the 9sx. So what do you do? Does the battery seem to be holding a charge and behaving well? Fine, keep it and ride it. You may have done some damage to it feeding it too much current for a long period of time, but if it is fine now it will probably be fine. Even if it does let go, it's what, a $80 part or something? Not worth loosing even one day's riding over. Rusty bearings... If it is surface rust, carefully polish it off keeping junk out of the bearings. The surface on the things rusts much easier then the mechanical parts, it is likely just a cosmetic issue. Again, if the wheel bearings are good now (no play, no cruncy noises) they are probably fine. Scratched airbox... Pop off the outer airbox cover, bring it inside, put a good movie in the DVD player, get Novus #1, #2, #3, and the harley sealer glaze. I seldom bother with the #1, but it will take off the static charge that makes the cover attract dust, so would make sense for some people. Start with the novus 3 and follow all directions carefully, working away at the scratched areas (bottle gives good instructions). Use ONLY cotton applicators, no brushes, paper towels, etc. Then hit it with the novus #2. If the scratches remain, repeat. It can be a pain to dig out from the raised lettering, so try and keep it away from there if possible. Once it is cleaned up, hit it with the Harley Sealer glaze, which also seems to toughen up the finish significantly. It will give you a perfect wet look mirror finish as well, it really looks great. These are all very solvable problems, have the fight with your dealer if you enjoy that sort of thing, but don't waste even one day of riding such a fantastic motorcycle in the effort. I just voted with my feet, and found a good dealer, even if they were an hour further away then my two "local" dealers. | ||
| Court |
>>>These are all very solvable problems, have the fight with your dealer if you enjoy that sort of thing, but don't waste even one day of riding such a fantastic motorcycle in the effort. That's an accurate statement. By the way, using the anti-static Novus will also keep you from going into shock as the dog walks past the kitchen door with your air box stuck to him. | ||
| Scooterroid |
"Unfortunately, this is the Harley way: total disrespect for their customers, especially Buell owners, and gross incompetence in the service department. Part of the problem is that the regular Harley customers aren't really very interested in motorcycles per se, and the dealers have no interest at all. Please post the name of the dealer so no other members will be victimized by them." 1. This is a garbage statement (I am a Harley rider and a Buell rider) and you don't know what you are talking about 2. I get great service on my Harley and Buells at my dealer. 3. As Court stated, you haven't said anything to help this guy and you certainly didn't say anything constructive. 4. Why is it that when there is a problem it is a Harley but when referring to wonderful V-Twin power it's a Buell? my 2 cents Steve-O} (Message edited by scooterroid on April 04, 2005) | ||
| Cataract2 |
Blasterd, I see your in Florida. If you need any help with the SX just ask me. I have one and can guide you through any buffing scratch or gas removal process on the cover. I have found ways to make those plastics shine. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Cataract2... if you have any more tips, do share! And I still have a sacrificial cover that is all ready for "destructive gasoline testing" if anyone wants to send me anything to smear on it before I dump gas on it... | ||
| Ingemar |
Maybe silly ... just tell me .. I promise I won't be offended  But what about clear coat??? That should protect it, no? | ||
| Sarodude |
Personal experiences with Buell CS is pretty good for the most part. I did once encounter a less than helpful individual. Almost seemed like she didn't fit there since I'd always gotten such FANTASTIC help from the CS folks. -Saro | ||
| Cowboy |
Hey check out your local mechanical college.My bikes stay in #1 shape for only parts. (head instructor is my rideing partner he he ) | ||
| Blasterd |
Thanks for all your valuable input guys, I called the dealer and all the problems have been worked out. I have new bodywork on order and everything else will be taken care of when it comes in. I wanted to give the dealer one more chance before I started posting names and getting Buell customer service involved. (Court, I am still going to hold on to that name and # just in case)I am also still a little aggravated at the service manager for lying to me and telling me he changed the bodywork out himself when it was not, but I got the "I was wrong you were right" apology out of him. As far as the charging the battery, the voltage reading was 10.4 so that told me it was dead according to the chart in the Buell Manual, the charge rate was about 2 hours according to the manual as well. After3 hours it still would not charge so I went to bed, and when I got up, Bam! it worked! It is working fine now as of about 90 miles. Did I mention this bike is awesome! My congrats to Eric Buell for designing what I think is THE best bike I have ever ridden. I couldn't be more pleased with it at this time, and I can't wait to whack the throttle and kiss the sky! After 500 miles of course... Ken | ||
| Sammigs |
