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Atc_no_more
Posted on Friday, October 09, 2020 - 06:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

2008 XB12X

The fuel supply fitting attached to the fuel supply stud broke. I canít tell after a quick look through of the repair manual if this can just be unscrew and replaced with a new fitting. It says remove fuel supply banjo fitting from the fuel supply stud. Can anyone provide some advice on this repair?
I cannot find the part in the parts catalog- the fuel supply line banjo fitting. What part/parts do I need to get?
Thanks.


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Tpehak
Posted on Friday, October 09, 2020 - 06:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The fitting is pressed to the plastic fuel line. You need special tool to press this in because it requires a lot of force. But even you have this tool you still need to remove the broken piece of the fitting from the tube which might be really challenging task and you can contaminate the fuel line doing it. It is just cheaper and easier to buy used fuel line on eBay.
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Atc_no_more
Posted on Friday, October 09, 2020 - 10:09 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Ok Tpehak. Get another fuel line that has the fuel supply fitting on it, got it.

To replace the fuel line, do I remove the nut on the fuel supply stud, then remove broken fitting and then attach another? Could it be that easy?
And where is the other end of the fuel line go and how does it attach?
I haven't yet found a repair method for this in the service manual yet. Does anyone know if replacing the fuel line method is in there?

Does anyone know the fuel line part name and number so I can check Ebay as Tpehak suggested? Or another source for this fuel line?
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Griffmeister
Posted on Friday, October 09, 2020 - 10:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Fuel line assembly should be part # P0464.02A8A, at least thatís what the number was iní08. If thereís been a change the last letter might be different. I still havenít figured out how to tell what the latest update should be on parts.

The other end should connect right to the fuel rail and itís one of those push-on fittings with the built in spring clip. Simple to remove, just been a while so I donít remember exactly how, either squeeze end or push in a tab. Something like that.
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Tpehak
Posted on Saturday, October 10, 2020 - 01:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Use Twin Motorcycles web site for searching part numbers

https://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/webshop/parts.asp?m c=1&jaar=2008&model=E7398E2C-52BD-4E5A-8F35-2D81BE 863FFC&sid=C6556BBA-B664-4DCF-A057-0E199FD5039D

Fuel line part number is P0464.02A8A

The fuel line is connected to the fuel bump on one end (where you broke the banjo fitting) and to the fuel rail on the throttle body on opposite end.

If you have service manual in PDF file format use search function with word "fuel line" to find related information.

Read Fuel Pump section in service manual to see how to remove and how to attach the fuel line on that end properly (you don't need to remove the fuel pump though, just unscrew the fitting). Read Engine Rotation to see how to disconnect the fuel line from fuel rail (you don't need to rotate engine, but you need to remove air box and air rubber intake to access to the fuel line on that end).

Be careful removing the fuel line on the throttle body end, it is tricky and requires very particular sequence of actions to release the connector:

1. Push the fitting toward the throttle body nozzle all way in to release retaining clip tabs wedges.
2. Squeeze the fitting tabs by two fingers and pull the fitting out of the nozzle holding the tabs and slightly wiggling and twisting the fitting.

I broke my fuel line fitting on fuel rail end doing it improperly. Service manual does not describe how to remove it, so follow the procedure I described. You can check how the fitting mechanism works and where to press the tabs after you will have the fuel line replacement on your hands.

Here is a link with some additional information https://www.buellxb.com/forum/showthread.php?21093 -Buell-XB-fuel-line-disconnect

Once you disconnected the fuel line on both ends make sure it is not tied somewhere else to the frame or to the wiring harness, then you can slide it out of the frame from the fuel pump end.

Make sure the new fuel line is clean inside, maybe spray it with contact cleaner and compressed air to blow out any debris can be inside. Also cover the fuel line ends with tape before sliding it into the place to prevent catching any dirt in it during placing it in to the frame.

Do not throw away the old fuel line, at least keep the plastic fitting from the fuel rail end, that fitting has plastic retaining clip might be useful in case you will accidentally brake the one on your fuel line so you can replace that clip. I had to buy whole fuel line just to take that plastic clip out of it to replace the broken one on mine fuel line.

