| Author | Message | ||
     Court |
By the way ....... That system gas worked since I had my first IMTS ( my number was YP-80895) which was a gorgeous pastel green with a rotary disk and 13 VHF channels... Weighed in at about 80# and used the best vacuum tubes Motorola could buy. | ||
| Froggy |
Wrong, I am talking about pre installed from day one software. My Xoom, which I bought almost a year ago, had this functionality right out the box. Advantage Android. http://www.forbes.com/sites/ericsavitz/2011/11/23/ microsofts-craig-mundie-on-siri-been-there-done-th at-video/
Advantage nobody here. Every portable I own (including my Nokia N800 which is older than Iphone 1) has a central repository that lets you quickly and easily manage, update and uninstall what is on your phone.
Too bad, because with AutoCad on Android you can. I love the "oh its fast enough" type comments, sounds like something right out of the Uly and XB sections when antiquated motors are being compared to the latest and greatest.  My Asus Transformer Prime tablet will have more graphical capabilities and processing power than the Xbox. The Apple video you linked mentioned that with the new A5 processor, web browsing is twice as fast. In that case, with the Prime it would be 8 times faster. Oh, and you still can't use Flash. | ||
| Guell |
}See the thing is, I don't want to have to load, maintain or look after all manner of aftermarket apps. Advantage iPhone. uh, i dont have to do that on my android, and i can still go and visit any site that has flash. Last i checked, iphones cant do that. Why does the iphone have the advantage? because they are trendy? Do i need to bring up koolaide again? | ||
| Blake |
You're not listening. Nothing can touch the integration and ease of use of the iPhone. It's what Apple does and they finally got it right with their phone. The industry is ditching Flash, including Adobe. It's history. No idea where you get your browser prediction. AutoCad is a design/drafting app. It doesn't do anything like what I described. For that you need to spend around ten grand minimum; the better software is double that. | ||
| Guell |
integration? I really dont need to talk into my phone for it to do something for me. And the google voice integration works pretty good. Not sure if its as good as siri, but i dont care if it is, i wont ever buy an iphone. Oh, and there are plenty of websites that still use flash, so i can happily browse them while flash is still used. Advantge android. (Message edited by guell on November 30, 2011) | ||
| Blake |
>>> 8MP camera - Great, its an even higher revolution crappy phone camera. 8MP isn't even anything to brag about, unless you beat Samsung to the punch in 2008. The camera on the iPhone is pretty darn good. Not sure why you'd try to badmouth it. Better camera is good. >>> Siri - Voice dictation and commands have existed in Android and Windows phones for years. As it has been on the iPhone as well, but via a separate app that was not anywhere near as well integrated into the phone. The Siri technology is a whole new level of voice recognition. >>> I can say "Call Mom" and it calls. I can ask "Where is Westchester Medical Center?" and it opens up Google Maps with the hospital selected. I can have it type what I speak into messages with great accuracy, but I haven't figured out how to get it to respond to "Set an alarm for 7am" yet. Or any of a number of other really neat integrated functions offered by Siri. >>> The video goes on to talk about more crap that has been on other devices for years, like image stabilization, camera automatic focusing, and basic photo editing. Other "devices" you say? What you seem to be missing is that what I am asserting is so exceptional is the seamless integration and performance of ALL the above features into one billet solid device. There just is no competition. Cloud services have been around for some time. Yes. Apple is not inventing that technology. Apple is providing it as an integral part of their products' OS. The cloud service is built in; you don't have to go off and arrange/pay for it separately, and it works seamlessly across all apple devices capable of running iOS5. It's part of the OS. >>> Call me when Apple does something new and original. You mean like redefine how we use a telephone? LOL. How long has Android been around? >>> I don't like settling for technology that is 3 years behind the curve at next years prices, why should you? I care little for how old a technology is. I ride air-cooled pushrod motorcycles. They work exceptionally well for how I use them. My concern is that a device/service work well and as effortlessly as possible. Advantage iPhone. I have no idea what you are talking about. I'm still using an iPhone 3G and it works wonderfully. But, I'm now looking forward to a 4GS and all it's much enhanced/improved offerings. I've never had any trouble viewing youtube. | ||
