| Author | Message | ||
     Jimmytwobuells |
I was wondering what type of barameter E-bay is for bike values. I would think that a majority of used bike buyers would be a little tentative to purchase a $8000 bike sight unseen.Those crappy little pics on E-bay don't show you all the little nicks and scratches not to mention the inability to at least hear the thing run(or ride it for that matter). That said,I recently purchased a S1W off E-bay and I was extremely nervous parting with my hard earned cash before actually seeing the bike in person. Now if she would only send me the title... | ||
| Daves |
Jose, If they don't have the demand, they need to market the product better. If they are convinced that they won't bring MSRP then guess what? They won't. They need to do a better job of presenting the bike to the customers. Bottom line is if they are unable to sell the XBs at MSRP they aren't doing their job and they should find someone else that can. I don't hold trying to get a better deal against anyone. The cheapest price isn't always the best deal. As far as buying the bike from the cheap,we don't have a clue dealer and then taking it to the "We know our stuff" dealer for service, well that's an OK idea for awhile. We service lots of bikes that weren't purchased here. I feel it is great way to gain them as customers on their next bike purchase. At the least you get the service work $$. Now just imagine that YOU are the good dealer. A let's just make this customers name, oh let me think, Jose, we'll call him Jose! Now Jose wants the best deal on a FireBolt. He goes to the "good" dealer and learns all about the product from a knowledgeable salesperson who is very PRO Buell. He finds out all the features and benefits of this New Buell Motorcycle. He even learns that they have an active group to go on rides and hang out with to talk about all things Buellin! He gets to meet the certified Buell technician and the Buell parts people. Jose is pumped about this new bike. Jose goes home to think about it like most customers do(and this is a good thing). While at home Jose decides to do a little shopping before he makes his purchase(another good thing) So off to the CHEAP Buell dealer he goes. There, he is ignored while standing by the bike of his dreams and finally asks one of the salespeople if they can help him. The salesperson puts down their cup of coffee and comes over to the Buell section(if they even have one). Jose asks(because he forgot) what the diameter of the ZTL front rotor is. Cheap salesperson looks at him like he's speaking in tongues and says" I don't know, why don't I show you a "real" bike over here. Well Jose is already sold on the Buell(by the Good dealer) so he just asks how much? Mr(or Ms) Cheap salesperson says well these things are hard to sell, nobody wants them so I tell you what I'll do. Cheap salesperson gives Jose a price that is only a few hundred $ over dealer cost. Jose thinks he's hit the jackpot! He signs the papers and rides it home. He notices on the way home that the suspension seems to be hitting bottom on hard bumps and he remembers that at the Good dealer they said the suspension is adjustable. He calls up the Cheap dealer and asks about coming in to have it looked at. We have an opening in 3 weeks says the Cheap service mgr. Jose decides he doesn't want to wait that long so he calls the dealer that seemed to know alot more about the bike. They have him bring it right over and they set the preload for him. They re-explain the settings and how important this is. They invite him to join the BRAG group,cause the Cheap dealer doesn't have one. Everything goes along fine for years and after 3 new Buells, all from the CHEAP dealer,why,well, cause he's cheaper. Jose finally has a big problem(motor blows,tranny shucks, a big problem). He goes to the Cheap dealer and they are way to busy hanging chrome dodads on bikes to look at the Buell. Off Jose goes to the good dealer. They find the problem, but it is something that Jose thinks should be covered. Now Jose NEEDS a favor. Think about the Good dealer, should they stick their necks out for Jose? Would you(remember, you're the dealer here, you know, the one that Jose has never bought a bike from and always bought them from your competetion,because they were cheaper) Understand? Probably not. By the way, the Cheap dealer has since stopped carrying Buells cause everyone knows you can't make any money and they are hard to sell and customers always ask too many questions and it's a hell of alot easier to sit on their asses and sell Hds. WOW that's a long story. I hope it has a happy ending for Jose! Ride to the edge! Dave HD/Buell Cycle Center Waterloo Ia 1-800-342-7539 ext 14 | ||
| Daves |
Sorry Jose, I should've called the guy Ray. Ride to the edge! Dave HD/Buell Cycle Center Waterloo Ia 1-800-342-7539 ext 14 | ||
| Court |
I'll say QUOTE him again......interesting guy Ruskin was.... It's unwise to pay too much, but it's also unwise to pay too little. When you pay too much you lose a little money, that is all. When you pay too little, you sometimes lose everything, because the thing you bought was incapable of doing the thing it was bought to do. The common law of business balance prohibits paying a little and getting a lot - it can't be done. If you deal with the lowest bidder, it is well to add something for the risk you run. And if you do that, you will have enough to pay for something better." John Ruskin | ||
| Andrewb |
Why not call him "Cecil"? | ||
| Daves |
I don't know Ray well enough to insult him! Ride to the Edge! Another quote" There is a cost of doing business as it relates to good or poor service. Dave HD/Buell Cycle Center 1-800-342-7539 ext 14 | ||