I know this is going to sound like I’m pissing vinegar but it’s not. I’m just asking some questions, making some statements, and giving some suggestions. I’ve been in the auto business a long time. The last 14 years I’ve spent with Lexus. I’m sure I know a little about customer service. Court, do you think Ken was treated like a valuable customer? I don’t; in that particular dealer he wasn’t even treated like a Buell customer. I feel some of Gentleman_jon’s statement holds water. At least in my area of PA. Walk into a HARLEY/buell dealer (if you can find one) and go stand at the parts counter with your Buell hat on. Let’s see how fast you get waited on. Or just walk over and stand by the only XB they have propped up in the corner window. Still no one asking if you need help? Here’s another one; how many HD/buell dealers leave the Buell out when they answer the phone? Moving right along, how does recommending to Ken that he remove the body work and fix it himself help with his problem? He expressed all his concerns to the selling dealer and now he has to fix it himself? How much faith do we hold in the dealer network when our own advice is to fix it yourself? Outside of Dave Stueve and a handful of others, how many Buell dealers in the entire country are truly something to speak of? That’s a real question not a statement. The surveys helped significantly with the quality issues. This is a very well built bike. It’s gonna be a lot harder to fix the dealer issues. So with all this said, how do we as present and future Buell customers change the way we are treated? By future I mean repeat customers. 1) Call Buell customer service and convey your feelings in a dignified manner. In Ken’s case it’s still a good idea to call and let them know what transpired. Also keep Buell posted as to whether or not you were satisfied with the resolution. 2) Every time you have a bad experience at a dealer, call with the date, dealer name and personnel involved. These would be real issues like Ken’s and not something like the lettering on your hat peeling off. 3) If your particular dealer has done something that exceeded your expectations then let them know about it. It’s nice to get a pat on the back. 4) Make up your own survey, keep it simple, and send it to your servicing dealership and Buell. Send both the good and the not so good. I enjoy my XB very much. I stare at my bike like it was a fish tank. Therapeutic? Dam straight! As long as we have guys like Dave that I can trust when I need something, then I’ll be a repeat customer. But if I had to depend on the dealership to repair my bike, and knowing what I know now, there’s a good chance it would not be a Buell. | ||
| Steve_mackay |
Sammings, I can walk in to several dealers in the area, and get immediate and competent help. Hals HD for one has been spectacular as far as service is concerned. They are willing to offer advice, and guidance when requested for fixing problems yourself. I really can't say enough about 'em. | ||
| Court |
>>>>This is a very well built bike. It’s gonna be a lot harder to fix the dealer issues. That's entirely true. But being harder shouldn't be construed as meaning it's not happening or won't happen. Dave Stueve is the product of the process. I used to do the annual (it was my own, not official) Buell Dealer Survey. The complaint de' jour those days was parts delivery. After getting word that that "everything was fine", I simply had 10 folks, in different parts of the world, order the same 2 parts. Some folks here likely still have a spare turn signal about. At the time, it seemed that Buell parts delivery was hopeless. It took a lot of work but now Buell is among the BEST. I didn't say better, I said BEST. Just last week when someone reported a "3 week delay from the factory" for a set of rear XB rear wheel bearings I was able to do my own "survey". There were 45o sets in stock ready for shipment. FACT: Any Buell owners in the world could have had wheel bearings within 24 hours. I expect the same sort of progress in the overall dealer program. It's going to take some time and lots of hard work. The most valuable tool available to us, as Buell owners, is us. We are living in a world of instant, powerful communication. If we employ this wisely we will win. Start a pissing match with the dealer network or Harley-Davidson; you'd be better served to smack the pit bull sleeping in the corner. Blasterd: Great work and my personal congratulations to you for taking my comments and suggestions in the way they were intended. I am thrilled this worked out for you. Please keep us posted. By the way, the dealer situation in my own area hasn't been the rosiest. I'm headed over to Liberty HD/Buell on the 17th the snoop about. They have announced plans for a major Buell support initiative and I am eager to learn more. All the signs are good. Court | ||
| Kdan |
Three weeks with the XB9S and most people at the dealership still remember my name and treat me most excellently. That's Earl Small's HD in Marietta. I've heard some pretty good things about Stone Mountain HD too, but that's way on the other side of town from me. I've gotten more respect and satisfaction buying this bike then I ever have buying a car for 4 times the money! | ||
| Phillyblast |
>>you'd be better served to smack the pit bull sleeping in the corner. Just don't take his Winnie the Pooh and you'll be fine   | ||
| Jlnance |
Make up your own survey, keep it simple, and send it to your servicing dealership and Buell. I really LIKE this idea, mostly because it puts US in charge rather than having to wait for Buell or the dealers to take the initiative. I also think it would be appreciated by Buell and the good dealers. How about something like this. Since Court has done this kind of thing before, perhaps he would make up some questions that people could ask their dealer. Stuff like, where are your Buell shirts, and do you have my brake pads in stock. We could then recruite people from BWB to ask their dealers those questions on their next visit (I'm thinking this should be done w/o telling the dealers they are being quizzed). This information could be tabulated and posted on a Dealer Rating section of this site (assuming of course that Blake likes this idea). Part of the idea is of course to embarass the poor performers into imporving. I also like the idea that if someone walks into a dealership and starts asking Buell questions, that the possibility they might be evaluated on a public web site enters the dealers mind. But I think the most important thing it could do is allow the really good dealers to get recognized for the outstanding work they do. Do you remember about 6 months ago when someone posted about having their XB start leaking gas on a ride and they thought it might be the dealers fault. And then the dealer, who had not been mentioned by name, posted and said that he would make sure the bike was repaired to the owners satisfaction and that he would post a followup letting everyone know what had gone wrong. It was extrodinarily impressive. But the story is buried in the badweb archives, so no one knows about it. It would be great if we had a way of recognizing great dealers. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/32777/82414.html | ||
