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Archive through February 24, 2005Gentleman_jon30 02-24-05  06:17 am
         

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Court
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 07:24 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I'd say "semi-official" is pretty inaccurate. I say that as I don my big ol rubber boots to tromp thru the mud all day...at least until the snow starts to fall.

With the most authority a construction worker (from the REAL island : ) )can marshall I'd sure be disappointed to see Buell abandon a perfectly good engine.

Those of you who's riding is presently constrained, with the Buell motorcycle or motor, acting as the constraint, raise your hands.

: )

Yes....I thought so.

Court

Court's Office

Court's Office
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M1combat
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 10:19 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

/me Places hands in pockets...
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Road_thing
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 10:21 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Dude, you need to get a new janitorial service...
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Dale
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 10:28 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Does Buell need a new engine? Yes
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Riderx09
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 11:17 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Its funny how erik has kept this 45 degree push-rod lump for how long now??? Dont you think if he wanted buells to have a differnt engine (rotax etc)...he would of done it along time ago???
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Glitch
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 11:20 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Oh, Glitch, would you mind terribly giving everyone an idea of what the new Buell Tuono Speciale might look like?
Blasphemy!
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Gentleman_jon
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 11:35 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Glitch,
Am I correct in assuming that your answer to my request, and so many members fervent desire, is " probably not"?
Being a huge fan of your incredibly creative work, I can only admit to being massively disappointed, a just a wee little bit surprised. Or are you one of the ones with the inside track on what is really going down?
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Mikej
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 11:40 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

"Or are you one of the ones with the inside track on what is really going down? "

You should see their clubhouse. ; )
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Glitch
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 12:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Jon, thanks for the compliments!
I wouldn't mind doing it after such a compliment.
I don't however have a picture of said engine from the side.
If I use the one above, it'll look sideways in the bike.
You should see their clubhouse.
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Gentleman_jon
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 12:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Glitch,
OK, I understand. Need a side elevation view of the naked motor.
I will try to get a better shot of the engine. My buddy Gerry just got a Mille, maybe he has something you could use in the literature that came with the bike.
What's up with the clubhouse, anyway?
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Dr_greg
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 01:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

You mean somebody actually thinks my "dream bike" might be a reality? I thought we were all just kidding. But then I'm quite gullible.

XB chassis + V990 Rotax = dream bike

Hmmm...it does add up!

By the way, absolutely no slam at all on the pushrod motor; I like my 9R and I'm sure the 12R is very, very impressive. But as a Mille rider the V990 is quite a powerplant, too. It rips. Equal torque and 4,000 more RPM to work with (which you don't even need to use but it's there if you need it).
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M1combat
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 01:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

"Does Buell need a new engine? Yes"

Can you explain why? Keep in mind that Buell has targeted the demographic that wants a STREET bike. Why put a race engine in a street bike? I've been watching the race scene for a long time... Race engines are for race tracks, street engines are for the street. Chassis however, are more interchangeable if you have the money. Yes, I think it would be totally sweet to have a full tube framed rally car with a tarmac setup and the street engine from the respective street car. I could still wax a Dodge Viper through the twisties... That would be worlds better than a '69 Camaro w/ a modern LeMans winning Corvette power plant...

Give me handling every time. I can go four times the speed limit of my favorite twisty road. Why do I need a bunch more power? Last weekend I came up behind a red R6 very quickly. He wicked it up a bit and tried to pull away. He couldn't overall, but he was walking away in the straights. He was even passing cars on blind turns and crossing the double yellow. I was waiting patiently to get around at a safe place and then catching back up. We got to the end of "The Spars" and we both pulled into the parking lot of the bar that sits there. I then realized it was an R1 (an '02). I don't need more power...
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Glitch
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 02:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

M1, Shred and I almost had the same thing happen while we were riding.
There was an R1, R6, and an F4I, we had absolutely no problem catching up with them, or staying up with them.
Turned out to be friends of our's so we knew their riding ability was as good as our's, they just couldn't use as much of their bike as it would have taken to leave us behind.
I will try to get a better shot of the engine.
That could work.
What's up with the clubhouse, anyway?
Let's just say it's not the clubhouse that's special, and leave it at that.
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Spatten1
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 03:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I heard that Buell was going to get the VR1000 superbike engine for 2006. The price has not changed since the 90's and the bike will only be $50,000.

