| Author | Message | ||
     Bitbear |
My HD/Buell dealer is first class both in sales and service. They take care of Buells as well as they take care of the rolling couches. And they are one of the top major metropolitan dealers in terms of Buell sales.. The other day one of their top service mangers, during a causal conversation, allowed that sales of the "big bikes" (read HDs) were down 53 percent this season! When asked about Buell sales he suggested they were nearly non-existant (by the way, this dealership is a regular winner of Buell sales awards -- they generally are among their top dealerships). The service manager went on to say a lot of dealerships are dropping Buells all together. And that they (this dealership) is one of a relative few dealerships still selling servicing Buells. WTF? Is the recession having that bad an impact on Buell? Could we loose Buell all together? This dealership is well tied to Buell -- they make a lot of money on Buell -- why would they distort the truth? What do you think -- or know? | ||
| Greg_e |
My local has a few brand new 2008 Buells marked down very far. It doesn't look like they ever bothered to get any 2009 models. That said I don't think my area of the world is very Buell friendly as I have never seen one on the road. | ||
| Firebolt32 |
Is the recession having that bad an impact on Buell? No...H/D is a bad impact on Buell. My mom works at a Harley dealership. No matter how hard she or any other employee trys to "vamp" up the piss poor section they call Buell, nothing seems to happen. No new nothing when it comes to Buell. Buell somehow some way needs to get into their own stores. | ||
| Pogue_mahone |
well whatever happens i believe in the man's vision and product. stand alones...altho very few in number would be welcome for proper service and a proper sales experience. i clearly see the benefits of the buell/hd relationship..but it is seeming to be failing the buell line by the BS the HD sales/service people pull all the time. i would like to hear of any first hand stand alone buell sales and service experiences.i would also be cautious of suggesting buell and any other line join in any amount of dealers.would be an opportunity for the same old bad mouthing as the hd people do. like in the denver area....instead of 5-6-7 buell dealers...maybe one stand alone would be good.enuff sales and service for the staff and owners to justify it.and let those stand alones(if they are the future) call their own shots about bringing in hd/other makes for service work.i am sure the buell techs are well versed in hd repairs and service. | ||
| Greg_e |
I think that they really need to get Buell in with some of the other sport bike dealerships. Most of the squids won't ever go into a Harley dealership to look for a bike, no matter how good the Buells may be on the street or track. Sad to say it, but it the sad truth around here. Too bad too because the Harley dealership in town is a huge building and really nice inside, the service bays looked really nice too. Never seen an import dealership that looks as good around here. | ||
| Froggy |
Yep, dealers are constantly dropping Buell, and then others pick it up. It has been balancing out, and things are getting better as most of the droped dealers didn't do anything for the brand anyway.
Not as bad as most other vehicle makers.
Not a chance.
What did they say that wasn't truthful? | ||
| Toomanyhobbies |
What I wanna see is a standalone Buell/MV Agusta Dealership. F*%# Harley! | ||
| Slaughter |
My racing sponsor - Antelope Valley Buell here in Lancaster JUST got their "Store-within-a-store" setup and expanded their section for the Buells. Starting to expand to set up sportbike nights at off-site locations to encourage the Non-Buell folks to feel comfortable in attending too. Their sales guys are starting to come to the track - they even have representation there on racedays with literature and give-aways. Track days, demos... stuff like that. Times are tight yes but you gotta be proactive. (sorry for the non-sponsor plug but they WILL become a sponsor here before long) | ||
| Greg_e |
Buell, Ducati, Aprilia would make a decent shop. If you want to get the squids in you'll need GSXR and a few of the other race replicas in their too. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Then again, some dealers are working very hard to become THE Buell dealer. Ever notice the gap between the customer and the sales folks? Ever notice the gap between the sales folks and the owner? Ever wonder what it would be like to have the dealership owner as excited about the bikes and the brand as the customer? We are working to see just what that looks like. How about working to provide nationally competitive bike deals with destination attraction? How about COMPLETE online parts availability? How about privateer race support with heavily discounted race parts and bike set-up? | ||
| Newxb12ss |
