| Author | Message | ||
     Pwnzor |
Thanks to Al at American Sport Bike , without whom it would have been crazy expensive and a 5 day turnaround. Here's the lowdown: My forks have been pretty trashed for a while, been meaning to handle it for some time. Little did I know just how bad it actually was. I was down at American Sport Bike 2 weeks ago getting some basics, new clutch cable, some other stuff... we discussed my wallowing front end, and my desire to get my forks rebuilt. He referred me to a vendor who, I'm sure, would have done a fine job, but the price tag was a big pill to swallow, especially when the prices for parts were being quoted. I talked to Al again, and he encouraged me to take matters into my own hands. He offered to let me do it at his shop, with his guidance. HOW could I pass up an offer like that? Not while I'm awake, that's for sure. So I headed down there on a Saturday morning with my forks and service manual in hand. Stop and go traffic, and my luck ran out. My first auto accident EVER. (with me as driver) 4 car pileup with me in the front getting hit the hardest. That laid me up for about 10 days and this morning (wednesday) I was finally feeling fit enough to try again so I was on my way. On arrival, Al was on the phone, as always, and Joanne greeted me with the usual friendly smile, making me feel right at home. Al finished up his phone business and we got right to work pulling the forks apart. It's obvious Al's got a broad definition of the word "guidance" because he was hands-on helping me the whole time. There was not one single step of the process where he was not in some way advising or physically helping me. We finally reached a point where it became obvious that we couldn't continue without a special tool, the spring compressor tool. BTW, Harley Davidson won't sell you one. But Al is undaunted by this. He's got lines on everything. The tool we needed arrived within the hour. The springs were compressed, and we got down to the nitty gritty. We opened the leaky fork first, to find the Guide Bushings almost completely bereft of their teflon coating. We hadn't planned on that part needing to be replaced, so it was a quick phone call to the local parts department and we were on our way in minutes. Let me tell you about that briefly. Al has real clout with the parts people down here. He walks right past the counter and into the back, loading up a cart with literally dozens of items. Meanwhile, they are raving about him being their best customer of all time, with a crazy 5 digit figure in sales this year alone. Unreal. Back to the shop, and we're on the job again. Got the "bad" fork completely disassembled, and cleaned out, set aside for the parts to dry. Next we took apart the "good" fork, only to find that the Gude Bushing was actually in WORSE shape! Al will post pictures of this today sometime, so you can see what we're talking about here. There were teflon shavings EVERYWHERE inside the forks, fouling the seals and contributing to the overall sucky performance of my forks as of late. We also discovered evidence of damage caused by the dealer doing the 10k mile service on my forks. Anyway, onward with diligence, we worked together through the day, taking our time to do everything right. All along the way, Al is taking time to explain things to me and teach me all kinds of great facts and little known information about these great machines. He really is the ultimate pantheon of cognizance of all things Buell. Joanne did her part, keeping us fed and hydrated throughout, and handling business in the background so Al could work with me. It was their son's birthday so we did spend a little time playing with a new remote controlled plane, and then searching for it, then flying it again. I even got to climb up on the roof! Never a dull moment. At the end of the day, AL CUTS ME AN INCREDIBLE DEAL ON EVERYTHING, I cannot in all fairness, announce how much I saved on this, but suffice it to say that I am eternally grateful to know these wonderful people. This is the type of customer service my dad used to tell me about, post WW2 era, when people were of a different sort, eager to help each other, and loathe to take the easy way out of anything. Al and Joanne at American Sport Bike exhibit the very qualities that have made this country so great, with their selfless behavior and unending generosity. It is this sort of service which has all but disappeared these days, but I can tell you it is alive and well in Vista, California. I cannot recommend enough that everyone patronize their business, it carries my personal seal of approval, and I'll eat my own hat if someone can honestly say they are not satisfied with their experience. With Al's parts purchase today, I believe he is ready to ship everything needed to anyone who wants to perform their own service on their forks. Special tool included. I left there this evening with a fresh pair of forks, done right, and now I can do it myself thanks to Al's help. I'll be buying that special tool myself as I approach my next service interval, and next time I'll be doing the work right here 3 feet behind where I now sit. Thank you Al and Joanne, you are two truly upstanding citizens of the highest caliber. Integrity, knowledge, service. These are the things you can expect from American Sport Bike. Al should be along with photos of the damaged bushings in a few hours, so check back to see it. I highly recommend learning to do this job yourself, with the manual and the right tool, it is actually very straight forward. Good luck and shop wisely, shop American Sport Bike (Message edited by pwnzor on August 31, 2006) | ||
