| Author | Message | ||
     Shotgun |
Perpinquity, as Maynard G Krebs used to say, Perpinquity. Lubrication by association, as it were. | ||
| Buellistic |
Torqd: "DRIVE BELT" too tight ??? Should have 2 inches of play on tight spot(yes belts have tight spots just like chains) ... Likewise the PRIMARY CHAIN should be adjusted to 5/8 inch to 3/4 inch on the tight spot ... Usually owners and Dealer BUELL Tech's put in a quart of Transmission fluid at the change interval of 5000 miles(ie: it only needs 28 oz.)... This transmission only looses fluid if there is something wrong or over filled ... In BUELLing LaFayette | ||
| Rippin |
Frank you've got mail! | ||
| Empire |
I have a problem with shifting. I have an 01 S3 that just started a VERY loud bang when I shift from neutral to first. I have 41000 miles and there was always a little clunk or click when I shifted from neutral but this is loud now. I have always run Mobil 1 synthetic in the primary drive. I've tried cracking the throttle before I shift sometimes it seems to help and others not but I never had to do that before. I suppose I can check the clutch adjustment and primary chain but this seems more serious. could it be some tranny gears hanging up? Thanks | ||
| Buellistic |
Empire: First step is to check the CLUTCH ADJUSTMENT ... If the clutch adjustment does not stay in adjustment you will need to replace the the SPRING PLATE PN 37977-90 ... "AND" what "i" mean by replacing is with one(1) FRICTION PLATE PN 37911-90 and two(2) STEEL PLATEs PN 37913-90 ... This makes for a better longer lasting clitch ... This SPRING PLATE usually lasts between 50k to 70K depending how hard you are on the clutch !!! As for your PRIMARY CHAIN, adjust it to 5/8 inches to 3/4 inches on the tight spot ... "AND" for good measure adjust the DRIVE BELT(chain) to 2 inches on the tight spot ... In BUELLing LaFayette | ||
| Captainkirk |
Check those things first. If that doesn't help, I'd look at the detent plate and the nasty little "c" clip that holds it in place. The shift drum pins could be backing out, causing the c-clip to break, and so on. This involves pulling the primary chain and sprockets + clutch pack, but it's really not a big job. Let me know if you need add'l info. | ||
| José_quiñones |
So my bike decided to stop shifting after the first (and probably only) track day I did on my S3 last Sunday. I finally got everything out (Thanks Karl!) and here's what I found:  First look shows the detent plate worn down (by the clutch?), bent and sitting crooked on the shift drum. That clip setup is silly. After getting the tranny out I tried to get the shift drum out but the last fork (for 3rd and 5th gear) would not slide off the drum. After some struggle I got it off the drum and found:    | ||
| José_quiñones |
Questions Can the drum be fixed (filed down) to get rid of that burr or is it just better to get a new one? Shift Fork, same question. That Baker setup is tempting, hey Al..... | ||
| José_quiñones |
I should have read S3Thunder's post above, you DON'T need to remove the output sprocket on the right side of the bike to remove the tranny! That's only needed if you need to work on the fifth gear assembly. The manual makes it sound like you really need to. Would have saved myself $40..... | ||
| Bluelightning |
Jose, I talked to my friend. He has the tool at the shop but he left for the weekend and headed out to the beach. So if you don't get all the parts by next week I'll try to meet up with him and get what you need. He also asked why we removed the nut if we were not working on 5th gear. I agree that the manual is sometimes silly in how it shows to remove things! | ||
| Reepicheep |
Mine was slightly raised on the shift drum also, and I filed it down, and got a significant improvement in shifting as a result. No problems for the next 10k miles. It was not quite that bad, but it was noticable. The clip thing is annoying, there should be a better way. But so long as I have always used a new replacement clip, it always held for me. | ||
| Bluzm2 |
José I did the same as Bill, for the drum. I didn't mess with the fork however, just replaces it. It was about $35 if memory serves. Check the shift dogs and slots carefully. I missed a worn corner on 2nd gear set and am having 1st to second shifting issues. I have to be very deliberate or I'll miss 2nd. I'll take care of it this winter. | ||
| Reepicheep |
As I think back about this, I actually beveled the problem areas inward slightly to give more margin for this to not be a problem in the future. | ||
| José_quiñones |
Blue, Cool, no rush I went ahead and ordered the Baker smooth shift kit from Americansportbike.com. It should get here next week. I should have all the other parts by then. I'll try to file the drum and shift fork to see what I can do, but I might have to buy a new shift fork just for peace of mind. Thanks for the feedback guys! | ||
| Benm2 |
The standard clip does seem weak, but I always assumed that it was designed to have some "float" in the detent plate for a reason. I also think that there is a newer detent plate available that's supposed to improve the shifting. That looks different than mine, the "points" between the gears are more "pointy" if I remember right. Good luck with the rest of the rebuild! | ||
| Jmartz |
Jose: Its time for a Baker shift kit. You will not be disappointed. Get rid of that rounded top, leave gears in the middle, detent plate. | ||
