| Author | Message | ||
     Sambodean |
I have a 1997 Buell s1 that decided to give me some issues today. I was cruising on the highway around 80 and then, out of nowhere, amoke started pouring out from the carb/air cleaner area, and I dramatically lost power . As the engine bogged down, I pulled to the shoulder and stopped. There is oil all over the right hand side of the engine, I'm assuming it came through the two breather ports on the head. There's still a little bit of oil in the engine, and the oil light didn't come on. The engine will start, but runs poorly and will not idle on it's own. At this point I'm assuming the oil pump went bad, broke a ring on one of the pistons, and the lack of compression is causing it to run poor and not idle? I'll do a compression test as soon as I get it towed back 😕. And ideas? Thoughts? | ||
| Buelliedan |
I would agree that it sounds like you have a piston issue. | ||
| Hootowl |
Don't Panic. Get the bike home, get the oil cleaned up, and see if you can see where it's coming from. A sheared oil pump gear would result in no oil pressure, so that's probably not it. Don't start the bike again if you think you have mechanical damage. That will only make things worse by possibly breaking things that aren't currently broken. If it hadn't been for the loss of power, I'd guess you simply had a spectacular rocker box gasket failure, but since there was, that doesn't sound like a reasonable explanation. | ||
| Lakes |
Sounds like it has wet sumped, also oil pump not scavenging. but first , do you ride the bike a lot? or has it been standing for a while? & how long where you riding for when the issue showed up? like has been said check it out before riding. sounds to me like motor full of oil thats why not much oil in oil tank. | ||
| Sambodean |
I ride the bike fairly often. It coughed up oil out of the breather ports about a week again, and the oil light came on sporadically, but it went away right after I started it up again. So basically I most likely need a new oil pump? And what would cause the motor to get full of oil , some random port blocked? | ||
| Ratbuell |
So wait...it sumped oil and the light came on a week ago, and you continued to ride it?? And then, today's issue was "from out of nowhere"?? Put the keys down, and step away from the motorcycle. Buy a factory service manual, or take it to a qualified mechanic to have it checked out. | ||
| Sambodean |
Thanks for the "advice" ratbuell. When oil came out the side of the vents a week ago, it wasn't near the same amount as this time. The bike was shut down immediately, and then a manual was read. The conclusion was Harley's "just do this" http://www.mklsportster.com/xloilblowbyarticle.htm. And that I needed to buy some kit to reroute it all. The oil light never came on again, and the bike ran fine (until now). Ps. I like to learn how to fix things, which is part of the reason why I'm a diesel mechanic in the military, and I don't want to waste my money or time replying to comments like yours, or sending my bike to overpriced mechanics at the dealership. | ||
| Sambodean |
Ps, any advice on how I should proceed? Do I just assume the oil pumps bad and replace it, along with draining the oil and filling it back up again and crossing my fingers when I hit the starter button? | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
There are two oil pumps running on the same shaft. One goes into the engine and the other goes out of the engine. On my 1979 sportster, a chunk of roller bearing fell into the outbound gerotor, jamming it. There are shear pins on the shaft so the pressure side continued to supply oil to the engine. The oil light only came on when the tank was done pimping into the sump of the engine. I suggest dropping your pump assembly and opening it up so see if something is jammed in there. | ||
| Sambodean |
Thank you for the prompt reply. Does anyone know the part number for the oil pump on the 1997 Buell s1? | ||
| Littlebuggles |
26204-91A Quick and easy with Twin Motorcycle's new online parts catalog: http://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/webshop/parts.asp?ja ar=1997&model=9F6A4FD9-CC1F-4A8C-920F-8889EE4BC085 &sid=A3A0F6A6-13A9-4854-BF66-606D416BADB1 | ||
| Sambodean |
Thank you so much littlebuggles!!! Much appreciated | ||
| Kalali |
Good luck and let us know how you make out. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