(Message edited by TPEHAK on October 10, 2020)
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Atc_no_more
Posted on Saturday, October 10, 2020 - 01:57 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks a bunch Tpehak. Sounds like a pretty easy repair when done slowly. I am hoping the fuel line slides right out of frame when disconnected and new line can be fished in easily too.
Now to find that banjo'd up fuel line.
Do you think I can reuse the fuel stud banjo O rings?

Another question not directly relate to this repair, but manual says to replace fuel tank drain plug when removed. Is this necessary?
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Tpehak
Posted on Saturday, October 10, 2020 - 03:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

If the o-rings look good without scuffs or damage you can reuse them. Just apply some engine oil on the o-rings before sliding banjo fitting on them. Also make sure all the mating surfaces are clean.

It is not necessary to replace the drain plug. But why do you need to remove it in the first place? You do not need to remove the fuel pump or do anything else, just detach the fuel line.

(Message edited by TPEHAK on October 10, 2020)
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Atc_no_more
Posted on Sunday, October 11, 2020 - 01:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Roger Tpehak, can reuse O rings.

I realize I don't have to drain the fuel for fuel line replacement, but was curious if the drain plug could be reused if I had to sometime. Came close to doing that when I had to remove the broken off rear muffler mount bolts. See Buell XB12X Ulysses Big, Bad, & Dirty Board, Uly broken off muffler thread and how I had to lay the bike over to get at the broken bolts. Ended up syphoning out most the gas.

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Atc_no_more
Posted on Sunday, October 11, 2020 - 05:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

When I look up part number P0464.02A8A, it shows me a complete fuel pump.

I cannot find the fuel line itself in the parts catalog. It doesnít show it attached to the fuel pump and only a piece of it attached to the throttle body fuel rail. No part number is assigned.

Have not been able to find one on EBay.

Found this German web site- has it, but it says oem part number is still P0464.02A8A.

https://buell-parts.com/navi.php?a=3948&lang=eng

Any help or suggestions would be appreciated.





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Brother_in_buells
Posted on Sunday, October 11, 2020 - 05:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

You probably have to get a complete fuel line because it's not available separately.

https://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/webshop/index.asp?m c=1

https://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/webshop/artikel.asp?mc=1&aid=17144


(Message edited by Brother in buells on October 11, 2020)
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Atc_no_more
Posted on Sunday, October 11, 2020 - 08:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks Brother_in_buells.

The problem when I go to this site you and other sites that others have recommended is I don't have a part number. Searching "fuel supply line" gets "No products have been found that match your search criteria."
I have not found the right words and part number yet. It has got to be out there somewhere.
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Atc_no_more
Posted on Sunday, October 11, 2020 - 08:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

But I did just send an info request to St. Paul HD/Buell.
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Shoggin
Posted on Sunday, October 11, 2020 - 09:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

https://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/webshop/artikel.asp ?mc=1&aid=17144&cid=0&s=fuel&a=

PO464.02A8A does pull up a fuel line (Tank to rail)
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Shoggin
Posted on Sunday, October 11, 2020 - 09:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

$69USD from Twin seems steep but the ends are exactly what you need.

Or $59 from Manchester.
https://estore.manchester-harley-davidson.co.uk/p0 46402a8a-fuel-line-pump-to-rail-p117585.html

Either way it's the right number.
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Tpehak
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 12:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

New

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Harley-Davidson-FUEL-LINE -PUMP-TO-RAIL-P0464-02A8A/164326098892?hash=item26 429947cc:g:gaUAAOSwifheYi0r


Used

https://www.ebay.com/itm/EB752-2003-03-BUELL-XB9S- LIGHTNING-FUEL-LINE/293329247592?hash=item444bc91d 68:g:dn0AAOSwffRdzHxv

Use search

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid= p2047675.m570.l1313&_nkw=Buell+XB+fuel+line&_sacat =0

It looks like earlier models have different fitting on the fuel rail side. You can check Twin Motorcycles web site searching the model year of the fuel line you found on Ebay and if the part number is the same as for your motorcycle model it should be compatible, even with old style fitting.