| Xbduck |
Everyone must also understand that if you only show up at the dealership with problems you will soon be shunned just like the fellow on the cellular phone ad. You might have seen it, one guy says "oh, no it is the guy that always has problems. How are we going to fix it?" The other guy says he knows how and goes and locks the door in the mans face. If you never drop by just to look around, or heaven forbid you find something to buy. They, the dealer in question, will never know who you are or care. I know Blasterd has real issues but my comments are aimed at everyone in general. I bet that after this is all over and he keeps going back just to look around they will never forget him. I am telling everyone this because I have started doing this and I feel more welcome every time I go in. | ||
| Taxman |
when i bought my buell i couldn't take it with me right away and the snow wasn't quite gone yet. the dealership delivered it for free that weekend. i went down just days before and talked to the owner and the tech, who both said that they enjoyed riding the demo buell. of course this was still before i even had my bike so i figured they were still in "sales mode". two weeks after i got my bike i went back and got fitted for the buell vanson jacket(by the way when i did this they had a thing going on where if you purchased a Harley product you got a free bucket of cleaning stuff. even though i didn't technically qualify they gave me a bucket). and i hung around and just chatted. being a brand new rider i asked a lot of questions. they were patient and were quite enthusiastic about making sure a new rider was prepared. i think i was down to see them a few weeks later to get some gloves. they did of course hype the race kit and asked often when i would do that. well this season i took the bike down and had them throw it on. they have been good to me. they have helped me on almost every situation. i had little leak after scheduled maintenence and they got right on it. i dropped it in the dirt and they spent 15 or so minutes on the phone with me while i got all the dirt out f the airscoop and airbox. the only thing they were hesitant on was putting in the 12 airbox cover, and i think thats understandable. i hear some of you talk about how much trouble you have with your local dealer. how you prepare for war when you go to talk to them. and all i can think about is how much mine has helped. i'm sure this is a case by case basis. i was down there one time and they were not the same with another customer. it was a young guy who had an older tube frame(i think it was an m2) that was trashed. i could tell the dealership was upset, the guy had trashed it doing wheelies and had a little attitude prob. but they were still curtious with him. a friend of mine who bought a yamaha doesn't have nearly the same effort put out by his dealer. i liked what you had to say court. and i'm glad that a few others of us agree. i also like that some dealers are on this web forum on a regular basis. its encouraging to me. and by the way.. if any of you are in the northern michigan area. head to Gaylord, stop by Northwoods HD/Buell. they dont have much Buell stuff in the showroom due to lack of sales, but they are worth saying hi to. and who knowsm, if more people stop in and start parusing, maybe they'll bring back the buell clothes. just my not so humble opinion. take care, and stop by your dealer for coffee and chat a bit. | ||
| Buelluk |
My question to Blaster would be , why did he take delivery of the bike in that condition in the first place, when I bought my XB the dealer gave me a walkthrough on the bike ,and also gave me ample time to check it over to make sure I was satisfied with it, so i also take issue with the description of all Harley / Buell dealers being like that !..one swallow does not a summer make. | ||
| Court |
Gotta tell you folks. . . . there is TONS of positive information coming out of this discussion. I know it sounds like "old hat" coming from me, but I am a huge advocate of the "you teach people how to treat you" doctrine. The survey thing may happen; we've done precisely what you described before. I'm eager now to see what changes come from the recent Buell survey you all participated in on www.Buell.com . . you all DID participate after I begged you, right? I'm of a mind, at present, that the folks who CAN make changes have their ears to the tracks and are listening closely. I am going to further assume that it is their sincere desire to do good things and enable systems to eliminate concerns we've expressed. I am also aware that they are a bit like a Morris Minor mechanic arriving to work on your Chevy Nova, in that they may not have precisely the right tools or mindset to effect the needed changes. That, dear friends, is where these very dialogues become very valuable. You need to state FACTS. The old "so and so is a such and such" ain't cutting it and will drain your credibility like being hit with a nueralizer. Perhaps, in some cases, you could do something like print a copy of this thread and send it to your dealer with a note like.