| Blake |
>>> Why does the iphone have the advantage? because they are trendy? No, because they provide all the above mentioned capability/services in one seamlessly integrated system in a rock solid device. >>> Do i need to bring up koolaide again? Only if you wish to reveal your insecurity and ignorance. I don't get the iPhone haters. Seems some feel threatened that someone likes something different, or that an iPhone might provide some enhanced value compared to some other preferred phone. Denying the exceptional capability and value that has been integrated seamlessly into the iPhone is just bizarre. (Message edited by blake on November 30, 2011) | ||
| Court |
Groggy: Well......... You may have me and my iPhone bested on this one. I've been saying " call Froggy's mom"...... For the last 2 hours So far .... No luck and I've got 2 Afghan guys, both named "Frageismahm" in Newark really pissed off. You win that round damnit. | ||
| Court |
Hahahaha.......you angered Apple ......look what my iPad did to "Froggy"! That'll learn y'all !! | ||
| Blake |
Frank, >>> My Xoom, which I bought almost a year ago, had this functionality right out the box. Are you saying that your Xoom includes a voice interface that works seamlessly with texting, mapping, web searches, email, calendar, alarms, etc? | ||
| Blake |
When I listened to the video of the microsoft guy trying to downplay Siri, he failed. His explanation was nothing like what the iPhone provides. He is talking about a collection of individual apps that on their own include voice recognition. Fail. Proof... BWAHAHAHAHAH!!! Microsoft fail. Having the technology actually work would seem to be a valuable point. | ||
| Blake |
Frank, Forbes on TellMe versus Siri, and the very MS boob's interview that you invoked to support your argument... http://www.forbes.com/sites/ericsavitz/2011/11/23/ microsofts-craig-mundie-on-siri-been-there-done-th at-video/ Last week a Microsoft exec made headlines by dismissing Apple’s Siri as good marketing, claiming that Windows Phone has had the same functionality for over a year. The statement is easy fodder for flocks of Apple fanboys, but even the Android faithful and mobile agnostics agree that it’s an inaccurate statement. Now, pouring salt on Microsoft’s wounds, a side-by-side video has been made that makes the remark look even more foolish. | ||
| Blake |
More reporting on Tellme versus Siri: The thing is that, the Tellme features are spread all over the Windows Phone functionality, while Siri on the other hand, is an all-in-one package, containing not only all that the Windows Phone can do, but 10 times more than that. | ||
| Blake |
OUCH!!! http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2011/11/26/the-dif ference-between-microsofts-tellme-and-apples-siri- is-an-ability-to-deliver/ | ||
| Blake |
While Microsoft envisions the future Apple delivers Apple bought Siri for a cool $200M. Seems they pulled a Microsoft. | ||
| Froggy |
You have never used anything else. I have been using portable devices since the 90's, I've used Symbian, Windows Mobile, Android, Maemo, PalmOS, BlackberryOS, WebOS, iOS, and possibly some others that I can't recall off the top of my head. iOS is good, they have had years to polish it and make it easy to use and intergrated like you say, but it is far from the best I've ever seen.
Yep, but for the next 4 or so years, Flash will still be around and prevalent on the web. Till then, I maintain the advantage. Apple might not play ball with whatever else replaces it either, they seem to have a history of trying to force people to change to their standards.
There is a possibility that similar software exists on Android, I don't know every single application that exists. I have played around with ACad on my tablet, it is fun despite the fact I don't know what on earth I'm doing!
Not Siri good, but for something that doesn't use AI software like Wolfram, and the fact its been out for a year before Siri, its damn impressive.
The iPhone camera is garbage. I can instantly tell when someone posts an iphone photo, without fail indoor photos with white objects like walls have large red and green halos around them. 
Right, so far all I know that Siri can do that my old tablet can't is set an alarm.