Buells do better in Europe than here, where their performance is appreciated more than typical H-D poser looks. All brands tended to suffer during this economy - except perhaps scooters. The best selling dual-sport in our region, the KLR650, is discounted $500 by Kawasaki to move more units. Suzuki dealers now have the B-King marked down to a ridiculous $7,999. H-D snatched up Buell to bring newer riders into the stores. It also increased Buell output and sales dramatically, but Buell does have the disadvantage of shaking off the archaic image of H-D's with 96" engines and only 64 hp - consequently it's more fun for most sport-bikers to drop into a competitor's store and see the latest in technology while picking out any number of racetrack replicas. There they don't get snickered at for wearing a full-face helmet and full leathers with armor. | ||
| Xbpete |
+1 on Froggy The HD dealers should model after Bumpus or Rossmeyer... with support and marketing Buell is a great money maker. Buell is judged as a sideline and put in a corner so it doesn't interfere with aisles of assless chaps and leather shit with chrome buttons. Wake up HD, everyone does not want to look like Willie G and ride 750lb chrome magnets with leather whazits hanging off everywhere. | ||
| Iamarchangel |
I like the destination idea. The bike would have to be the Canadian variant. Don't get too excited seeing what that would take but it would be interesting. In Canada, this could work for dealers down east or along the two mountain ranges. On a similar note, BMW used to have European tours and you bring the bike back to NA. My local dealer's pretty good but I think they are hurt by the nominal cost difference between US prices and CDN prices. I think I upset them buying the Turbulent jacket in the states but I saved about $CDN200. And that leads to another issue: HD dealers are not used to carrying or obtaining the accessories sport riders need. None of my "luggage" is HD/Buell and it was priced at about a 1/3 of their closest product. We don't replace our tires every few years: I'm on my second rear this year. We can't pay their prices for "special tires" and their rates that often. My way is better than 1/2 their price. Buell's booklets have brightly coloured riders but the only clothes line is HD black and grey. Joe Rocket is the maker of the racing leathers, and, I think, the Buell jackets. A licensed line might help. Anyway, without an aftermarket line, Buell dealers lose some of that extra income. However, this recession is going to take its toll. Ridership is down, sales are down. Dealers are going to entrench. Vote with your feet, try and buy something at good dealers. Don't worry about the Marque. EB has come through tougher times than this. History has plenty of discontinued Marques that are still running/competing and are well supported. | ||
| Pogue_mahone |
ft bastard i agree totally 100 % online parts availability would be great. and they need to open up and have avaiable other lines of gear for the buell'ers. from tires to helmets we like choices and the local multi line shops here have ooodles of gear and actual choices in stock for tires ! hd has their garbage and very little for the buell riders | ||
| Tpoppa |
http://www.jsonline.com/business/59803327.html I'm not sure exactly what this means, but it's an interesting comment. "...Erik Buell said he didn't renew his employment contract with Harley-Davidson, although he isn't planning on retiring. 'Heck, we have just started to do what we have needed to do with Buell, and I want a world championship now,' Buell said..." | ||
| Andymnelson |
Personally, I think the dealers are only 1/2 the problem. Most Buell fans walk into an HD/Buell store expecting their (lowest price in the whole store) bike interest to require them to be treated like kings, and proceed to give the sales guys a ton of attitude until they blow off the dealer, then they wonder why the salesguys don't want anything to do with Buells and their owners. Trust me, I know that not all dealers are perfect! ...but neither are us owners. I have had many a good conversation with salesguys who know less about the brand than I do...but wanted to learn more, so I helped educate them. My pride in my brand goes beyond my ego, and occasionally causes me to act for the greater good- perhaps we all need to do more of this. | ||
| Tpoppa |
Personally, I think the dealers are only 1/2 the problem. Most Buell fans walk into an HD/Buell store expecting their (lowest price in the whole store) bike interest to require them to be treated like kings, and proceed to give the sales guys a ton of attitude until they blow off the dealer, then they wonder why the salesguys don't want anything to do with Buells and their owners. Trust me, I know that not all dealers are perfect! ...but neither are us owners. I have had many a good conversation with salesguys who know less about the brand than I do...but wanted to learn more, so I helped educate them. My pride in my brand goes beyond my ego, and occasionally causes me to act for the greater good- perhaps we all need to do more of this. As a business person, I have to disagree with this comment. In ANY industry, when consumer expectations (realistic or not) are not met to a degree where sales are impacted, it is the responsibility & necessity of the manufacturer/retailer/etc to align with consumers. | ||