| Brineusaf |
Awesome summary. Finally we get a story of Al's bravery (attempting to do something without strangling Matt)! Anxious to see these pictures, although I am somewhere like 6k from my 10k service. Good on you Al and Joanne, you are one of reasons owning a Buell is such a great experience! | ||
| Firebolteric_ma |
Hey that reminds me..I need to do mine very soon! That was a most excellent review! I HONESTLY can not state one time that I have spoken to Al that I did not hang the phone up in Awwww. Truely great people there. My wife laughs at me when i get off the phone as i always comment he should be a teacher of all things buell. I always feel like the student who walks away with lots more knowledge than when walking in the room. GOOD ON YOU AL!!!  YOU GET THE 6 STAR RATING!!!! | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
AL IS THE GREATEST. BUT I THOUGHT EVERYONE KNEW THAT ALREADY!!  | ||
| The_new_guy |
Al is the greatest, just ask my credit card company! Customer support is fantastic. Gregg | ||
| Bomber |
I've had occasion to work with Al and Joanne a couple of times (actually, more than that) -- it's always been a great experience, and, like with a few others (very few), I walk away feeling like I've been talking to a friend, rather than to a vendor -- I can only hope they feel similarly when they're down talking to me . . . . thanks for the story P -- how many miles on your forks -- two years is pretty quick to eat all the teflon, I'm thinkin -- certainlhy not slagging you, nor the fork maker, just curious | ||
| Court |
>>>AL IS THE GREATEST. That's an accurate statement. | ||
| Pwnzor |
I'm at 27k miles right now, gonna get it all back together today, hopefully in time ride during daylight. We can't be sure if those bushings were changed at the 10k service (the LAST time I ever let a dealer touch it) so the bushings either had 17k or 27k on them, we'll never be 100% sure. Al's probably getting all his UPS orders ready right now, so I'd expect to see those pictures in about 2 more hours. I'm still loving the good feeling I got from being there yesterday. It was time well spent, a great experience all around. I'm approaching my 3rd anniversary as a Buell owner, here's a pic of day one:  | ||
| M1combat |
Agreed on all points  . Al's a great guy and runs a great business providing brilliant services to us Buellers. Also... Let me tell you... His American Sport Bike BBQ was probably the best ride I've been on (2004 as I recall) followed closely by the AZ Spring fast of '05 (which Al attended). I rebuilt my forks last weekend and had the same issue with the guide bushings. I didn't replace them but I will soon. I think that the parts required to do a fork rebuild should just include those. It should be seals, dust boots, that copper washer and the guide bushings. Maybe the inner guide bushing too (the one that snaps to the fork and doesn't slide). Al... I'm thinking you should get 10' of that PVC tubing in the right size, cut and chop them and sell them for a few dollars as well when someone buys parts for a rebuild. I had a HECK of a time seating my fork seals and I don't think I get them completely seated... | ||
| Oldog |
"American Sport Bike" Al Saved my Butt thanks for sharing, | ||
| Al_lighton |
Thanks for the props, guys. I've done lots of tuber forks, both WP and Showa, but hadn't done an XB yet, so I was glad to help Matt with his. I've never needed the fork spring compressor tool for doing the other forks, but a customer had asked for a quote on the stuff he needed recently to do the whole job, so I just went ahead and bought one. Good thing, because I think it would be a real PITA to do an XB fork without the tool. I'll be keeping this one, and will add the tool ($130) to the web store shortly. It's simple to use, looks like this:  Matt's bushings were really wiped. If I had to guess, the process that adheres the teflon to the bushing must have some issues. The slide bushings were pristine, the oil was pristine, but the guide bushings were history on both forks. I suspect that Matt's seals were probably OK, and the only reason that his leaked were probably due to the teflon particulate matter getting into the seal and holding the edge open for oil to run out. They looked like this:   I'll be putting all this stuff up on the web store shortly. FYI, my local store did not have the bushings in stock under the XB part number. But they are the same on the tube frame bikes for the 03/04 XBs, and they had those in stock, so we were able to complete the job without backordering anything. Al | ||
