| Author | Message | ||
     Froggy |
Rest of the article here: http://www.ydr.com/opinion/ci_19164404 | ||
| Rwven |
Here is the disconnect. Harley's stock price had already risen on the expectation that they were going to do even better than they did. When the numbers came in lower than expected the price dropped from the inflated high. | ||
| Just_ziptab |
I would hazard these guesses. The people that can easily afford a 30K harley..have their eye on a bigger prize.With everything basically handed to them,they probably don't want anything to do with noise and chrome. Just wouldn't fit in with the snooty neighbors/lifestyle. The non struggling average working man buys the 30K harley.......and he is not non struggling anymore. Honda will be making hula hoops in the harley factories soon enuf.  | ||
| Whatever |
Ask those people that got let go how this great new Harley is... | ||
| Court |
>>>>The people that can easily afford a 30K harley..have their eye on a bigger prize.With everything basically handed to them How do you decide that folks who can easily afford a 30K bike have everything "basically handed to them". Do you think a person who rides a TW200 and makes $2.4M a year works hard or has everything handed to them? What about a person who makes $65,000,000 a year? 3 of my neighbors have purchased Ferraris in the last year . . they are the 3 hardest working folks I know. I wouldn't touch their jobs. But they have never had ANYTHING handed to them . . they work their asses off. | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
great post court (and I really wish I could live in your neighborhood) Youre right, its silly to make assumptions that cause someone has a $30k motorcycle that everything has been handed to them. And lets not forget the fact that not all HDs are 30k, many are around half of that. But whatever. Now cue Blake calling me a cheerleader.... | ||
| Danger_dave |
Yeah. My wife works extreeeeely hard for everything I have. | ||
| Court |
Ditto :-) | ||
| Just_ziptab |
What I mean is.....not that they don't work hard............but that after work,they buy everything, They don't fix their car or wash it,don't cook,don't do laundry,don't pay bills,don't mow the yard,don't repair their home,don't cut firewood for their fire pit...they hire out everything............ and have no interest in a petty $30K motorcycle. I suppose it's OK to live like that and even if I could....I wouldn't. | ||
| Boogiman1981 |
how do you know if you don't have the ability to choose that lifestyle? as for those that don't do the 'house work' you ever think it's because they don't have the actual time for it? the execs that i know don't more often than not they pull longer days than me then have after work stuff to do as well. not to mention the charity dinners events and 'other community' stuff they do. seriously theres not one single exec that i've ever known that put in less than 60hrs a week. most more than that. the 40hr weeks most of us get would be a vacation for those guys. | ||
| Oldog |
HD has a recall on specific models years '09 - '12 issues with the brakes, so much for stellar US manufactuering.. hey until the problem surfaced I wonder how much the bean counters thought they saved. The arguments are devisive, there are a lot of folks who make 30~40K per year that also work their tails off..... All have seen their earnings steadily erode. Prices for food energy and TAXES have climbed. | ||
| Hootowl |
How can they hire everything out and still pay no bills?  I'm doing something wrong. | ||
| Gregtonn |
http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2011/10/24/harley-d avidson-recalling-308000-motorcycles-for-possible- brake-failure/?intcmp=trending Because the post is by Fox News some may claim its not true. G | ||
| Hootowl |
It's an AP article though. Same one all the others are carrying. | ||
| Court |
>>>Because the post is by Fox News some may claim its not true. Duh. It hit over 100 wire services yesterday. Choose the one that suits your political hankering . . .,
| ||
| Boogiman1981 |
Hoot yeah i'm with you not in the budget to hire it out. i can tell you right this moment if i could afford to i would excepting the rare occasion that i felt like it. to me that's not being lazy that's making time to do other things of higher interest or higher reward. | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
"What I mean is.....not that they don't work hard............but that after work,they buy everything, They don't fix their car or wash it,don't cook,don't do laundry,don't pay bills,don't mow the yard,don't repair their home,don't cut firewood for their fire pit...they hire out everything............ " And? As far as the 'dont pay their bills" part - did you mean to type that? Yeah, so they dont do their own yardwork or fixing of their vehicles, so what? | ||
| Blake |
The author of the topical article is either really ignorant or willfully misleading. Improving upon dismal performance doesn't justify over-valuation of any enterprise. Publicly held corporations publicly declare expected earnings. When they fall short of their own predicted performance, the stock price rightly drops. The author of the article bizarrely neglects that incredibly pertinent fact. Performance talks; lame excuses walk. The HOG P/E (profit to earnings ratio) currently sit just over 20, not at all a conservative valuation. In fact where I sit, it seems over-valued. It's a nostalgia stock. The P/E of Ford stock for instance is currently just over 7. Ford is literally rocking the industry with their product line innovation, value and performance; see "Eco-Boost." Conversely, Harley's plan seems to be to ditch advancement in performance, shun younger riders and more performance oriented market segments and focus instead on high priced "custom" hogs. Would that they had mustered the integrity and foresight to invest in such high end American sport bike products.
