| Author | Message | ||
     Cityxslicker |
We have all biatched about it enough. It is time for solutions, and from a practical, business minded, market driven approach that embraces individual freedom and choice. It is TIME to admit - it doesn't take a village; and we are done with socialist memes and vices. So - here is the call. Professionals here in the Banking, Capital, Venture Capital, and Insurance widgets; we can fix it - or at least provide a well optioned and underwritten solution. The exemptive path to this model focuses on being NON - Present. ie - one of the few exemptions that are available to the general public. As corporate entities are now 'individuals' and vice versa - by locating a company OUTSIDE of the CONUS jurisdiction; you could 1) sell policies as they need to be written for both profit and coverage 2) launched ideally from a 'banking' entity and based on an architecture of annuity rather than 'health care' "premium" - again you would be exempt from the ObamaCare legislation and 3) we hobble the market by giving actual paying customers a viable choice AWAY from the exchange and away from statist central communist think. unfortunately - this will not get you out of the IRS tax - but it will move you off the government teet. Who is in ? Nothing like a little disruptive widget to throw off their machine ;_) Feel free to chime in here - or PM 15 Years Insurance experience - Previous Licensed Agent, Broker, and Auditor 15 Years Military Intelligence fighting against communists, soviets, and Marxist f*cks. and I have read the bill - and every subsequent memo of theirs that I can get my hands on. Lets kill this beast. | ||
| Reindog |
Uhh....OK, but you might want to write in English. To repeat myself, here is what can be done to fix health care for everyone. 1. Tort Reform. 2. HSA Accounts. 3. Insurance being competitive across state lines. 4. Empowerment of RNs over MDs. 5. Drop in health care centers for cash ala Walmart. 6. Concierge medical practises. 7. Secure electronic health records. 8. Portability of insurance. 9. Whatever you said in your initial post. Are any of these being done? Nope. Instead, the power mongers are trying to destroy America in a Soviet style tyranny of the individual. | ||
| Xdigitalx |
We have all biatched about it enough. No.. not quite imho. I want more please. (in the media) I mean... rub it in harder, till they cry. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
It is essentially a 'Key Man' policy that uses a Life Policy (term, annuity, whole, variable or indexed) as the main underwritten risk WITH a catastrophic Health Care policy as a rider. With the life policy - current and viable commercial industry icons (NYLife, Mutual of O, Aetna, etc) certify the life policies as they have always done - age, health, smoking, and the catastrophic is ONLY issued as a surplus lines rider upon the sub policy once it is approved. If the policy gains cash value - that amount is put to deductibles, and non covered medical costs (routine services are still the responsibility of the individual - in full) it keeps the cost down is underwritten for true risk and is outside of the govt perview. the Key Man policies have been around for 25 years at least - they are viable, proven, and marketable. Health Care - as written - as implemented, are a poor vehicle for the market and needs at hand. And yes - it will make the Dem's OWN ObamaCare - because any one with money and a self determination of choice will LEAVE the exchange. Hobble it by leading the performers out and drowning it in expenses Tattoo their name upon it. | ||
| Sifo |
The one thing that I do agree with in ACA is addressing preexisting conditions. I don't agree with how ACA does this though. I can see something along the lines of how suicide is often handled in life insurance. They treat suicide on a new policy like a preexist condition so to speak and wont pay out on a new policy. This prevents a suicidal person from buying insurance for the purpose of providing for their family. Typically after 12-24 months suicide becomes a cause of death that would have the policy pay out. A similar sort of thing could be done with health insurance. Have diabetes and no insurance? No problem, you can get insurance, but diabetes will not be covered for XX months. If you have insurance and get diabetes, you are granted the ability to change insurance companies if desired. Still, there's a lot of devil in the details stuff there, but it's a basic starting point. Tell the insurance companies it's going to happen and bring them in on discussions on how to make it work. Yes, it will raise insurance premiums. There is no free shit! | ||
| Court |
This approach would be an excellent solution. It's doable, can be made efficient and can allow us to realize the benefits of having private insurance free from the inherent chicanery (which we're witnessing daily) of government trying to run something outside the scope of their competency.