| José_Quiñones |
Call him anything you want, that's a good story and not that unusual. I'll defend HD of Ft. Washington here a little bit. They do try to sell the bikes: they advertise in the local bike papers, they offer demo rides, promote Local/National Buell events like the DEMO truck event this year, promote DCBRAG on their website, helps DCBRAG in general, carries a good selection of Buell and Buell aftermarket products, has a few Buell savvy salespeople, a Buell parts specialist (who writes articles for the DCBRAG newsletter) and at least one certified Buell trained mechanic. If you do all that as a dealer and the bikes still don't sell, is it the dealer or is it the product? The only two things that they don't do which I wish they did was sponsor a road race team (they do sponsor a S3 Drag bike!) or sponsor a Battletrax or two in the DC area. Buell of Frederick, MD, used to sponsor a race team (2002 Buell Lightning champ Brian Bemisderfer) and has hosted at 6 Battletraxes in the last two years. They are a close second as my favorite Buell Dealer. I would love to buy my bikes from them, but they are 60 miles away! Ft. Washington is only 15 miles away. Which one would you rather take the bike to (which I surely have to at some point), assuming that they are both competent? If HDW was totally incompetent, then yeah, I would take it to Frederick, but that would have stopped me from buying the bike altogether. Having a competent dealer nearby is very important to me. | ||
| Daves |
I agree Jose, the story I told was fiction(any likeness to any real story or persons is accidental, no animals were hurt during the making up of said story). You are lucky to have a good dealer that happens to be your closest one too. I don't know what the problem(if you want to call it that)is with them having to discount the bikes. I have had people at Buell have dealers call me to help fix their Buell problems but it sounds like Washington is doing lots of the right things already. As usual there are no easy answers. I'll stand by my original thinking, it is not the product! There is a problem. I don't want you or anyone else to think I'm not a little flexible on the price of Buells. I usually "sweeten" the deal somehow. Advertising them for low buck prices,we all lose. Ride to the Edge! Dave HD/Buell Cycle Center Waterloo Ia 1-800-342-7539 ext 14 Ride to the Edge! Dave | ||
| Smitty |
LOB... My friend has a cbrxx .It does break .It isn’t perfect. The local Honda shop is backed up for weeks and it isn’t oil changes. He has claimed to hit a peak mph of 151 mph (whoopee) on public roads. He call us stupid and belittled our rides. (My Yamaha and my friends Ducati 916 monster.) I feel sorry for him for his vision is clouded that he can’t live and let live. He sent us a note and informed us he has his clock cleaned by a guy with a GSXR 750. He is now looking for a faster ride. I don’t get it. It must be a blackbird thing. Ride safe. Tim | ||
| Court |
>>>>It must be a blackbird thing. It is.....EQUAL INTELLIGENCE w/ a blackbird  | ||
| Elvis |
If the Harley management could get their dealers to take Buell more seriously, this could actually be turned into an advantage. I don't know of any "Honda" dealers around me. The dealers who sell Hondas also sell at least 5 other brands, so they don't specialize in Honda. These dealers can probably service Buell, Honda, Ducati etc. equally well (or equally poorly). | ||
| Sportsman |
How did this get to dealer bashing? Why doesn't Britt like his bike? | ||
| José_Quiñones |
And another thing in HDW's favor: They are the dealer at which Randy Urick, Slay the Dragon Contest Winner and fellow DCBRAG member, filled out his entry form, right before I filled out and put mine in the box, DOH! | ||
| Timbo |
Sportsman, The thread started as, "are used XB9's selling?" and "why do HDs hold their value better?". The the next question, "are the dealerships doing enough?" kinda fits and is natural. Britt wants more power I think, but is having a hard time selling his so he can buy another bike that has more ponies. He also thinks the tubers are holding their value better. I can't speak for all models but I've been watching S1 prices for the last three months and even the ones in very good shape rarely go for more than $5,500. BTW the S1 is the most comprable tuber to a XB9R IMHO. So I don't really agree with his thinking on that. I'm also of the opinion that the tubers are artificially low on price at this time, and we will see their value steadily climb in the coming years. While I'm at it, I might as well add that I think as time goes on we will see the XB's reputation go up as well. The more I ride mine the more I like it. I know Britt isn't happy, and that's ok. No one bike will ever make everyone happy. As for me, I feel like Buell made the XB9R just for me, it's perfect. Hope that doesn't sound too giddy, but what's so wrong with really liking what has been made when it feels so right? Ok, enough from me. Timbo | ||
| Harleybritt |
"Why doesn't Britt like his bike? " the reason i'm selling my bike is im not happy with the power and yes i can soup it up for another $5000. maybey. or i can buy a triumph speed tripple with 128hp out the box for $10000.oo same price as firebolt.and yes i could have bought the triumph in the begining,but coming off a harley i wanted to stay with an air cooled v twin american bike.i also want to do a bit more touring and found the bolt a little uncomfortable{just did 2600 miles on it to key west and back.}originaly i was going to have 2 bikes but circumstances have changed.the bike is fine but i'm just not in love with it. | ||
