| Author | Message | ||
     Outdoors |
My M2 is a reliable shifter and I can locate neutral from a stop no problem however the basic Harley box is far from a slick shifting piece. My clutch and primary are adjusted as per Beullistic's suggestions. Does anyone have any experience with the Baker smooth shift kit for the 5 speed? Is it worth the cost and does it provide a worthwhile improvement or is the complete Baker transmission required to really get a nice shift? (shorter, slicker shifts) I really don't have any need for a 6 speed box on my bike. Thanks for any personal experience that you can provide. | ||
| Sloppy |
I always felt the biggest downfall of the Buell was the tranny. I tried a Banke shifter upgrade, 6 different transmission oils, rebuilt the transmission twice and all improved the transmission, but didn't quite meet my expectations until... I invested in the Baker 5 speed kit. And WOW! I can't sing the praises enough. It shifts better than ANY bike I've owned (that would be 7 bikes) and it absolutely shines on track days. I've NEVER had a missed shift with the Baker. And you can customize your gear ratios too! I went with the 5 speed as I don't cruise at 80+ mph on the freeway and Buell engine makes a low and wide spread torque so I had no need for the 6 speed. If you shop around on the internet you can find vastly different prices. The Baker 5 speed kit is by far the best upgrade I ever made. | ||
| Buellistic |
When you buy BAKER TRANSMISSION/BETTER PARTS you are still getting a basic H-D transmission THAT IS VERY PRODUCT IMPROVED ... BUT if you can not do your own transmission product improvements, it will be cheaper to get a BAKER 6 SPEED ... THERE are a lot of things that can be done to the OEM transmission to make it better/smoother, "BUT" you still have to have the PRIMARY CHAIN, Drive Belt, and the Clutch adjusted correctly ... And a lot of miles on the transmission will make an OEM transmission shift better(mine has a 110,400.9 miles on it as of the last ride) ... Outdoors, if you want some additional help "INFO", just PM me and it is yours "ASAP" ... | ||
| Brinnutz |
Well, I had a new shift drum in my new, and newly installed tranny, polished by one of our members and it shifts much, much smoother. FWIW, I want a 6-speed in the future... But then I also want two (or more) sleds, a Ford diesel truck (not a 6.0L or 6.4L POS), seven (or more) bikes, a mountain bike, a boat, a $5 million a month salary, and an honorary PhD. I guess I should just start shitting in one hand and wishing in another to see which fills first eh? (Message edited by brinnutz on December 10, 2010) | ||
| Outdoors |
Sloppy, Just so I understand. Did you get the smooth shift kit or a complete Baker 5 speed assembly (all I see listed is a 6 speed)? I'm happy with most parts of my Buell, except the transmission. My '79 Triumph Bonnieville has much shorter and smoother shifts! I had considered selling the Buell to buy another old Triumph ( a T160 Trident) however it looks like the M2 will be staying so I need to get a decent shock and improve the transmission to be happy. I'm not into bling just better function. (Message edited by outdoors on December 10, 2010) | ||
| Dave_02_1200 |
Wes, You agree right about the way a well sorted out Triumph shifts. I have 3 1970s with 4 speeds and a 1978 with a 5 speed. All shift very well. My Buells don't shift as cleanly as the Triumphs but, with the right clutch and primary chain adjustment (per instructions from Buellistic) they are much better than when I got them. I suspect that I will be able to improve things further at some point by correcting end play and polishing the moving parts. Also, technique is very different. Shifting the Buells is a more..."active" process but a deliberate and well-timed shift can give good results. | ||
| Da_fraemda |
Hallo together, I have now my second X1 with a Baker 6 speed. And both are much tricky to shift than the OEM drive. I have missed shifts several times per raid with the Baker. With the OEM drive it was only one per week. But a 6 speed is the only way to be fast enough on the autobahn. Is there any possibility to improve the shifting precision without go back to the OEM parts? | ||
| Firemanjim |
You miss shifts with a Baker???!!! Never once with mine. Look to see what is up. Outdoors, there was an updated shift detent plate--had a different profile--that helped my bikes,and check to see if the little spring that holds pressure against that detent is worn out,then make sure all the pins are seated as they tend to wander out and throw things off.And always use a new clip to hold the plate on. | ||