>>>I want more please. (in the media) I mean... rub it in harder, till they cry. I've written my Democrat Senator (embroiled in his own child prostitute problems) and told him I intend to donate both time and money to seeing every SOB, himself among that number, tossed out who SUPPORTED the creation of the ••••••• mess we're in. I'd urge each of you to write (you'll have to write on paper, their e-mails generally don't accept e-mail from outside their own districts) each democrat up for reelection and let them know they've blown it and it's time for them to move along. The current administration, in my opinion, is intent on dividing America against itself. Trust me, the wealthy folks are having no health care problems. Many are banding in groups and crating their own "co-op" medical plans. i.e. 25 folks each pay $100,000, hire a doctor, rent him a place and he is theirs. If middle America doesn't get off their complacent asses this is going to get very ugly. | ||
| Sifo |
Ain't that just peachy! Obamacare Architect Refuses to Testify | ||
| Rexter |
It’s simple… repeal ObomaCare and enact 3 simple laws 1. Remove the tax exemption for business that purchase health insurance for their employees and add an exemption for individuals who purchase their own insurance. 2. Create a medical Bankruptcy law something like this. If you have outstanding medical bills in excess of $10,000.00 creditors cannot collect or charge interest until the medical bills are paid. 3. De-regulate the insurance industry. The biggest problem with health care is the patient/doctor relationship is not a customer/supplier relationship. The doctor (hospital or other provider) works for the insurance companies and the insurance companies work for the employers. The patient is 3rd on the list. The doctor doesn’t care about the patient because he doesn’t work for him and the patient is not concerned about cost because he does not pay it. The first law will encourage medical bills to be paid as you go for most doctor visits and insurance will go back to the way it was intended… to pay for catastrophic illness or accidents. This type of insurance is relatively inexpensive. The second biggest problem is that people purchase cars, cell phones, TVs, etc… before they purchase health insurance. The second law would cause any business that issues credit or long-term contracts to have a requirement that the person have health insurance before doing business. Some companies would take the risk, but the rates would be higher to offset the risk and give an incentive to purchase insurance. The Third law would allow Insurance companies to be creative in finding ways to save money and be competitive. Yes… some people would be taken advantage of, but that is up to due diligence of the customer and is not the role of government. | ||
| Ducbsa |
Rexter, #2 could be gamed to avoid debt responsibilities and I haven't experienced a doctor that didn't care about me. I do agree that the patient should have a more direct relationship on cost with the doctor. | ||
| Sifo |
I do agree that the patient should have a more direct relationship on cost with the doctor. This is only done by getting the patient involved in paying for the services. This new legislation does the opposite by requiring that insurance cover routine services. If you're auto insurance covered oil changes you wouldn't care about an oil change costing $300. Of course you would be bitching when you have to pay your insurance premium that has gone sky high. Why would you expect health insurance to be any different? | ||
| Blake |
>>> I haven't experienced a doctor that didn't care about me. Most who have had such an unfortunate experience are dead, my father-in-law and brother-in-law included. You have to understand that your own singular experience is not a valid statistical basis for gauging doctor malpractice. The industry is rife with it. Don't dare inconvenience a selfish doctor by falling seriously ill over the holiday. Just like police, there are many very good and conscientious doctors, but there are also a significant number of really bad ones. Great thread Brian! What will my "tax" penalty be for using such a plan? I've not lost my individual plan, but it's been grossly altered to cover all kinds of stuff that I don't want or need, jacking the rate up by around 40%. (Message edited by blake on November 17, 2013) | ||
| Ducbsa |
"If you're auto insurance covered oil changes you wouldn't care about an oil change costing $300." I saw this when, in MN, windshield replacement companies would give you a box of steaks and later $250+ cash for picking them. The cost was just passed on to the insurance company. I understand the state legislature passed a law requiring full reimbursement, so naturally abuse occurred. That did change after a few years when the idiocy of it was apparent. To Blake, yes, it is a singular experience, but I was replying to a generalization that is a pretty broad brush. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