It will be awesome, you can sharpen your riding skills on the way out and strengthen your leg muscles on the way home.....
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Court
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 04:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

>>>>>Buell was going to get the VR1000 superbike engine for 2006

Well won't that be special....who to thank?

I hope the guys can live up to expectations. They are working on the pit stop, but so far only have them up to 22 minutes.

: )
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Dr_greg
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 05:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

But M1, haven't you heard?

"Too much power is almost enough!"

I hear (and generally agree with) what you're saying (that's why I purchased the XB9R), but even at my advanced age (57) rapping out the V990 to 9500 rpm once in while sure clears the cobwebs.
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Surveyor
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 06:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Overhead cams and a programmeable ECM would be nice though?
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Aesquire
Posted on Thursday, February 24, 2005 - 08:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

I loved the moto journalist that wanted H-D to buy KTM. ( quote from memory ) "...fire the guy with the orange paint gun, and put the engine in a Buell, hell, all the Buell's."
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Wildduke
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 05:35 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Ducati have always made aircooled Monsters, then in 2000 they revealed their S4, a 916 engine in a monster. I personally don't like the styling, but althought I am all for aircooled motors, if it takes water cooling to produce more power then i'll jump on the band wagon. I own a '94 aircooled Monster but having ridden the S4, what a difference. Very Very Nice!!

I'm sure that it's just a matter of time before a watercooled motor is put on a Buell!!

(Message edited by wildduke on February 25, 2005)
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Glitch
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 11:29 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

OK, I know the engine is kinda hard to see because of the radiator, but it is there.

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Mikej
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 11:33 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Ah, the XBH, "H" for "Hydro".
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M1combat
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 11:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

We won't benefit from OHC. Our valve train is capable of more than the bearings that hold the crank in place. We need temkin bearings, a crank that's somewhere between the nine and twelve stroke length, and a 3-13/16" bore. I'm thinking you may be able to add more bore than that with slipper pistons and a little longer con-rod... THAT's the direction you need to go if you want a race engine. You just need to keep the conrod:stroke length ratio above 1.7:1 to be able to use those slipper pistons. It may also be worth while to re-work the fins to see if you can't get a 10% efficiency bonus out of them. Maybe add ridges/ripples to the frontal area of the left side of the swingarm to increase surface area there as well, and put on a larger oil cooler.
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Glitch
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 12:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Jon got your e-mail, I'll have something up as soon as I get time to do it. Right now though it looks to be such a small engine, that if Buell was to go there (yeah right) they'd have to come up with a whole different way to hang the engine. Maybe making room for some sort of radiator, and larger fuel tank. But we're talking about so much different that you'd have to start from scratch. Then you'd have a whole different bike, way different then the XB.
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Gentleman_jon
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 12:26 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Yes, I know what you mean. Then engine looks small, and only weighs 143 lb. I wonder what a Buell engine weighs.
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Elf
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 01:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Hi, all.
New poster here. I've been lurking a lot and finally decided to register. I'm in the market for a new bike, and the XB12Scg is on the SHORT, short list (pun intended....I'm 5'7"). I've already ridden one and it was GREAT!! But, the reason for posting in this thread : has anyone here seen this?
http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/interviews/2005BuellMotorcycleCanadaInterview.htm
Can any insiders confirm this? Will it be the "Sport-Tourer" that is supposedly coming or something else?

Oh, and you all seem to be a great bunch. I've learned MUCH about the bike whilst lurking (among other things!)
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M1combat
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 01:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

You haven't been lurking enough : ).

http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/32777/99549.html?1109310726

http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/4062/99690.html?1109346290

http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/4062/99479.html?1109343349
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Elf
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 01:26 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

My bad, M1
I can't seem keep up with all of the posts and still maintain the illusion of trying to get some work done!

So it's all hearsay again, huh?
Jeez. Can't wait until Spring!
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M1combat
Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 01:37 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

No problem : ).
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Trojan
Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 08:21 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

You want a light weight V Twin? How about one of these motors in an XB?