| Buellistic |
This all goes back to NO MATTER HOW GOOD THE TRANSMISSION IS SUPPOSED TO BE, if the CLUTCH, PRIMARY CHAIN, DRIVE BELT, and ERGONOMICS of your FOOT TO SHIFT LEVER are not PROPERLY ADJUSTED all is LOST !!! NOT FORGETTING the OEM TRANSMISSION has to be "UP-DATED"/WORN PARTS REPACED and SET UP CORRECTLY !!! (Message edited by buellistic on December 10, 2010) | ||
| Outdoors |
My '00 M2 is a very low mile bike as I was the first owner beginning in 2007. It has less than 7000 km on it and the primary, clutch, and belt are adjusted as per Beullistic's recommendations. I believe that it works as well as any Buell/XL OEM box can. Only very rarely will a shift be missed going from 1st to 2nd and that it pretty much due to me not being "positive" enough with my foot action. What would interest me, is if there was a mod or product that could decrease the amount of throw required and to make it a more crisp shift. I have a Banke shifter installed which helped some. Due to the extreme price, the Baker is not a "buy to try out" item so I was wondering if it, or something else would give me what I'm looking for. Thanks to all who have provided your personal experiences. | ||
| Sloppy |
I have "THE" Baker 5 speed kit. It consists of the entire transmission. While doing the standard adjustments to the OEM unit do improve the shifting, it wasn't anywhere near to my liking, especially on track days. The Baker transformed the transmission. While expensive, I liken the purchase to what I would be willing to pay for the bike when I bought it IF it originally had this transmission. And that would be a resounding YES! While the salespeople like to say the Baker is a slip in and forget it, it's not true. You may have to grind a portion of the shifter pawl to clear the detent plate. From memory the clearance on my 3rd/4th shift was too tight so I had to slightly grind it down. If you are having problems with shifting the Baker, this is likely your problem. If you don't install it correctly you will get a "stalled" shift. The proper adjustments and directions are available direct from Baker. If you're not comfortable with the cost then shop around. I found it for a good price but since they're not sponsors of this site I won't advertise them. The Baker is a +10 upgrade for me. Here are details of their 5 speed: BAKER™ Sportster® 5-Speed Builder's Kits * BAKER 6061-T6 billet trap door. * Andrews aircraft alloy gears. Dog teeth have lead-in ramps for smoother shifting. * BAKER shift drums with conventional shift pattern (1-down, 4-up) or reverse pattern. * BAKER billet detent plate and low effort spring. P/N - Description 101 - Stock ratios; see XL6 section of this page 111 - 2.61 1st, stock 2nd-5th, 47 MPH in 1st 121 - 2.37 1st, 1.88 2nd, stock 3rd-5th; 52 MPH in 1st gear, 66 MPH in 2nd 131 - 2.03 1st, 1.67 2nd, 1.36 3rd, 1.16 4th, stock 5th, 61 MPH in 1st, 74 MPH in 2nd, 91 MPH in 3rd, 107 MPH in 4th (Message edited by sloppy on December 10, 2010) | ||
| Jayvee |
The Baker shift drum and billet trap door are lower cost options, used along with a good shifter (Banke is not a sponsor, but that's what I have) might be good enough for some, wouldn't cost near as much as the whole kit. I also replaced the clutch spring with the Ulysses one, that was noticeable. Primary chain adjustment makes a difference you can feel, clutch/clutch cable adjustment too. I wound up buying the whole 6-speed kit (less than retail) installed by Vallejo HD. It does shift much better, but it includes the shift drum and billet trap door, so other than another gear on top, I'm not sure the rest is that noticeably smoother shifting part. I didn't think the gears are undercut (back-cut) it's not that good. My stock old Yamaha XV920R shifted better than my Buell with Baker does. And Zipper's lists a service to back-cut the Baker 6-speed. The gear on top seemed like overkill, until 3 months ago, I started working about 30 miles east of here. An all freeway commute, and the cars are generally going 80-ish. So that really made me glad I got it. 80 is about 3200 rpm, I guess about 85 is the sweet spot. Don't get to use it that much now, I just changed to another office, only 12 miles away. | ||
| Velocity |
