| Author | Message | ||
     Rogue_biker |
Before I got my XB12R, I got to ride the XB9R. I loved teh 9R and did enjoy its motor. But going from the 9R to the 12R, there is a big difference on power and acceleration. The 12R will yank your arms at WOT and the 9R never could do that. Even though the 9R has another 1k RPM in revs, you still bumped into its rev limiter often. I'm thinking Buell should have given the 9R motor a 9k RPM redline and the 12R an 8K RPM redline! As a side note, Chevy did NOT make a 302 motor. They made the 283, 305, 350, 396, 400 small blocks. Ford made the 302. (Message edited by rogue_biker on May 03, 2009) | ||
| V8basil |
Chevy did make a 302 and was an awsome motor, reved easy and was a screamer, lots of quick power!!!!!! Used in the old Cameros rs and z-28 late sixties, early 70's I believe? | ||
| Iamarchangel |
... '68. '69 and the 302 was also used as a concept in 2000. Man, you guys and ADHD... Back to bikes, Buell specifically. Concentrate. | ||
| Spatten1 |
You forgot the 327, which was made to rev. | ||
| Iamarchangel |
Bikes, Buells, focus. | ||
| Xb9ser |
302 was Z28 only 67,68,69 to meet trans am displacement rules. 396 was a big block.1970 up 396 was actually 402, factory .030 bore increice. | ||
| Hotrod427 |
You guys are right, Chevrolet did build a small-block with the 302 displacement specifically for Trans-Am racing. They also built a 427ci engine, as did Ford. Displacement doesn't necessarily mean they're comparable engines though- as I just learned in this thread about the Buells and the Sportsters...  | ||
| Doughnut |
And the Olds. 307 and the Pontiac 301. (I've had both) | ||
| Fast1075 |
Rogue....there are two reasons the engines aren't revved higher....first off, the factory has to make reliable engines... In order to be reliable, and working within the design limitations of the engine....they have to pay attention to piston speed, which is directly related to engine rpm and stroke lenght...the "9" engine has more rpm potential because of it's shorter stroke, with the "12" engine having a longer stroke, it reaches max piston speed at a lower rpm. This is not to say that either engine has an rpm line that shall not be crossed...but they both have rpm limits that cannot be crossed without severely compromising reliability... The other end of the equation is the valvetrain...to turn more rpm, you need to control the valvetrain...this means lighter components and more spring pressure...more spring pressure stresses the components...again, reliability is compromised. Can you build an XB engine that revs to 8K rpm??? yes you can...can you run it like that all the time??? yes you can...the only question is how long before all the oily parts decide to see what it looks like OUTSIDE the motor... And yes, Chevy built a 302...it was rated at like 185 hp or some rediculously small number at like 4800 rpm...twist that same engine to 7500 and it made around 500hp. The (sorry Ford guys) Boss 302 had such poor low rpm torque because of the massive port and valve sizes, it could barely pull a greasy string out of a cat's ass. | ||
| Xb9ser |
z28 302 factory rated 290 hp. NHRA factored it at 350.It was a 365hp 327 destroked with a 283 crank. | ||
| Hotrod427 |
No offense taken Fast. The Boss 302 was dissapointing on the low-end torque, but they were built for high revs. And true to your previous statement, the Ford racers suffered reliability issues at the rpms where the heads really started to make power. Kinda reinforces the point that you can build any engine to rev to the moon, and make gobs of power, but at the expense of reliability. Thats why I chose the XB12- there's just no substitute for cubic inches. | ||
| Spatten1 |
Thats why I chose the XB12- there's just no substitute for cubic inches. I'll give you that all day long in a straight line. Not the case for sport riding motorcyles at all. The 984 actually feels closer to a sport engine. I like the 1200 for the torque, but the flywheel affect is quite overbearing for quick shifting on a road course. The 984 is still a farm implement compared to a pure sport engine, but it feels much more suited to tight twisties of different speeds than the 12 does. The 12 power wheelies a heck of a lot easier, that's for sure. | ||
| Rogue_biker |
Okay. I guess I'm not such a Chevy engine expert as I thought I was. I honestly have never heard of the 302 Chevy. Always Ford. But considering the 302 was built only in limited numbers for a limited time, I can see why not a whole lot of info is available for them. I grew up in the 80's and the V8's I was familiar with were the 305, 350, 400 Chevys, and the 302, 351 Fords. As for the Thunderstorm engines, I love the 12R due to its torque and I can easily live with the 7k RPM redline. In fact, I'm totally happy with that redline if it means higher reliability and low maintenance. However, Buell should have fitted the XB's with a 6-speed. I know when riding twisties in SoCal, I wish there was an interim gear between 1st and 2nd, or 4th & 5th. A closer ratio 6-speed would make the 9R & 12R even more fun. | ||
| Hotrod427 |
I think that we can all agree on one thing though- no matter what size, model, color or flavor ya get, Buells are just plain fun to ride!!  | ||