It sounds very much like you've holed a piston. Do you have a lack of compression? Remove plug, TDC, is there a hole? Crankcase pressure (via the holed piston) is what's blown oil out of your intake. Your oil light didn't illuminate as there was still sufficient oil to give enough pressure. Rocket in England | ||
| Reepicheep |
You can inspect the oil pump pinion gear by dropping the oil pump and looking up into the cam cavity. (Or, possibly but hopefully not in your case, by observing a handfull of shrapnel that comes out of that cavity). | ||
| Sambodean |
Im prepared for the worst folks. Thank you all for your wealth of knowledge and insight. We will know by tomorrow afternoon. And I seriously hope I haven’t gotten a hole in my piston! (Message edited by sambodean on May 31, 2014) | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Holes in pistons are a simple enough fix. Oil pump failures are more likely to be catastrophic from 80mph! Good luck  Rocket in England | ||
| Sambodean |
pulled the pump today. Perfectly fine. used a borescope and thats when sh** it the fan. the forward cylinder is fine, the rear, had chunks of metal on it, I'm assuming i lost a valve. anyways, I'm pretty sure the head is destroyed, and ill have to get a new piston. Anyone know of someone who's willing to get rid of a head for cheap?Ive included pictures for your amusement.    | ||
| Littlebuggles |
That's too bad Sam, hope the rebuild goes well for you! | ||
| Littlebuggles |
Probably a great time to upgrade to Thunderstorm heads, or even XB/new gen XL heads. | ||
| Sambodean |
little bugles, the thunderstorm heads, is there a harley part number? if i upgraded to new heads from the thunderstorm, xb, or xl, would i have to change anything else like pushrods and pistons? | ||
| Littlebuggles |
You would want XB/XL pistons for the XB/XL heads, I'm not sure on the thunderstorms, those came on my bike so I tend to skip reading those particular threads... | ||
| Ratbuell |
Thunderstorm heads require thunderstorm pistons. | ||
| Sambodean |
thank you both for the helpful info! | ||
| Screamer |
There are ways to use thunderstorm heads with "non-thunderstorm" flat top pistons. You can adjust the combustion chamber volume by removing material from the gasket surface on the head or cylinder (or both). That would allow you to still use flat top pistons and achieve the same static compression ratio as using thunderstorm pistons. The down side - you need to also shorten (or use adjustable) pushrods. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Looks like you've got some serious ring damage. Same effect as hole in piston! I doubt the cylinder head will be beyond repair. It could be a little pebble dashed but unlikely nothing a file and some rubbing paper won't take care of. Valves will require lapping in, or replacement. There will be piston damage. Cylinder might hone, or need replacing. If it'll hone you could get away with replacing just the piston with a like for like piston (kit). Rocket in England | ||
| Sambodean |
just found an entire top end set up from an xb9, pistons, pushrods, heads, jugs, rocker boxes, and even the throttle body/intake manifold with injectors. My only question is, are these heads the same ones that are on the xb12? Ive read a lot about the XB heads being superior, but does that mean both xb12 and xb9 heads are compatible? | ||
| Sambodean |
i know the xb9 has a shorter stroke, so I'm assuming i would just use the pistons, heads/rocker covers, and everything should be fine? no need to swap pushrods? | ||
| Brother_in_buells |
See last pic for xb9 vs xb12 piston difference http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/384 2/724598.html?1382364251 the rest of the xb9 and xb12 cylinders and heads are all the same. | ||
| Buelliedan |
I figured it was a piston. XB9s and 12s use the same heads and cylinders. Just the pistons are different. You can use XB9 pistons on a 1200 crank but you will have very high compression which I would only recommend for racing as it can have issues with todays pump gas. You should consider getting a 1250 kit with the correct pistons, PM me if you want more details about that. XB heads are a bit shorter than your stock heads so it is recommended to get custom shorter pushrods and you will also need a billet front motor mount which I can also help you with. (Message edited by buelliedan on June 01, 2014) |