Nothing but ignorance and class warfare. The guy appears to be a Marxist. I know MANY good hard working folks who can afford to spend $30K on a motorcycle. Some will own the bike for a decade or more, and they save up and pay cash when they purchase a new one. They are builders, contractors, plumbers, machinists, engineers, entrepreneurs, restaurant owners, the folks living the American dream. True, I don't know any Marxist propagandists who could afford $30K for a new bike. Bitter dishonest people suck. | ||
| Blake |
Yep, ignorant bitter Marxist. No doubt about it. Or maybe he bought a load of HOG at $45/share three months ago looking to make big profit. Then he'd be a greedy ignorant bitter Marxist. Too funny. | ||
| Blake |
HMP, Actually, some are 1/3rd or less the cost of a $30K CVO hog bike. Some are even more, nearer to $40K. If I trusted the integrity of the corporation and valued their vision, I'd be interested in one for comfy two-up riding, couch style. | ||
| Blake |
This is what passes for excellence in advertising at Harley-Davidson these days:
Apparently the Harley-Davidson "Street Bob" is a "bobber" motorcycle that also offers "bobber" appearance, a "bobber" look, a "bobber" seat, and --sit down for this one-- "bobber" styling. <gasp!> I know; unbelievable isn't it? How do they do it?!? What will they achieve next?!? Surely cold fusion isn't far from their reach! As pertains to a motorcycle, I don't even know what the heck "bobber" means. I suspect that only those familiar with Harley or antique motorcycle design culture may. | ||
| Jb2 |
Blake, When WWII vets came home from the war they often bobbed or chopped the fenders to change the appearance. Hence the names "bobber" and "chopper" names for many custom motorcycles. | ||
| Moxnix |
There goes Fat Bob on his Fat Bob. | ||
| Just_ziptab |
How can they hire everything out and still pay no bills? I'm doing something wrong. The accountant handles all the bill paying.........  | ||
| Just_ziptab |
40hr weeks most of us get would be a vacation for those guys. FWIW....I worked 52.5 hours a week straight time for nearly the first 1/3 of my working career......and then it ramped up to 65 hours a week with OT pay for many years on end. 70 to 79 hours some weeks... way too often. Never hit 80 hrs but I did hit 23.5 hours straight at a previous job.The upper 70's weeks were usually 7 day runs.....29 days straight being my record.A few days,no time for even a break,except the microwave breakfast I brought in with me in the A.M. Nobody bakes a cake for me(single) and I still managed to get all the home owning chores done with out hiring out..except getting the mail,since they were always closed when I got back home.Epileptic friend would get it for me and take it to my house. Now I work 40's...management wanted us to"have a life". Production crew works 4/tens and I work 5/eights....and it ain't a leather chair job...........sub zero outdoor work and 117° crows nest and cablevey repairs. I've earned over a million dollars....trouble is,multi millionaire look down their nose at us mere millionaires....  Not bragging,not complaining.....just saying I've been there. Love my job.... Now then,would Keith Wandell ride a $30K harley if he was still at Johnson Controls? | ||
| Kenm123t |
No he didnt ride before. | ||
| Whatever |
A bobber is what you get when you throw a guy with no arms and no legs into the ocean... DUH !!! | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
"HMP, Actually, some are 1/3rd or less the cost of a $30K CVO hog bike. Some are even more, nearer to $40K. " Aware and thank you, maybe that'll help set some people straight on this whole "ALL HARLEYS ARE 25k+!" crap A new sportster can be had for like 7 or 8 grand, few are over the 30k mark the poster above mentioned And yes, I do know of the CVO Electras that are REALLY high priced. With SILLY options, do you REALLY need remote locks on your tourpack? And how much extra are they charging for a HD branded ipod? Again, super nice motorcycles, my father has a 09 Electra and I absolutely love it. CC, ABS, so comfy But over 30k is wild | ||
| Court |
The problem is that the geniuses lack capacity to build the profitable touring bikes in York and were "forced" to build low profit Sportsters in Kansas City. You really couldn't dream up some of the silly tales that are coming out of Juneau . . we'll be hearing more. I still want my "sunny place" in the KC facility next to the 40,000 SF space Porsche was going to rent. There is a hilarious story about Buell and the Kansas City plant. | ||
| Blake |
No there isn't. |