You seem to be missing that this seamless integration of editing features and basic automatic camera adjustments is nothing new, unless you are an Apple user.
Ok you got me there, DropBox and Amazon Cloud aren't built in on Android, and probably never will be. I haven't heard anything in terms of a true Google Cloud, but the Google Docs and Google Music come with it and are cloud services.
It didn't redefine anything. They just polished up the GUI, removed any ability to install whatever you want, then put it in a fancy box. Oh, and don't forget about the best marketing department in the world to push it, they can literally make anything sell. Android's roots go all the way back to 2003, Google aquired it in 2005, and released Android beta in 2007, and version 1.0 in 2008. Needless to say, Good old Windows Mobile/Pocket PC date back to 2002 and is based off of Windows CE from the 90's.
Effort is pretty much the same between Android and iOS. Android has some things in the GUI that are stupid, iOS is just as guilty too. Both are easy to use, but the only real advantage that Apple has is stricter rules for applications regarding interfaces. As result, things are more consistent. I'm still sorry to hear that you don't mind old technology that can't do whatever you want just because Steve said so.
Open up this thread in your browser, and try and play the two videos above in your browser. You can't. Advantage Android. Hell, my Nokia N800 which again predates iPhone 1 can use Flash without issue.
Try the competition with open eyes, you will see there are a lot of great phones out there that meet or exceed the iPhone experience.
Same thing can be said about the iPhone fanboys that blindly accept everything Steve blessed without question. Hell I even read a while back about how Apple fanboys often exhibit cult like behaviors.
See if it corrects Camaro into Camry. MS Word seems to like screwing with me there!
Everything except the alarm like I noted earlier. I'm sure there are some other things that it wont recognize as commands, as it isn't as developed as Siri. The new Android Ice Cream Sandwich OS will be sent to my tablet soon, I'll have to see if they stepped up the game.
Hell I got to give Siri some credit, even I couldn't figure out what that guy was saying half of the time. I have only briefly used WinPho 7, so I haven't tested it in detail, but my understanding is that the voice software is more command based than statement based like the iphone. You would say "open calender" then issue the calender related command. The way it was done in the video was he was searching the web for things instead of issuing commands. It should of gotten the "What time is it in Perth", but it is possible it didn't reconize his accent. For the hell of it I tried it on my xoom, it kept thinking I was asking "What time is it in person". It worked fine when I asked what time it was in Sydney, London, and Paris. Asking the play the music was hilarious, I couldn't guess what name he said either. Siri's voice software isn't perfect with its pickup either, I tried it at the Apple store, I made sure there already was an alarm set, and then asked it "Don't wake me up tomorrow morning". It set up another alarm. I agree with the Android head about Siri. It is a bit of a novelty more than anything at this point, but knowing Apple they aren't going to leave it alone. I wouldn't expect them too leave it after spending all that cash on it! | ||
| Blake |
I'm no Apple fanboy. Just read some of my posts concerning their computers from years ago. Garbage. I have compared phones and how they work. I cannot disagree with you more strongly. The Siri thing is a huge leap ahead of anything anyone has done with voice so far. I don't understand why my computer isn't similarly endowed. I can't do Apple for a computer. | ||
| Blake |
It's certainly no gimick when you can drive and use your phone hands free to set meetings and text people and... It's darned miraculous to me. Some it seems have become a bit jaded and fail to see the incredible achievement. Apparently, Jobs was right about Flash. It's successor is supposedly HTML5, fully iPhone compatible. | ||
| Nik |
The big advantage iOS has over Android is Apple's control of the devices. App developers know exactly when iOS versions become obsolete by their host devices going off contract, so they can know which version to develop for. Even the latest Android phones are released with OS versions 3 or 4 behind with no upgrade available from their manufactures. Another big advantage the iPhone and most Apple devices is build quality. For example the cases and frames of my iPhone and MacBook Pro are machined from billet and screwed together, not some cheap snap together plastic castings. | ||
| Guell |
It will be interesting next year when im up for a new phone. Siri looks really promising, moreso than tellme, and i havnt seen anything special on the android phones (trust me ive tried using the voice features on mine, no bueno) I love my evo, but as Nik mentioned, the android phones are fragmented with everyone using a different os. Even on the same os there are variations. | ||
| Xb1125r |
I could not understand what the guy was saying, I guess the the microsoft phone recognizes American English and the apple phone recognizes British English | ||
| Hootowl |
British English is more believable. That's why any documentary worth its salt has a British narrator. Heck, if Al Gore had a British accent, we'd all be living in grass huts, grubbing for insects, and wondering why its so damn cold outside. | ||
| Froggy |
Nope, the biggest leap is due to it being advertised so heavily.