For instance according Twin Motorcycles website 2003 Buell XB 9S uses same part number fuel line as yours but original fuel line on 2003 buell XB has different fitting on the fuel rail side, but it should still work with 2008 Buell XB if 2003 Buell XB fuel line works with updated fuel line
https://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/webshop/parts.asp?mc=1&jaar=2003&model=E67C22D8-A9B2-42BF-BC00-BB2BDDA30FC7&sid=F8A8F25D-7EA3-4947-8A54-4858E96E30F4

(Message edited by TPEHAK on October 12, 2020)
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Atc_no_more
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 06:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Wow, thanks guys. I really appreciate your help.
I hope to remove the fuel line today.
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Griffmeister
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 10:58 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

As a side note, Iíve recently moved and had the movers take the Uly too. The only thing is that the fuel had to be drained for them to take it. I reused the oring on the drain plug and it worked fine. Technically new is recommended anytime a fitting is disturbed but sometimes thatís not an option. When you do reuse, just be sure to check thoroughly for leaks.
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Atc_no_more
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 05:31 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Got the broken banjo fitting off.
Got to the other end fitting at the fuel rail. Toyed gently with it a bit. Looked in the manual and parts catalog to see if I could find out what kind of fitting is and research it way of functioning. Looked at the BuellXB thread that Tpehak sent. Gonna do as he suggests to look at new fastener when it arrives, unless I get workings info..
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Atc_no_more
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 05:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)



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Shoggin
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 06:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Just squeeze those and pull it off the rail. I don't know what you mean by "different fittings"? Never seen different fittings on an XB.

The part number you gave says 2003-2010 "ALL Buell XB's"
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Tpehak
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 06:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Older models have different style connector. All models have same part number because of the updated connector works for all models and they produce and distribute only new updated fuel line.

Also push the fitting toward the fuel rail first before squeezing and pulling the tabs, it will release the lock. If you will just squeeze and try to pull it it will stay in place and if you will pull harder you can brake it.

You need to push the fitting toward the fuel rail, then squeeze and pull those tabs back relatively the fitting (there is one more tab on opposite side you can't see) holding the fitting pressed toward the fuel rail , then you can pull whole fitting out of the fuel rail holding the tabs in squeezed and pulled back position.

If you feel resistance pulling it off the fuel rail then you do something wrong, do not force it and to figure out this trick, if you will force it you can brake the plastic fitting.

(Message edited by TPEHAK on October 12, 2020)
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Shoggin
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 10:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

*break

There is no reason to have to push the fitting in. The metal barb on the fuel line (that the fitting holds on too) has no undercut, so you can just squeeze both sides of the fitting and remove it.
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Tpehak
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 11:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

There is a lip on the metal barb on the fuel rail, the plastic fitting on fuel line has wedging mechanism which grabs that lip. When fuel pressure pushes the fitting away from the barb the wedged mechanism squeezes that lip on the barb harder. To release this wedged mechanism you need not just squeeze the tabs but actually pull them back relatively the plastic fitting to release the wedges. To be able to pull the tabs back relatively the plastic fitting you need to move the plastic fitting opposite direction because of the wedged mechanism sits right against the metal barb lip because of this is where fuel pressure pushed this fitting and you can not disengage the barb lip and the wedged mechanism just squeezing the tabs. You also need to hold those tabs pulled back during pulling the whole fitting out of the metal barb otherwise it can engage with the barb lip again and harder you will pull then harder it will lock.

This is how I broke mine fitting, I just squeezed the tabs and pulled the fitting out of the fuel rail barb and it just did not move at all, I pulled it harder, wiggled it and finally broke it. Only after I broke it and exposed the mechanism I was able to figure out how really it works and how it should be released properly. That mistake cost me new fuel line I had to order to replace the broken wedging mechanism inset. There is no information in service manual and internet about proper disengaging technique of this fitting.