Before you spend the cash for a baker, contact Mark at R&D Motor sports , have it massaged and back cut. It will shift like a dream! All my S2T's and drag bike and road race bike have there worked trans in them. Great to work with, mine are still shifting years later. Drag bike 5 seasons and counting. Scott | ||
| 14d |
When I had my tranny out I had a local machinist polish my shift drum, silver solder the pins and tap it for a bolt to hold the detent plate (getting rid of the flimsy C clip). This improved the shifting considerably and only cost me 20-30 bucks.  | ||
| Fast1075 |
What is remarkable Scott...I made the same recommendation privately. I occasionally ride a KZ "650" Kawi that I sold to a friend a few years ago...it has an R&D 1-2-3 auto trans...9 years old, still works flawlessly....runs 9.40's with a touch of nitrous. | ||
| Terrycoxusa |
The cheapest item of all to improve your shifting is a stout pair of motorcycle boots. Less give in the top of the toe equals better upshifts. Adjusting the shift lever properly will help too. When I bought my S3 the lever was much too high. My stock tranny shifts firmly, but never misses a gear or neutral. | ||
| V74 |
i have a 1999 M2 and planning some work in the primary over winter, i cant afford a baker but was thinking about the later detent plate,is it an upgrade worth doing as the one on the baker unit seems very similar to the old style i have ??? | ||
| Sloppy |
The Baker set uses Andrews gear sets with back cut gears... You can piece together a combination that works well enough or invest in a package. If you don't want to worry about missed shifts during track days then a full package (Bakers, Andrews, Zippers, NHRS, Cycle Rama, etc) is well worth the investment. I was impressed with the Baker so I'll recommend it. If you don't normally do full throttle shifts then the other suggestions will work fine. Up to each individual rider. | ||
| Sdecp |
Mark at R&D is doing my transmission for my X1. I was looking into getting a Baker and I read a post where someone recommended his shop. Mark blew me away when I called and asked him a couple of questions. If you are going to upgrade your tyranny, I definitely recommend at least giving him a call. | ||
| Slayer5690 |
What does mark at R&D do to to the trans? I'm considering upgrading mine in the next year or so and I'm interested in seeing all my options | ||
| Jayvee |
Which "R&D" ? I found several, from California to Pennsylvania...don't necessarily need a link, a city/State would be enough. | ||
| Rex |
My baker 6 speed and banke shifter lever is okay in my 97 M2. pretty slick. my buell s2 5 speed is about as smooth though. Pretty slick and finds neutral easliy. | ||
| Eshardball |
My S3 had the gears back cut by the PO and shifts quite nicely. I just went into my S1 to change the crank seal and did the upgraded detent plate at a whopping $6. As Buellistic stated" proper primary chain and clutch adjustment" | ||
| Buellistic |
DO NOT FORGET the proper adjustment on the DRIVE BELT as if TOO TIGHT(constant pressure) by way of the COUNTER SHAFT to the rear by way of the counter shaft sprocket which keeps pressure on the COUNTER SHAFT BEARING in the TRAP DOOR ... Remember the CLUTCH BASKET is on the end of the counter shaft ... | ||
| Fast1075 |
www.r-dmotorsports.com is the link. You can go directly to them...Mark will be more than happy to discuss your needs....listen to him...he KNOWS what he is talking about. Or thru Cycle Rama, a fine sponsor here. In any case Mark and crew are top notch...and Pammy and Wes at Cycle Rama have a good grip on Buell performance with multiple record holding engine/bikes to their credit. They also KNOW what they are doing. A good shop will completely disassemble the trans, magnafux everything to checks for cracks, and make the required mods for your intended use and heat treat the parts...a possible option is cryo treatment. Reassemble using all new bushings, bearings and rings... | ||
| Sdecp |
Sorry Slayer5690 and Jayvee. I just got back to this thread. I think Fast1075 pretty much covered it. If you have any questions, just PM me. | ||
| Velocity |
I was away from computer also this weekend. Yea Fast1075, they do a great job for the money. I have a baker 6 speed I picked up several years ago that I am going to send done and have them work there magic. It should make the S2T a great highway cruiser! Scott | ||
| Davefl |
+1 on R&D. They do good work. | ||
| Outdoors |
I appreciate your input and experiences. I will give R-D a call to see if what I am after is reasonable. |
