| Author | Message | ||
     Phantom5oh |
What's the best way to find the tight spot when I go to adjust my primary chain? I have a 2005 XB12Scg. Thanks | ||
| Jackbequick |
Pull the spark plugs, get the back wheel off the ground with a work stand, put the bike in high gear, remove the primary chain inspection cover, advance the chain in small increments by turning the rear wheel (having a helper to do that is better). After each advance, press upwards firmly with your finger tip and look for the tight spot. You can mark a sideplate with a Sharpie at the tight spot. I found two tight spots on mine. A pretty much agreed to adjustment here is to have 5/8-3/4" of total deflection (up and down) with a firm push of the finger tip. The chain will sag little if any so I usually try to get 5/16"-3/8" of upward movement. Jack | ||
| 2k4xb12 |
I can never remember -- is the adjustment done with a hot or cold chain? | ||
| Jackbequick |
The service manual addresses it being done with a room temp chain and I'm sure most of the discussion here implies the same thing. One quirk of the primary chain is that it is said that the slack diminishes at it gets hot. So if I were checking it hot I'd expect to find it tighter. Jack | ||
| Phantom5oh |
I'm pretty sure the service manual gives specs for adjusting the chain when the bike is "HOT" and "COLD". They just don't mention anything about adjusting it at the tight spot. Sounds like a time consuming PITA to me, but it's gotta be done, and done right. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Just pull the inspection cover, measure, make sure it is neutral, cover the inspection cover hole with a shop rag, and blip the throttle a few times and re-measure a few times until all measurements are within spec. Obviously, make sure your fingers won't get in there, but you would have a pretty hard time hurting yourself even if you tried. No need to jack anything up or pull any plugs, it takes all of 15 minutes even going slowly. | ||
| Phantom5oh |
So you do it with the bike running Reep? Do you use a screwdriver or something solid to lift the chain up and then push it down? I guess I'm curious as to how you deflect the chain to take the measurement? I think I can visualize that... | ||
| Mikej |
DO NOT DO IT WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING! I think Reep meant to say "blip the starter", not the throttle. (I could be wrong though.)  I just put the bike on a rear stand, put the bike in 5th, leave the plugs in, then slowly turn the engine over with the rear wheel. A little looser is better than a little tighter, but too loose is bad too. Aim for 3/4" of total movement. One of the site's members who works at a shop will probably step in here at any moment to correct any wrong measurements. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Doh! Yes, blip the starter, not the throttle, my bad... don't let the bike start.... I keep one hand on the kill switch in case it fires up. Thanks for the correction Mike! Starting would have worked also, but would have been messy!  I use calipers and a screwdriver (without the bike running) to measure deflection. I try and hold the screwdriver perpindicular to the chain, and move it up and down, and see how far it moves. I seem to recall the screwdriver will line up with one of the bolt holes for the inspection cover, and that shows pretty close to the play that should be allowed. | ||
| Jackbequick |
I'd at least pull the leads off the spark plugs if I was going to use the starter. And the bike running deflection checks? Thats not for me. Makes me think of the one eyed, one armed, three fingered bike mechanic I met one time. His name was Lucky but for the life of me I could not figure out why. Lucky rode an old tank shift hog with a suicide (foot) clutch. I tried the starter method but too much chain was moving past too fast, it was like checking spots here and there at random. The anal retentive machinist in me wanted to inspect the entire from start to finish and I did. For what it's worth, I wiped the chain sideplates with a rag wetted with aerosol parts cleaner and marked the tight spots with a Sharpie and the marks were still visible some months later. Those were still the tight spots so the next check went a lot faster. Jack | ||
| Henrik |
Jack - Good idea using the marker. Thanks. Personally I just pull the plugs (S2 - real easy to do), put the bike in 5th gear and use the rear wheel to "bump" the motor and move the primary chain. I'd suggest doing this with the battery disconnected - just to be on the safe side. Henrik (a friend of mine rode a home buils chopper with an open primary - his kickstand was kinda tucked under so he had to reach down and pull the kickstand down using his hand .... and one day he was 1 1/2 fingers short of a handfull ...) | ||
| Reepicheep |
Just for the record, I would never do this running... That was a brain cramp on my first post. I just use the starter to bump the motor and move the chain... and it has worked fine for two buels and 30k+ miles. But you can put on the jack stands and pull the plugs if you want And I think people riding bikes with open primaries are idiots (not to put too fine a point on it). (It does get me thinking though about a bolt on inspection plate cover with spring loaded chain roller on a lever and a scale that would let you adjust tension at idle though....) | ||
| Jackbequick |
Reep - You're right, that was my brain fart, I read "not running" for running. If I was doing it more often, I'd probably use a faster way. I did it twice last year in the course of trouble shooting a noise and upgrading to the newer tensioner. If the marks are still visible the next time I change the primary oil, I'll just use those spots again. I agree about the open primaries. Old "Lucky" I mentioned above was a old school, no cover, dry clutch guy and you could hear his clutch ringing and clattering a block away. Jack | ||