The functionality has been built into Windows since at least XP. I've used it a little bit in XP, thought it was kinda lame. Windows 7 does it much better, but I still don't use it much as it is slower for me to say "Open word" then speak out my sentence than to click the shortcut and type it. Xbox Kinect uses the same functionally, and it is just as useless as it is faster for me to press a button than say "xbox eject" or "xbox pause".
I can't stand OSX either, but thats an entirely different thread.
It is faster and easier to do it the regular way, and not to mention you are still driving distracted when you are arguing with your phone when it misinterprets what you say. It does not have 100% accuracy like in the commercials.
It remains to be seen if HTML5 actually takes off, it isn't compatible with all browsers, and uptake has been unusually slow for something so powerful.
That is their biggest weakness too. Apple is the only provider, so you are stuck with only one choice. Windows Phone has a tightly controlled set spec, but still has several manufacturers making similar products so you have some variety, making it possible to have more affordable models and more powerful models. Given they still have to conform to a tight spec, you don't have compatibility issues to worry about when programming.
That has not been the case, ever. The worst I have ever seen was a new model that is one version behind, and thats because the new OS recently came out, then it will get an OTA update to it in the near future. Old phones in general don't get upgraded to a newer OS just due to planned obsolescence, they want you to get a new phone and contract. My Xoom, being that it isn't tied to a provider, will be getting the new Android Ice Cream Sandwich despite its age. Hell it already has had 3 updates since I purchased it.
Thats another huge disadvantage. While the metals feel nicer, they aren't as durable. The devices have less of an ability to survive a fall and other accidental damage unscathed. Glass screens are even more delicate. My plastic phone is going on 4 years old has survived numerous bike wrecks, fallen out of my pocket on the highway, been run over, dropped in a river, melted in the sun, and who knows what else. It still works fine. A plastic GameBoy survived a bomb in Iraq and is on display at the Nintendo store in NYC. My Xoom on the other hand slipped out of my hand and hit a sidewalk, it shattered the screen and dented the case. Your Macbook would surely receive similar damage. Remember, as cheesy as they looked, the Saturn cars had plastic body panels that were undingable in normal day to day abuse. A runaway shopping cart can easily cave in the metal door on a Toyota. | ||
| Blake |
Hey Frank. I'm seeing another side of you. What happened? I mean really, if you think that the iPhone is just good marketing, I don't know what to say. I certainly won't disagree that it has some excellent marketing. The think is, it does what is advertised, which is more than any other phone, and does so better, cleaner, and more seamlessly than any other phone I've seen. Not to mention the incredible quality of the aesthetics and the hardware itself. It pained me to admit all that, as I didn't much care for Apple after having suffered through interminable problems trying to use one; that was back in the OS9 era. That and I've otherwise always used PC's. I'm set in my ways and like the PC. | ||
| Pwnzor |
For me, it's as simple as this: Apple rules what you can do with their devices, with some exceptions. Android devices allow me to rule what I do, with no exceptions. I just got an OTA update on my Droid 1 last night. I can root/unroot my phone at will, although I generally leave it unrooted. I've got a jumbo battery that I can pop in, and literally lasts for days on end with constant use. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Do they still make phone calls, I mean like actually talking to someone? That's mostly what I use a mobile phone for, the odd text message & checking email. The camera feature is handy from time to time in my line of work too, but I don't really need huge definition. I've no desire to watch videos on such a tiny screen, my eyesight's bad enough already. Proper internet I'll either sit in my den/office using the home pc, or (as now) I'll use the netbook which has keys that my fingers fit. So what do you recommend when I have to replace my Nokia E series? | ||