Not exactly that over the top, but you get my drift. It'd likely be a better face-to-face. Anyway, you get my idea. Thoughts? The next leg on the stool is as much our responsibility as Buell's. Court | ||
| Buelliedan |
Court, I like your advice but I have had 2 dealers that get really upset when you know more about servicing a Buell, recalls, etc then they do. Especially if other customers see it happening. They let their egos get in the way. I can't tell you how many times I had to hand the dealer (Barnett HD in El Paso) the recall notification or I had to call Buell CS before they would do the work they were required to do. I still remember when the recall shock happened. After I notified them I went back 3 weeks later to ask the shock status. They said it was backordered for 2 months. This sounded strange so i called Buell CS.. They had shipped it 2 weeks before and it was sitiing in a box at the dealer. Buell CS knew this but the dealer had no idea what the shock was for! Upsetting to say the least especially for a HD top 5 dealer! Luckily I no longer have to deal with them. The Central TX dealers are much better. | ||
| M1combat |
I agree... Lots of good info in this discussion. I've so far been lucky to have one of the dealerships that's a little better than average. They just dropped Buell (or Buell dropped them, I don't know) and they still seem to be fine with Buell from a service and support stand point. However... I broke a throttle cable the other day. I called them up to see if they had one in stock. They didn't. They checked to see if anyone else in the state did... No dice. I asked why they don't stock throttle/clutch cables, a belt and maybe one set of brake pads for each end. They guy (the head parts guy) got kind of flippant and said "Hey, no one else in the state stocks Buell parts so why should I? I don't feel bad one bit." I got the feeling he was about to say "How do you like them apples?" I just said "Well, if you were the only one in the state that DID stock those parts... Wouldn't you be the one selling them?" He didn't have much to say about that, but I can tell from this experience and talking to him in person that he personally doesn't care for the brand. the service guy is excellent. Both the department head and the tech that works on Buells (he rides a Duck) seem to like Buells, but the sales people and the parts department seem to have a problem. I've actually put a good deal of thought (I'm sure not as much as some people) into why this is the case... The best thing I can come up with is a combination of comfort zone and the mis-conceived notion that Buell's tend to attract the "wrong" type of crowd for a Tee-shirt boutique... | ||
| Scooterroid |
I have received a Customer Service Survey phone call after my last 3 recent visits to the dealership service department. 1. Flat tire - Road King - dealership sent a pick-up and trailer to pick me up along side the interstate in the middle of summer. I was 20 miles away. They were there in 20 minutes with a cold bottle of water I might add. NO CHARGE. 2. TPS Reset - Buell 3. Flat tire - Buell - on a late Sunday afternoon no less. Service guy stayed to change my tire. I was the last customer that day. They still washed my bike before giving it back to me even though the store was closing and folks were heading home. Better believe I gave rave reviews to the Customer Service Survey people. I pop in to the dealership once in awhile just to hang around and talk with folks there. Nice to be recognized when I come in. I can certainly understand the strained relationships between customers and dealers, though. The dealer where I bought my 1st bike was definitely lacking in customer service and attitude. His service manager eventually left and went to a different dealer. I never went back. I personally have not noticed any difference at my dealer whether I'm buying Harley stuff or Buell stuff. Granted, each dealer is different and bottom line is your experience usually depends on the guy behind the counter; doesn't help anything to antagonize them. Steve-O | ||
| Henrik |
Many of the not so good stories, I believe, come from people getting upset/uncomfortable when faced with a situation different from what they're used to in the daily hum-drum. Rather than taking that as a challenge and as a way for them to learn and expand their horizons, some take it as a PITA biting into their coffee break. For instance: I got stranded on the S3 some yeart ago because the main lead from the battery to the starter motor broke inside the crimp-on connector by the starter motor. I called Motow, who in turn called the nearest HD dealer (granted, not a Buell dealer at the time). It was Saturday afternoon at about 1 pm, I could have gotten a tow there by about 3 pm (closing time). Dealer said "no dice" because they didn't have the tools to work on Buells. Now, going by the book he'd be absolutely correct. But since what I needed was a large crimp-on connector and a pair of crimping pliers, I'm sure we could have found an HD tools that would do the job (tongue firmly planted in cheek). Instead I rigged a temporary fix with a piece of solid 12 AWG wire and a wire nut. Got me home. And it's (now) a fun story to tell. Kinda like the story where I was conned out of $10 here in NYC and later that night ended up chasing the con artist around the Upper West Side on my old Shovelhead. Well worth the $10 The point ... that some people find it easier/more comfortable to just say No without considering the issue. Henrik |