Highland Motorcycles 950cc V-Twin. 100bhp 77ft lbs torque. The engine is based on 2 Husaberg top ends. The whole road bike weighs in at 165kg, which is around 30kg less than an XB. The flat tracker looks gorgeous too!



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Gentleman_jon
Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 10:17 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Matt,
Lovely bicycle :-) Thanks for the information.
Do you know how much a Buell XB engine weighs in comparison to this one?
The Aprilia Rotax is 143lb. according to the makers.
It seems to me that there are several engines that are both lighter and more powerful than the Buell Vee Twins.
I see that the motor is a 60 vee twin, DOHC, Water cooler, 4 valves per cylinder with an oversquare 95/66mm bore and stroke. Nothing unusual there: pretty much the standard modern motor that would make the Buell more fun to ride and more competitive in the market place.
Lighter is always nice too:-)
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Spatten1
Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 02:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Jonathon,

There are plenty of light engines that have way more power than the Buell. Oversquare, 4 valves per cylinder, all that crazy stuff. However, you no longer have a Harley. Totally different character. If I had to race on the track or street, I'd take the RC51 any day, and any of you who havn't reefed on an RC51 should hold your comments until you've actually ridden one hard.
Maybe Buell should build both.
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Spatten1
Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 02:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Before everyone gets upset, I'm not saying the Buell isn't great, it is my choice of ride. I love having a sportbike with an engine that feels VERY HARLEY. If HD really wants to break into the sportbike market they might consider offering both sporty powered bikes and ones with more HP and probably less character.
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Cyko_bob
Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 02:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Well, I said I would not post on the speculation, but I love my Buell, the chunk of metal that it is. I like the Quad Cam Sporty engine, always have. We talk about the reliability of the Buell XBs, plus the great gas mileage, etc. I am quite content with the old pushrod engine, with what Erik has done with it so far. When I want to do 150 MPH or more, I jump on my Kawasaki (and find a road where I can do it). It has four cylinders and 16 valves to adjust. The Buell has four valves and nothing to adjust.

I am quite happy with the chunk of metal making all those mechanical noises under me...the best thing between my legs with clothes on. I have said it before, I think Erik likes simplicity engineered to the hilt...GO ERIK! I think he also wants to show what a simple engine can do against those more sophisticated engines (?) and bikes. We all talk about how we keep up with those Oriental/Italian bikes with that lump of metal under our a$$. Let's do it on some American iron.

Someone said something about having a hot rod engine in an old frame, or a good bike with the geometry and a good engine. I think we have a great bike guys, and most of you do too, or you would not be a member of this board.

I like what I got, and I hope Erik gives us those dual throttle bodies and a short-stroke high reving...big engine....Bad Boy, Bad Boy, whatcha gonna do? Listen to that Harley...errr, I mean Buell.

IMHO...Cyko Bob
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Spatten1
Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 06:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Cyko,

Well said. I agree with you 100%.

I think knowing and loving what we have with our XBs makes more sense than pretending that they are R1 beaters. The sporty engine feels and sounds so good it's amazing. The fact that they perform as well as they do without losing their HD character is increadible. The XBs also have so many unique qualities that they are really something special.
If Buell broke from the HD model, like with the V-Rod, then the bikes would lose something much harder to define than horsepower.
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Cyko_bob
Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 06:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Personally, I don't Erik is even looking at the VRod engine. It is so bulky, plus maintenance would be more intensive.

Cyko
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Spatten1
Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 06:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Yeah, I was just using the V-Rod as an example of a more "modern" engine that loses the HD-ness, if you will.
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Cyko_bob
Posted on Saturday, February 26, 2005 - 07:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

Gotcha...there were several posts where someone in Canada indicated the VRod engine was going to be the next Buell. We think otherwise
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Nadz
Posted on Sunday, February 27, 2005 - 11:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)

All this talk of replacing the engine...
Chevy tuned and tweaked the "old" pushrod up over 400 ponies (despite much criticism). The 1203cc is still pretty new- gotta be a few more foot-pounds in there somewhere...
I bought a 12R because it was American and sounded like it. So not only am I "allowed" to ride with my Sportster buddies, but I can walk away from anything less than a liter.
Just give me evolution, not the Revolution(tm).
-NadZ
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