| Spatten1 |
I think that we can all agree on one thing though- no matter what size, model, color or flavor ya get, Buells are just plain fun to ride!! That's for damn sure. | ||
| Fast1075 |
+2 on the Fun. | ||
| Xbpete |
Back in the day, my 67 Shelby GT 350 received a transplanted Boss 302, Roller cam, B & B, 13 1/2 CR Jahns, Holman & Moody dual quads, etc, etc.....Put the Shelby motor in a 65 Falcon Sprint. Both cars were fast... The Shelby with Boss power ran its ass off and top speed was incredible at 11,500, somewhere around 197. Changed rear pod and the thing ran 10.3 in 1/4... nice machine. Also owned 67 Camaro RPO Z-28.. one of the first 500 built, came with offset dual quads, cam, headers sitting in the trunk from the factory! Killer little 302 ... that motor was discontinued in 1969 in the Z, replaced by the 350. But back to the 984... fun to run and if I were tracking, would go the Slaughter route to get some serious revs. Love both engines, the 1203 in my 'Bolt rocks! | ||
| Gunut75 |
Ah yes, the DZ302 Comaro. Much more fun than the standard. A friend of mine sold his for 18K 13 years ago. One of those toys he wishes he never sold. Who knows what it would be worth now! | ||
| Garyz28 |
The 302 Z28 was actually in production for over a year before Ford introduced their 302. | ||
| Strato9r |
That Chevy "302" was actually around since the late Fifties, in the form of a .125" overbored 283. Truck versions of the 283 had a block that had cylinder walls that were thick enough to safely handle the jump from 3.875" to an even 4.000". In '62, when the 327 was introduced, 4 inch bore blocks became more common, and a lot of engine builders began to use them, along with the 3 inch stroke 283 crank to build what was more commonly known at the time as a "301". In '67, Chevrolet used that exact combination in Z-28 optioned Camaros, street versions getting the same camshaft as '64-'66 375 hp Fuel Injected and 365 hp carbureted Corvettes; the Duntov 30/30. In late '68, the engine blocks, crankshafts and connecting rods all saw changes that increased the diameters of the main and rod journals. Yes, they were, and still are, a very sweet engine. But GM built it to make the Five Litre Displacement limit in Trans Am racing, and by 1970, all those sweet internals were given nearly an extra half inch of stroke to play with, and the original LT-1 was born, and it was a stellar engine. More stroke is rarely a bad thing on a street engine, is it? | ||
| Dingosm8 |
even a buell 984 is more than enough HP for me. If it weren't for the 984... they would only have 1 line of bikes. They ought to offer it in every body style. Gear ratio and revs are a bit more to my liking. I'd buy the smallest engine in an xb that was still fun. Cheaper the better. Heck... the wife's blast is enough.. just not tall enough.. cheap components and a thumper sound that isn't quite as cool. I also prefer the 650 yamaha cruiser to the 1100. You're kind of asking.. why do they make anything in any size other than the biggest. A better question is, why buy the 1200... still like to point out that my GTO went as fast on the road as my scion does. But the scion's more fun to drive, as you can actually get to its limits in an almost legal way. | ||
| Ronbob43 |
+1 Dinger. After my wife got her Blast I wanted one for me......except it is just a little too short and my new XB9SX is a perfect upgrade for the SV650. I keep test riding on 12s, but can't figure out how to accelerate smoothly through a set of curves. Love that 984 motor! | ||
| Sinatra |
Didn't Buell have the xb9s and xb9r out a year before they made it in a 1200 model? Maybe two years? 02 and 03 maybe? I think Buell understood the whole penis envy thing with men and motors. I mean they are owned by Harley Davidson Motor Company right? (said with tongue firmly in cheek, so all you 12 owners don't pull out your tape measures to prove me wrong, In America we call this sarcasm.) I also got the first year 2005 XB9SX due to the looks, price and it being the perfect city commuter bike, great marketing on Buells part. It is the only 984 model still made right?. Sometimes its not always the bigger the better. Sometimes its just about passion. Pun completely intended. | ||
| B00stzx3 |
984 is still PLENTY to scare the crap outta you. Drop it in 3rd and twist it up. Inline-4 guys have ridden my 9R and went on about the incredible acceleration it had with the twist of wrist, and how immediate it was. Sure the 12R might do it fast but the 984 is still plenty of pants-wetting andrenaline. | ||
| Happy1 |
i got a 12.....well because the don't make a xb9scg......and maybe some "penis envy" | ||
| Zeroman |
I mean, If I wanted to go fast.. I would have kept my FZ6.. runs circles around the 984 and i'd bet good money the 1200. Ya don't buy an air cooled motorcycle for the power. You buy an R1. And you'll probably do it cheaper. | ||
| Js_buell |
Your right but I bought mine for the torque  | ||
| Fast1075 |
"May the Torque be with you"  | ||
| Blackm2 |
Didn't they used to make an XB9Scg, back in 03 and 04, it was just the XB9SL right? | ||
| Js_buell |
they are the same Scg or Sl. cg for center of gravity,L for low. |