I have positioned my proposal to a couple of banks overseas - IF I can get approval for them to run the markets - I will of course have to disappear, change my name, leave the continent - and of course become persona non grata back here ; but f' it. I swore an oath to defend and uphold the Constitution - and if that means doing it from abroad to subvert the meme of the O - then call it good enough already - bags already packed. who is the most dangerous person ? one that is well read and has nothing left but vengence and wrath to live for F' it. F' every last m'f-ing one of them. | ||
| Blake |
That's a very poor reason to live my friend. When we have difficulty seeing the myriad of beauty and blessings of creation, it may be time to take a serious holiday from current events. Oppose tyranny and oppression and evil? Absolutely! Allow it to subvert us to its ways? May God please help us, no. The only sure way for freedom and good to triumph over tyranny is for a genuine revival of morality and deference to our creator. Absent that, evil shall continue to spread its divisive covetous tentacles. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
and so we differ on how to kill and defeat the enemy. If you subvert their money, their power, their iconography - you can drop a house on them If you use their own money, power and idiom to do it - all the better. Money Changers outside of the temple - it is a meme as old as Christ himself | ||
| Blake |
Oh no sir. Just what we ought to live for. We fight a war to win, no punches pulled, absolutely. Yet, absent a moral and religious people, freedom will always fail. The root cause of the entire problem is an ideology of covetousness. That's one of the big ten no-no's. Revering the state above all else is another. | ||
| Hootowl |
Yeah, another big no-no. | ||
| Cityxslicker |
I am not of the mind that if you just hug and love a Nazi they will change who they are and what drives them. and it is no different for me , for this guy and his crew. I am not interested in loving them, or hugging them - at all. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
The only sure way for freedom and good to triumph over tyranny is for a genuine revival of morality. I'll agree with you to that point Blake, for myself you can keep the religion. I understand that for you it's a large & important part of your life & I respect that & even envy you a little your faith. Personally I live morally but not religiously & find no problem doing so, I think many more people are prepared to join a moral fight than a religious one, & there are many like me, please don't let your personal religious beliefs prevent you from accepting fellow travelers who may not share them. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Morals without faith is like faith without morals. You are wanking. Nothing wrong with that if that's what you are into, just don't kid yourself that you aren't wanking. Notice I said faith, and not religion. I'd argue that religion is generally just a fancy name for "morals without faith". Faith is very personal, and like a relationship, it is a unique manifestation of a unique intersection of the believer and believee. That's not to say there aren't absolute wrongs and rights for faith and for morals... It's just to say they may be confusing and hard to recognize and its worth really understanding someone and their story before coming to a conclusion. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Oh I have plenty of faith, in myself mostly.  My faith in humanity has taken a bit of a pasting the last few years though. Perhaps I should have said religious belief in my first post, but it didn't scan as nicely. | ||
| Aesquire |
http://www.pjtv.com/?cmd=mpg&mpid=80 I'm not especially religious, and don't support any "Church" as a social/political structure. Simply because bureaucracies become the purpose of bureaucracies. As an American, I fully, totally, support religious freedom. Up to the point where it interferes with another's. Not, mind you where it annoys someone. If you are offended because someone prays 5 times a day on a rigid schedule, too bad. Suck it up. I'm on their side. If someone insists you not do so, when it's your thing, I will support you. If they insist you do so when you don't want to, I support you. We are a nation of folk who's ancestors came here to get away from that crap. For a huge number of people now alive, and growing, they ARE the folk who fled from tyranny, and tyranny almost always includes "Worship Who I Say". To simplify, I will defend to their deaths your right to think any damn silly thing you want to about sky gods, Ancient Ones, or that Brittany Spears is a better singer than Pink. No matter how freaking Wrong you are. The above vid discusses understanding that your political enemies are human and really want the right thing Morally, as you do. Yes some leaders and exploiters of the Mob are evil in fact, but most people who vote for the ones we consider "bad" just want people to be happy, no one to starve, and justice. Yes, many are ignorant that the means chosen by their leaders to accomplish these grand ideals, just don't work and make it worse. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Me & Mr Aesquire rowing the same boat. He's more eloquent than me though. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Thats the "conservatism" we need to get back too... | ||
| Zane |