| Chauly |
I have to replace the main drive bearing, and I was wondering if someone had the bearing removal/installation tool that I could borrow? It looks like a threaded rod with a plate at one end and various stepped collars on the other... | ||
| José_quiñones |
José Smooth shift kit is on the way from Al at AmericanSportBike. Hopefully the bike will be back on the road by this weekend. Thanks! | ||
| Bluzm2 |
José Keep us posted, I'm considering the same... | ||
| Jmartz |
A couple of years back I splurged and got a Baker 6. This is something the the bike does not need, it is expensive, heavier, the gears are the old "LOW CONTACT" type, and 6th is only useful at 90 mph even with the 26 trans pulley. One thing, however, it shifts like a Ducati. Que paso con la Pescadora? | ||
| José_quiñones |
No tengo idea, estaran jugando todavia con la EPA? | ||
| S3thunder |
I have a problem with the shift shaft assembly being loose. This is on a 1996 S1 that we recently had apart to change the primary tensioner. When reassembling, we messed up the original shift arm and banged it on with a mallet. Is it likely that the clip on the back end of the shift shaft assembly came off as a result? The whole shaft can move in and out about 1/2 inch. It comes out far enough to contact the ring gear (audible grinding) but still will shift. My son still rides it in this condition. Can the shift shaft assembly be repaired without removing the clutch basket? Any pictures and help would be greatly appreciated as the only picture I have is in the parts manual. Thanks | ||
| Reepicheep |
The bolt is probably just loose. You will have to pull the clutch pack, primary chain, and stator magnet cup together as a single assembly. Just two nuts, not a big deal (though they are huge freaking nuts). The hardest part of the job will be driving to Sears to get the sockets. Once you do that, the problem should be obvious and easy to fix. On reassembly, use the metal primary gasket (now stock) and be sure to clean both shafts with brake parts cleaner before putting the nuts back then use the right locktite and the proper torque on reassembly. The crank nut has been known to back off if you are not careful. While you are in there, it might be a good time to check your crank seal. 20k mile failures would be pretty typical. You will also only be about 5 bolts from having the transmission out and on your bench so you can inspect the 5th gear drive assembly (and the transmission), so that is definately worth considering. Pulling the tranny requires no mechanical talent, it comes out as an intact cartridge. | ||
| Sleez |
can't believe i haven't seen anyone ask this yet; can the 06 tranny be retrofitted into a tube framer??? | ||
| Sparky |
Sleez, I think it would have to be an entire engine/trans transplant. The tubers have a cassette style trans whereas the XBs trans internals are meant for a split-case dealeo. Whether the XB gearsets and all would fit, I dunno. | ||
| Panic |
I'm attempting to assemble a table giving all 5 (& 6) speed transmission ratio choices, RPM recovery on shift, etc. but I'm getting mixed results from data furnished by Andrews, H-D, Baker etc. Can anyone give me the actual tooth counts (not ratios) for all gears by year (it's not in my M2 2K manuals)? | ||
| Tattsailor |
New here guys but have been on my M2 since 2001. Having some serious breather puking problems. Here is the background. Have my breather routed up to my Lisc plate with a breather filter at the end. Just changed my trans fluid, added 3/4 quart thought it was overfilled last time. Pulled 100hp and 87lb on the Dyno last week so dont think it is the inner seal. When I go on long rides or ride her pretty hard with high revs, she pukes like a gaging ••••• on my rear tire. You guys have any ideas that I could help resolve the matter. Thanks Clint | ||
| Jackbequick |
I noticed in your profile you say the transmission breather is puking oil. If that is what you're asking about, it's important to make that distinction or people will think it is the more traditional engine breather issue (the two vent lines from the rocker arm covers). Jack | ||
| Reepicheep |
Tatt... why do you think an EXCELLENT dyno run (that M2 must have had some pretty good work done on it) would preclude a leaking crank seal? Crank seal leaks are common, easy to fix, and show the exact symptoms you are describing. | ||
| Tattsailor |
Jack and Reep, I know its not the CRANKCASE BREATHER, these things are two completely differnt things. I run my Trans breather like I said up to where my Lisc plate exists. Reep Yeah I do have work done on the bike, Nallin 1250 kit, stage 2 headwork, SE cams. that work was done last week at Bennett's Performance in LB, and they don't think it would pull those numbers with a seal problem, do you? I know it sounds like the exact problem. Well it doesn't hurt to get it checked out huh? Thanks for your input guy, this problem is really pissing me off! TATTS | ||
| Shotgun |
Tatt. nobody knows better than Reep about that seal. I have done the seal twice myself and I don't think it would affect your dyno on iota. All it's doing is forcing a little oil into the primary and the primary can only take so much and then it pukes it on your rear wheel. You'd only notice it on the dyno when the wheel slipped from too much puking oil. Grasshoper, listen to Reep! | ||
| Henrik |