| Nik |
That has not been the case, ever. The worst I have ever seen was a new model that is one version behind, and thats because the new OS recently came out, then it will get an OTA update to it in the near future. Old phones in general don't get upgraded to a newer OS just due to planned obsolescence, they want you to get a new phone and contract. My Xoom, being that it isn't tied to a provider, will be getting the new Android Ice Cream Sandwich despite its age. Hell it already has had 3 updates since I purchased it. http://theunderstatement.com/post/11982112928/andr oid-orphans-visualizing-a-sad-history-of-support You're right, my memory was off and some are only one version behind when first released, then quickly fall more behind as they aren't updated. iPhones are supported for at least as long as the typical 2 year contract. Android phones with few exceptions are not. Thats another huge disadvantage. While the metals feel nicer, they aren't as durable. The devices have less of an ability to survive a fall and other accidental damage unscathed. Glass screens are even more delicate. My plastic phone is going on 4 years old has survived numerous bike wrecks, fallen out of my pocket on the highway, been run over, dropped in a river, melted in the sun, and who knows what else. It still works fine. A plastic GameBoy survived a bomb in Iraq and is on display at the Nintendo store in NYC. I guess we'll just we'll just have to agree to disagree on that one. In all the computers I've owned or worked on the metal Macs have had better build quality and withstood more abuse. (Message edited by Nik on December 01, 2011) | ||
| Froggy |
Good chart, but it is missing data. There are some phones missing, and it does not define what a "major update" is. Android has also been updating faster than iOS, so that fact alone makes the devices look outdated faster. In 2011 alone, Android has released 2.1, 2.2, 2.3, 3.0, 3.1, 3.2 and 4.0, not including sub versions. It takes more work for the various OEMs to get everything up to date, and they aren't going to invest much in updating everything if they can make more money off getting you a newer model.
Spend the same amount on a PC and you get an equal or better quality PC. Macs are only available with top shelf components, PCs are available either cheap or top shelf depending on what you get. Also, I am yet to see any Macs that are built to meet military specs. I've never seen a Mac literally save someones life by stopping a bullet like a Panasonic laptop has.
Depends, mine can't, it is purely data only now. It is extremely rare I need to make a voice call, so I usually do them from a land line. Not worth the extra fees to have voice service. To replace your E-series? Tough to say, it is hard to justify smartphones if you don't think you are going to use them, but you might get it and realize it is the best thing ever. Phone selection in Europe is different, so I can't really point you in any specific direction. Stop at some phone stores and play around with everything, tell the salesmen to feck off and have some fun, see what you like and don't like. | ||
| Blake |
Innes, You are exactly where I was concerning the phone, right before I got the iPhone. I primarily got it so I could access personal email from the General Dynamic's facility. Then I started becoming familiar with it and got hooked on the music capacity, the camera and video, then the GPS. Being able to google, check email or text while talking on the phone comes in handy. | ||
| Court |
Blake: You have described, with unusual brevity and clarity for an engineer , precisely the reason I use the iPhone. I am certain, beyond doubt, that for someone who knows, and cares, what tethering, bricking, jail breaking and all that stuff is, that there are a myriad of far superior choices. I'm somewhat stupid, somewhat lazy and somewhat apathetic. And entrepreneur at heart . . . I want RESULTS . . that's all. The iPhone seems to work for me and I'm confident that I've not scratched the surface. Jon can make his walk around the house I think. But anything I do to ANY of my 9 e-mail accounts, calendar or any of the functions I use appears nearly sameultiumesouly on all my machines in NYC and Kansas . . at home, in the car, at work and at school. This is one of those discussions where I am fairly certain everyone is right. If you were as lazy as me . . . this would all be clear. |