Tort reform is a good first step so that doctors don't have to practice "Defensive Medicine". Let’s get the lawyers out of the process as much as possible. As part of tort reform, next tackle malpractice insurance. Doctors that have never had a claim still have to pay ridiculous amounts of insurance to protect themselves against malpractice claims. Those costs get passed on to you and me. HSA accounts are a good thing but involves the IRS. My medical care isn’t any of the government s damn business. Make more use on non MD's. Nurses, Nurse Practitioners, Midwifes, Physician Assistants; I don't need an MD when I know I have a sinus infection before I ever walk in the door. Any PA or Nurse Practitioner has more than enough training and experience to look up my nose and see I have an infection. I don’t want an PA doing my hip replacement or heart transplant but 85% of what a doctor does, a PA or NP can do just as well if not better. Of course allow insurance companies to sell across state lines. Let the market place work the way it should without interference. How about a la carte insurance? It’s a good bet my 72 year old sister is never going to need OB care again. Why should she be forced to pay for it? I’m pretty happy with my level of crazy, so why do I need to pay for psychological coverage? I grudgingly admit that there needs to be some sort of government oversight but how much does all the government red tape contribute to the cost of medical care? Too damn much, I’d wager. The federal government should never be allowed to regulate anything really important. They just screw it up. | ||
| Reindog |
Thanks, Zane. Don't forget insurance portability and denial of ALL health care to illegal aliens. If the illegal alien statement is too harsh for Bleeding Heart Liberals, then make reciprocity health care with Mexico. However Mexico treats its non-citizens for health care, so shall we. | ||
| Sifo |
So how come the things we see a need to fix, and have solutions to fix it, are for the most part ignored by ObamaDontCare? Yeah, it's rhetorical.  | ||
| Skntpig |
The only folks that I know that had insurance a year ago, and now went to renew, are pleasantly surprised at their much better coverage and lower payment. More of their prescriptions are covered other than in one case I know of. That particular case the prescribed drug isn't covered and wasn't before. Keep in mind these folks...wait for it ...are conservative republicans and they aren't happy about it. It's weird to hear them say like their new Obama care. Anyone else here have a personal story... or something that wasn't a copy and paste from a fair and balanced internet source? My favorite game is to count the threads here that aren't political based just to see how many comments until someone says "Obama made me do it". It's really funny. Thanks for all the entertainment RightWeb. Thanks Obama for helping me change my tire. Flame away. Haha | ||
| Skntpig |
Court...I normally agree with you but I just re-read your post. I don't believe you. Maybe I don't understand your point. Please help me understand. Are you part of this group? 25 people in this country hired a private surgeon and agreed they will only go to that Dr? They won't be calling 911 if that Dr. doesn't answer on their last day? This must be some doctor. I hope he is a neurosurgeon and an orthopedic surgeon and an.... It seems odd to find anyone, someone, so well versed in all aspects of medicine that you (and yours) would decide to rely on this one Dr's talents. I would like to hear more. When they signed up did they cancel all their other health care coverage? I hope he doesn't have a bad day. Is this your dermatologist or your cardiologist? I hope I'm wrong. Please name one example one of these groups. PS thanks for your contribution to this great forum. | ||
| Aesquire |
I'm still investigating my options. So far the limits on drugs are MORE restrictive, but the limits on Mental health and Free Birth Control would be nice If I were a crazy lady instead of a man. Prices are higher. Looks like about 200% or more, but I'll have a final price to give in a few days. Deductible is up, as is co-pay. Lucky me I'm in New York where the prices were insanely high before, so I'm hoping I don't have to pay the 500% price boost. Of course this is temporary, since they are "through work" plans. That market is expected to drop 193 million Americans per Obama Administration estimates. Or a total of about 1/3 of all Americans will lose their current coverage, leaving mostly Federal Employees with old plans. Off to the doctors this AM. ( not the time traveling ones..... still waiting for that ) Gee, Skntpig, I'm still upset that Hillary was cheated out of the nomination by the Obama Campaign that faked many of the signatures on at least one state's primary petitions. SHE promised to take care of my Mortgage. Under Obama, I pay every penny. To be fair, Obama's minions never promised me that. So I'm going to have to wait for Hillary to defeat the (incompetent Country Club bozo the R Party Masters think turn it is) before she can rule with an iron fist and straighten out Obama's mess. "What difference, at this point, does it make?" Heck of a campaign slogan, eh? |