(Message edited by TPEHAK on October 12, 2020)
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Skipbarberman
Posted on Monday, October 12, 2020 - 11:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

While it is not applicable in this situation, anyone searching the forum might not have the broken line pictured above. Make sure to depressurize the line first before trying to remove it. As Tpehak states, a pressurized line acts like a wedge and it will be nearly impossible to remove without damage on a pressurized line. Obviously, in this case with the line actually broken, that is not possible. FWIW.
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Griffmeister
Posted on Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 11:09 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

This is why just about any service manual, no matter what itís for, has one or more blank pages for notes. They canít give you every little detail, besides, they are written for technicians that should already know the basics. When something isnít clear you get an answer and write it down.

On that note I would like to add to the comments on removing the push on fitting. Fuel pressure is trying to separate the fitting and it only makes sense that something resists that force. I would suggest that you apply that logic to anything that is pushed together and is expected to stay that way. Fuel lines, oil lines and even electrical connectors are meant to stay together and will be hard to remove unless relaxed. The simple rule of thumb would be when trying to remove anything, push in first then release the lock.
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Atc_no_more
Posted on Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 11:56 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Well, I tried. Pushing in, then pushing down on the tabs with my finger. Got no where. Tried using a hose puller pliers to get better leverage on the tabs. Nothing. Now it looks like the tabs are damaged. I certainly am no technician. Frustrating.
Would it be possible for me to cut it off with a hack saw blade or something?

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Tpehak
Posted on Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 12:56 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Well, like I said, do not force it, it should slide off pretty easy but ONLY with proper sequence of actions.

Looking on your picture push and slide whole plastic fitting left direction toward fuel rail. Then keeping pushing the plastic fitting left grasp both tabs by fingers and pull them and slide opposite direction (right direction relatively to your picture). Then keeping pulling the tabs right direction pull whole plastic fitting right direction to slide it off the metal nozzle.

I do not think saw will help you, you can just damage the fuel rail with saw. Try to figure out how to slide those taps back to release the lock.

If you ruined the tabs completely you can try to pry the tabs with flat screw driver in the front edge (left side on your picture) and bend them out completely one tab then another. There in a gap in the tab slot between the plastic fitting and the tab where you can stick flat screwdriver.

(Message edited by TPEHAK on October 13, 2020)
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Shoggin
Posted on Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 02:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Griffmeister is right. It can make it easier to push connectors in first.
I am just saying that if you're having trouble... you don't NEED to with this fitting. Theres NO "lip on the metal barb".

The part thats missing now on your fitting is the part you PUSH on with your fingers. It leverages the part near the open end of the fitting UP and away from the barb on the metal pipe.

Now your options are to use a pick in the end of the fitting to raise the locks over the metal barb, OR destroy the fitting and remove it that way.

IMO, I would NOT use a saw blade that could nick the sealing surface or cut into the metal retaining barb (or you'll be shopping for throttle bodies). I'd use a sharp exact blade to separate the front of that fitting, about 1/4" from the end to let it slip off, then cut the remaining part open (that you just separated) to remove it. A sharp blade should be adequate.
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Tpehak
Posted on Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 05:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

OK, this picture should explain everything and how to deal with it. This is the mechanism. You have to push whole fitting forward on the metal nozzle to allow the tabs to be moved back to release the wedged surfaces on the clip and lift the clip locking features over the nozzle lip.

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Atc_no_more
Posted on Tuesday, October 13, 2020 - 06:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks so much guys. I am a fairly good shade tree mechanic, but fasteners always get me. Not much experience with them. I don't really want to go the hack saw route. I was frustrated that it should be an easy removal, but hasn't gone that way for me.
I am impressed with the support you guys are giving me, especially the diagram Tpehak. This new info gives me the confidence to go try again.
In the attached photo, I was pushing on the red dot area. Is that where I need to stay? Are the orange and blue dot spots fixed or can I press there to in order to get the clip to release?
It looks to me in your diagram Tpehak that the orange and blue dot area are fixed molded and the red dot spot is the only spot that moves.








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