| Dako |
I seem to be having a hard time adjusting my primary. It was quite loose and knocking like hell. Well as I get closer to what I think is spec, the knocking starts to quiet. But now I get a brand new "whirring" noise that gets louder the tighter the chain gets. Is this new noise a sign that I've gone too tight? The chain feels too tight at first touch, but when "pushing firmly" it's right on. Should I be more worried about the "whirring" noise or the knocking noise? I think I should probably just put it to specs and buy a louder exhaust.  Any help would be appreciated. | ||
| Bomber |
setting the chain by sound isn't gonna be accurate, sir -- knokcing ain't good, but my properly set chain does sorta kinda whir (tough to diagnose sounds over the net, ain't it? :-} ) I use an open end wrench of the appropriate size to measure total deflection (3/4 in my case) -- hold the wrench so the defelection (and AND down) is centered on the wrench opening, and you can tell where your at PDQ -- perm marker -- GREAT idear, Jack! Thanks! | ||
| Phantom5oh |
How much tighter is the tight spot on the chain for you guys? What is the difference? Is it easy to spot when doing the check, or are we talking a 1/16 of an inch? | ||
| Buellistic |
3/4 inch on tight spot, "PERIOD" !!! | ||
| Dako |
Thanks Bomber for the "Whir Confirmation"  I like the idea of the open end wrench, but my chain is too high in the inspection window for me to use one. How firmly are we pushing? (as hard as we can with 1 finger?) | ||
| Jackbequick |
Phantom - "How much tighter is the tight spot on the chain..." - If you adjust the loose spot to 3/4" of play and then go to the tight spot, it can use up all or nearly all of the 3/4" leaving you without enough free play in the chain. Daki -"How firmly are we pushing?" As hard as I could is what worked for me, pushing up with the tip of my not very work hardened finger until pain made me want to stop. Jack (Message edited by jackbequick on March 13, 2006) | ||
| Hans |
Am using a wire, bend at 90 degrees, and the short part cut off at exactly the right length. The other end bend somewhat to be able to keep it firmly leaned against the housing, Pushing hard and so hard, that you need counterforce to prevent the bike tipping over, doesn`t make anymore difference. Hans | ||
| Xldevil |
adjusting the primary chain is no rocket science,IMO. Ralph | ||
| Dako |
Thanks for the "finger pressure" advice, and the wire trick! I think I've got it squared away now. I've worked on all my own cars, but this is my first real bike. I'm thankful that this forum is here for newbies like me to learn the tricks of the trade. My Mechanical Ingenuity is Inversely Related to the Money in my Pocket! | ||
| Blake |
What LaFayette (Buellistic) said. When the engine cases and tranny housing expand, the steel chain becomes tighter. That 3/4" play at the tightest spot is very good advice. An overtight chain is not good, very bad in fact for the affected bearings. In other words a little loose is way better than a little tight. I find the tight spot by removing the spark plugs and nudging the engine around via the rear wheel with the bike in 5th gear. | ||
| Phantom5oh |
I guess I was just trying to avoid having to pull the plugs. Laziness abounds... | ||
| Mikej |
Just put the bike into 5th gear with the key off. Have the bike sitting on the sidestand. Open the small inspection cover and take a measurement. Push the bike forward a little, you should be able to bump/nudge/push it along in 5th gear enough to rotate the primary - do not pull in the clutch.  5th gear will give you the best leverage against the compression of the engine. Push slow and you won't have to pull the plugs. Should take less than 20 feet or so to get enough measurements. 'tubers are easier to pull the plugs on. 'tubers rule. (Sorry, I have no idea how that 'tuber commentary got in there.)  | ||
| Reepicheep |
Geesh... just put it in neutral and blip the starter, and hit the kill button a split second later... it's not like the bike is going to wheelie off and start mugging nuns or something... But you can go pulling plugs and pushing bikes in gear around your garage if you want... (sorry, I have a bad attitude today)... | ||
| Bomber |
actually, I think I'd pay money to see my scoot wheelie off and try to mugg a nun -- they're pretty tough round here ;-} | ||
| Mikej |
You do remember the story of the guy who posted here who had started his bike in his garage, went inside to get something, and came back out to find his bike had trashed his garage. I don't think a nun mugging wheelie is too hard to imagine. That's why I don't leave mine unattended when it's running, you just never know what it will do when your back is turned. (grin) | ||
| M1combat |
That 3/4" while cold may work well for a tuber, but too much slack on an XB and you get false neutrals. And only a LITTLE too much slack at that. It'll be hard to put into neutral w/ too little or too much primary fluid as well... Just for the record. | ||
| M1combat |
Yeah Mike... I seem to remember it scratched a car and knocked over all his other bikes but was happily idling at a standstill when he got back... Brilliant . That's the way Buells oughtta be ! Rabble Rousers . | ||
| Buellistic |
"BUELLschitte", 3/4 inch on tight spot, cold "PERIOD" !!! Bike up right, clutch cover off, fluid in transmission when correct will just touch the bottom of SPRING,diaphragm !!! DO NOT PU#%Y foot with the shift lever, just shift !!! Having trouble getting in to NEUTRAL, adjust your clutch correctly !!! | ||
| Grussy |
My neutral light comes on when i pull in the clutch. Does this mean I need to adjust the primary??? |