Tatts; what Reep is saying is, that when the crank case seal goes, pressure and oil from the crank case pushes engine oil into the primary/tranny - in a manner speaking "overfilling" your primary, which in turn will make your tranny breather puke as you describe. The crank seal leaking will not have any effect on a dyno run. Henrik | ||
| Tattsailor |
Gotcha, I understand better now. Cool! I will get the guys down at bennetts to hook it up. Don't feel like doing it myself. Plus I don't have the facilities. Thanks, Henrik | ||
| Henrik |
Tatts, you're very welcome. If the seal is indeed the problem, make sure they're using the new and improved crank case seal (it's a double lip design) as well as the right tool to insert the seal. If inserted too deep - which is easy to do with Shade Tree Mechanics tools - it will wear out in short order. Henrik | ||
| Bomber |
Hey -- as a dues, paying, card carrying member of the Shade Tree Mechanics Guild, I resemble that remark! Doktor Doom's Garage of Mystery All Work Guarenteed! Midnight Parts Requisitioning! Repair and Despair under one roof! Measure with a ruler, Mark with chalk, Cut with a torch! ;-} | ||
| Sleez |
thanks sparky | ||
| Reepicheep |
Don't make me get out the green tinker toy! | ||
| Jammer |
Need advise, I have a 97 S3. After longer rides were i'm on the freeway for a distance say 50 miles or so, trans fluid has puked out the overflow tube and onto the hugger. it's done this before but years ago and only once so i ignored it and it went away until recently and after about 6 months of none use due to a broken leg. Now it's done it twice after spinning on the freeway for a distance. I can ride 100 miles through the mnts without a problem and do so regularly but a constant 75MPH on the freeway and you get the picture. A search of the KV reveiled that i potentially have a blown output shaft seal. I checked my crankcase vent tube for clogs or restrictions and found none. With Octoberfast coming up soon which intails several hundred mile for me, should i tell the shop to replace the seal only (could there be other problems) ignore it and hope it goes away or, bikes to old don't ride it that far (Cansel trip)? Jeff- | ||
| Henrik |
If you haven't replaced the primary chain tensioner, I'd suggest getting the new version installed. Also, tell the shop to use the new style metal primary gaskets. You might also tell them to take a look at the wires from the stator where it runs under the metal clip screwed to the inner primary. Make sure the wires aren't frayed, and then pad the wires to make sure they aren't vibrating against the retaining clip. Some have used silicone - the oxygen sensor safe stuff. If it is indeed the the seal, then it's not going to "go away." If you don't want to deal with the seal right now, you could rig a catch can on the transmission vent tube. It's just a band-aid, but it may get you through Octoberfast. Henrik | ||
| M2me |
When my bike (2001 M2) is at a dead stop I can't shift into neutral. It feels like the shift lever won't move at all. It just started to do this this summer. At first it was only once in a while but now it's almost all the time. The weird thing is that I have no trouble upshifting, downshifting, from all gears while moving and I can shift easily into neutral if the bike is moving even just a little bit. But after I shift into 1st and come to a complete stop it feels like the shift lever doesn't want to move. Any ideas on what might be causing this? | ||
| Captainkirk |
Yep. Either your shift drum pins are backing out, or you're losing the little @#%! e-clip that holds the detent plate on, causing the roller to not seat squarely on the detent plate. That was the first symptom I had, too. Let me know if you need any guidance on this one. | ||
| Blake |
It *may* just need a clutch adjustment. That symptom is not uncommon even in brand new bikes and especially before the transmission is warmed up and/or is using the old Sport-Trans fluid. In those cases, it helps to blip the throttle a bit just prior to clicking the lever to neutral. What happens in these cases is the clutch is engaged via poor adjustment and/or thick/viscous lubricant just enough to very lightly load the transmission. That slight loading is enough to make static shifting (bike not moving) very very difficult. | ||
| Dave |
Agreed...start checking the simple stuff then progress as needed. It seems like that's how mine started behaving. Problems finding first, then it quickly grew to problems shifting. I found that clip that secures the detente plate in position broken in half and sitting in the bottom of the primary (retaining ring p/n 11019). Perhaps my own fault for not putting a new one one a couple years ago.  DAve (Message edited by dave on August 21, 2005) | ||
| M2me |
Super easy fix. Blake nailed it. I checked the clutch cable free play and it was about 1/4". According to the manual it's supposed to be no more than 1/8". So I tightened it and set it to just a hair under 1/8". I really didn't think that would make a difference. It made a HUGE difference! I can now shift easily into neutral while at a dead stop. Not only that but the clutch engages much more smoothly and evenly and overall shifting is improved. It still amazes me what 1/8" difference in clutch cable free play makes! For the past week or so I've been all worried that I was going to need a new clutch or a transmission rebuild. Thanks for the help on this!  |