| Pogue_mahone |
where the customer and product meet. it CANT be stuff like"the 1125 has a snowmobile engine" just like bad cops....the damage is HUGE to the rest of the good folks out there | ||
| Oddball |
Andy, I've been in dealers on busy days and can understand being ignored cause salesmen have their hands busy chasing down higher profit HD sales. It's the slow days where salesmen stand around like mannequins with moving eyes that make you shake your head. It would help if they'd just lay their numbers on the table (good or bad). FtBstrd does that. Straight up here's what it costs to get on the road. Interstate deals and online quotes are more involved but a tag on the bike in the showroom should figure the potential buyer is local and just list on the road price including taxes/tags/fees etc. If it's good there will be nibbles if not, they'll need to reevaluate. Tpoppa, Erik might just have the time of his life going around the world from track to track running a wsbk team. That would be cool. If I were Erik I'd also take a lap or two around them myself. A race fan's dream. | ||
| Andymnelson |
Tpoppa- your point is valid, and as a business owner that is how I operate my business. All I'm saying is that as long as Buell owners walk into HD dealers feeling entitled, I don't suspect thing will change much. | ||
| 2008xb12scg |
Really it's not all about the Buell owners, it's about the potential Buell ownners. Most of us will buy another Buell regardless. I will say I will most likely travel to A Buell friendlier dealer (maybe Fat_bastard) so I can feel a little love so to speak. Most dealers I have been to I feel like I'm the one trying to sell the bike. Hard to buy something from somebody who doesn't like it. First rule of sales, be excited about the widgets and the customer will follow.. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
I think there is a give and take in the deal as well. Doing the things that owners and prospective owners expect in their buying experience takes time and money. When we go through the effort, that effort MUST be rewarded with sales. Fulfillment of your expectations is sometimes mutually exclusive with the absolute lowest price in the market. We've had folks say "hey, I'm so glad you guys are stepping up. We are excited about what you are doing!" and then buy a bike from a dealer farther away for $200 less in price. We've had folks complain that we didn't have certain parts in stock and then, when we work to make sure we have a full line up of crash parts and wear items in stock at all time, buy them online. As customers, WE have a responsibility to make sure that we are supporting our local dealer. This means, sometimes, not sucking every dollar of spare profit out of a deal. You don't have to get hosed, but you can't expect the dealer to make no money. We sincerely WANT to make you a good deal, but there MUST be profit in it to keep the balls spinning. | ||
| Indy_bueller |
I don't know why everyone is so worried. Buell has been through harder times than this. I refuse to believe that BMC would go belly up because of one recession, especially considering how far it has come. I'm sure that if HD decided to sell Buell (if it came to it, I'm sure they would try sell it first rather than close it) enough investors would step forward to make it happen. Keep the faith. I believe the worst part of the recession is over. Buell may have some hard times ahead over the next year or two, but that's all. | ||
| Fast1075 |
A properly managed, and organized business with the right "culture" can bring in paying customers and keep them coming back. And it isn't usually about "price"...It is about perceived value and the way they are treated...an old sage once said "quality, service, price....pick any two"... Very few customers these days walk into a shop to buy anything not knowing anything about what they are shopping for....number one "hot potatoe"...salesman not only knows nothing about the product, but has wrong facts...nothing will turn off an interested buyer quicker....salesman lacks the skill and training needed to help the undecided customer choose a product that BEST fits the need...or desire...