| Blake |
Wow! Wonderful story number two today, first Queensryching two Buells and now Lightonizing a front suspension.  Thank you Matt and Al! American Sport Bike Rocks! Blake PS: Geez Al, quit trying to hijack the board!  (Just a little inside joke between Al and me. I'm not at all serious.) PPS: What in particular do you suspect the dealer may have done to lead to this premature failure? I only ask in hopes that knowing might help some of us avoid the same mistake. | ||
| Al_lighton |
M1, We had a bit of difficulty getting the first seal to sit. With the second one, I got more aggressive with the heat gun, and it drove home with FAR less effort the first time. The PVC pipe trick works with the 40mm WP and 41mm Showa tuber forks, and the 03/04 XB forks. I'm not sure it will work as well with the 05-07 forks with the extra 2mm diameter (43mm instead of 41mm). I haven't tried it yet on those. Another tool that I've found to be of immense benefit over the years is the fork oil leveling tool. I've done it in the past with a turkey baster, but frankly, it was a PITA. This tool makes quick work of it. I'm going to put it up on the web store as well. What you can't see easily in the picture below is that the tube is graduated in 5mm increments over it's entire length.  Al | ||
| M1combat |
For spring compression I used a ratchet strap from one of the holes in the metal tube (sorry for the non-technical term, I don't have my manual in front of me) that sits on top of the spring to the axle hole. Worked great but admittedly it did deform the lower edge of the hole just a tad. If I had a ratchet strap with a slightly smaller hook it wouldn't have. | ||
| Pwnzor |
I had suspected from the outset that my forks had never been serviced even though I had paid for that service. But when we took them apart we found scars from mishandling that we didn't make, so... I drew the conclusion that they were rough with my gear when they did. Just reinforced my loathing of the typical dealer service experience. Blake, careful before Al bans you!  | ||
| M1combat |
For fork oil level I just added the requisite 14oz (two additions of 7oz each) and called it good... I didn't have anything to be able to measure 4.6"... It seems to be fine . It looked like about 4.6" . | ||
| Pwnzor |
Nice to have the peace of mind that oil leveler gives though... took mere seconds to have it perfect, a great tool to have in my opinion. | ||
| Diablobrian |
I've talked to Al and his wife several times, and they falls into a class of people southerners call "folks" They treat everyone well, you can trust them with your prized possessions, and they stand by their word. In my book being "folks" can sometimes be better than family. Once again thanks Al and Joanne! You rock! | ||
| Pwnzor |
Bike is back together and my forks are so plush, it feels like a brand new bike. I'm almost having to learn to ride again because I've been compensating for the slop all this time. Al, you have delivered me from my agony! Thanks so much again, I can't express it enough.  | ||
| Deltablue |
I Just recently did the same job along with some other service, Unfortunately my Fork Caps were Screwed up trying to remove them, and I had to wait for new parts to arrive. It is a PITA without the compression tool, luckily a neighbor of mine has a machine shop, and we welded a pi to the end of a bar clamp, ($20) and it works beautifully. Just a hint. | ||
| Lady_asb |
Matt, Excellent! Glad to hear you're all set up now and can enjoy your ride  Pleasure having you down in the shop the other day - stop down any time! Joanne | ||
| Pwnzor |
I put about 150 smooth-as-butter miles on today, stopping to make adjustments along the way. Hopefully my fan will arrive tomorrow and I will be all ready for the BBQ in October. I'll stop by the shop next week to show off my baby! much obliged, Matt | ||
| Tbolt_pilot |
I just finished both fork seals on my '98 S3 with the WP forks. It was fairly simple but here are a few points for someone doing it themselves. -Use a length of 1 1/4" PVC to drive out the inner tube (the OD of this tube is perfect) Ensure PVC end is square and smooth, use a rubber mallet with several firm blows. (Try not to shoot it across the workbench like I did!) -A hairdryer worked fine for heating the tube. -I used a layer of masking tape on the top of the inner tube to slide the new seal on. -Recommend using all new washers/spacers. -Check into getting the install/seat tool for the seals that is shown in the manual. It might be worth it for the right price. -Remove the little spring from the seals while seating them. It is fragile and can be rolled back on before the retaining spring goes in. -To measure the oil, I used a stiff wire which I measured off 110mm (4.66") and put a little duct tape 'flag' across it like a T. drop it into the tube with the flag resting on the outer tube, pour in the oil til it just touches the tip of the wire. (after cycling the damper of course) Good luck! Dave |