(up to the salesman to figure that out...in this case I have two words....Dale Carnagie)...far too many people cannot understand the difference between need, desire, and fulfillment. Example: I once went bike shopping, and was interested (due to what I had read) in a particular model...I asked the salesman how the valvetrain was set up and how were the valves adjusted...I also asked if the motor had a roller bearing or plain bearing crank...he had no correct answer...so he tried to bull crap me...his answers were soooo wrong that I immediately left....if he would instead have said..."How about we go over here to the service manager and go over that?" I would at least have known he was honest...and most likely went further with the sale (remember I was already interested in the bike before I walked in). Don't sell something you know nothing about. Anyone with one eye and half a brain will see thru it. Make the customer feel special...here again...it's a matter of personalities and training...some have it and some don't...if you don't...go flip burgers...there will be a lot less frustration and disappointment. Know the customer...this gets harder...when Joe-Bob walks in the door, the first glance usually sets the tone for the whole routine...it is very easy to screw this one up...Mr. Manicure may not have a pot to whizz in....and mr. Dirty nails just may be ready to spend the money he has been saving up for years to buy that new bike... The short of it...if you treat the customer right (excluding that 5% that only focus on the lowball price)..they will not only buy, but be back...again and again....long as you keep em happy, involved, and feeling "special"...make it all so easy that there is no need or desire for them to go "elsewhere"... | ||
| Zatco81 |
Example: I once went bike shopping, and was interested (due to what I had read) in a particular model...I asked the salesman how the valvetrain was set up and how were the valves adjusted...I also asked if the motor had a roller bearing or plain bearing crank...he had no correct answer...so he tried to bull crap me...his answers were soooo wrong that I immediately left....if he would instead have said..."How about we go over here to the service manager and go over that?" I would at least have known he was honest...and most likely went further with the sale (remember I was already interested in the bike before I walked in). Don't sell something you know nothing about. Anyone with one eye and half a brain will see thru it. One question...why? What was the point in asking all those questions if you had already read up on the bike. I'm willing to bet that you had a strong feeling that the sales guy wouldn't know the answers. I don't understand why everyone is bagging on the sales guys. I agree with the statement "It's hard to sell something that you don't like." I think that the owners are the best sales people Buell has. I couldn't tell you how many times I've been out and some guy has started asking questions to which I've happily answered. I'd like to think that in doing so I've planted a seed and maybe he'll go check them out if he's in the market. How many new Buell purchases actually require the salesman to "sell" the bike. I think most people that buy Buells already know what they want, they just need someone to take their money and hand them the keys. Maybe FtBstd can enlighten on how many hard sells he makes? I may be wrong, but I hope that the gas station lookers I've talked to went out and bought one. No commission necessary, I'd just like to see a few more on the road. | ||
| Swordsman |
"What I wanna see is a standalone Buell/MV Agusta Dealership."  That makes SO much more sense than the way Buell is being "packaged" with H-D. ~SM | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
"Hard sells?" None. I don't think I've ever asked the question "what's it gonna take to put you on this bike today." Maybe I'm doing it wrong. I sell motorcycles the way I want to buy them. I am as informed about the product as I can be. I work to listen to what the client wants and try to determine which bike would best fit their needs. We as a dealership try to provide bikes at competitive prices while working to provide sufficient profit to keep the doors open and Buells on the floor. I try to ask myself every day on the floor "Am I the sales person I would want to deal with?" | ||
| Drkside79 |
If you need a decent HD/BUELL shop in Chicago try ILL HD 1301 S. Harlem Avenue. They are the only ones I've found so far that care about Buell riders. There may be others in the Chicago land area but I recommend that one. | ||
| Bizkit |
swordsman - your idea sounds great. im with you on that one. that would be one nice looking shop | ||
| Bigb1975 |
"What I wanna see is a standalone Buell/MV Agusta Dealership." "That makes SO much more sense than the way Buell is being "packaged" with H-D." I don't know if that would work. Neither brand has high enough volume to support a dealership. Plus I don't think they cross shop very well even though they are both sporty. If you look at Pro Italia in Glendale, CA and see that they have three brands. Ducati is their bread and butter (but Ducati alone might not give them enough sales) and then they add on MV Agusta and Aprilia (both very low volume brands). Their business model makes sense to me. Someone comes in to look at Ducati, they could easily also become interested in an Aprilia or MV Agusta. I can't see that in an MV/Buell shop. Plus, the dealership isn't going to sell enough MVs and Buells in a month to pay the rent. But it speaks to the problem with Buell. From a dealership perspective, what does it match up with? There isn't really anything out there. Maybe Triumph? I think the pairing with HD keeps going because its the only one that actually works (though not that well for Buellers). |