| Court |
>>>>just did 2600 miles on it to key west and back Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeouch ! And I thought I was crazy | ||
| Blake |
You can soup it up for a LOT less than five large. Weren't you the one who also claimed his XB9R was overheating in Miami? I asked how you knew it was overheating as opposed to just hot, like most engines get when run in city traffic in Miami. I don't recall ever seeing an answer to that question. | ||
| Bykergeek |
Jimmytwobuells: My experience on pricing was that bids didn't even get to 80% of blue book value in 3 separate weeks of listing. I have tried to sell a bike on Ebay; a Triumph Speed Triple and I'd say that while Ebay is a good marketing tool to get a bike seen, I (a potential seller) would never buy *ANY* bike sight unseen (or unheard) if it wasn't within a few hours ride to inspect and check out. I would not expect anyone to send a cashiers' cheque and hope they got a good buy. I know I would not. | ||
| Buelliedan |
I have bought 2 Buells sight unseen. My S2 off cycle trader and my RSS off E-bay. My S2 was in better shape than I expected and only cost $4,500 including shipping. The RSS is yet to be delivered so I will report on it later but I am quite confident that I won't be disappointed having spent probably 2 hours on the phone with the seller. | ||
| Daves |
Jose, Yeah I was hoping the winner of the Slay the Dragon would be from here instead. I already had it cleared with the boss to go along to Deal's Gap with the winner. Would you expect any less from your Buell salesman? Oh, the sacrifices I'm willing to make. I sent in about 80 entries but no contest winners here. Ride to the Edge! Dave HD/Buell Cycle Center Waterloo Ia 1-800-342-7539 ext 14 | ||
| Jimmytwobuells |
"Bottom line is if they are unable to sell the XBs at MSRP they aren't doing their job and they should find someone else that can." Wow! I know several dealers (both Buell and other brands) that have a sales manager position for you! Only problem is I think you'll be sitting all alone in a showroom FULL of bikes. | ||
| Smitty |
Harleys do command a large resale value. But when supply catches up with demand that will change. IM not clairvoyant this is just my opinion based on supply vs. demand. Buells are a bargain even at list. Great design engineering and originality. There is a guy at work who did just that. He bought a pan head sight unseen. The money was held with a service company and was released when both parties were satisfied. | ||
| Court |
I've bought 4 on 3-Bay. Every experience was PERFECT. I've sold one on e-Bay. Got my "buy it now" and sold it for $100 more than I paid for it. Sure, I invested $500 in the front brakes......$700 in the suspension.....$220 in tires......$150 in lighting...HEY...COME BACK WITH MY BIKE YOU S.O.B.! Seriously, I know I have likely beeen lucky, but I've nothing but good experience. Court (the XB in Miami was "hot" or "just hot". I had an S1 once that felt "damned hot" but it turns it is was just a skosh over normal) Yes, a Buell in Miami will be hot. | ||
| Daves |
JimmytwoBuells, I get job offers all the time. I can assure you I wouldn't be sitting alone with a showroom full of bikes. As a matter of fact I think I could go anywhere and sell Buells at MSRP(with a little flexibility). Not sure about other brands, never sold them. Would I be able to sell bikes to you? I don't know. If you always buy from the cheapest, then probably not. If you wanted a little more from your dealer than rock bottom price then maybe yes. If I felt I had to give my product away to be able to sell it, I'd find a different product to sell. Out of all my goals in life, being the cheapest has never been one of them. There will always be someone out there that will offer the product for less. Ride to the Edge! Dave HD/Buell Cycle center Waterloo Ia 1-800-342-7539 ext 14 | ||
| Sportsman |
OK, More power with a little more crusier position. It's a shame a S3T wasn't your original pick. I'm almost sure someone would trade or trade + cash up or down, so all is not lost. Look at the prices of a RC51, Sportbikes depriciate rapidly. Right now I have 3 X1's, if you want 1 of those we can deal but I think an S3T would give you the thrills with the roadability you're looking for. I don't know your history, but if you ever get acclamated to a HD product, you won't really think about much else even "IF" they are less maintanence. Check the resale of Triumph too. I'd bet, without checking that resale isn't their best point. Maybe an X3, I can do that. | ||
| Ezblast |
More proof that SF DP is always a bit off - a showroom - very nice - filled with Buells - the XB9R - goes out their door at $14,000.00 - Just Blasting on the Dark side! EZ | ||
| Ray_Maines |
Dave, call me José or anything else you want. I admit it, I’m a cheep S.O.B. I buy things at the lowest possible price, service them at the lowest possible price and then try to sell them for top dollar. I laugh at the nice folks that paid $22,500 for a $17,000 V-Rod. Then I eat all the free hot dogs and drink all the free soda I can handle at the party my local HD dealer puts on every Saturday morning. I change my own oil and buy parts and accessories on the Internet. Somebody else can support the party. Sorry Dave. This is a Buell centered BBS and I respect that. Still, the customer with cash in his pocket is a god. I can’t tell you how good I felt after I crashed my M2 and cashed the insurance check. I was no longer locked into any particular brand and suddenly I felt emancipated. I took my time and looked at $7,000 Triumphs, $8,000 Yamaha’s, $9,000 Honda’s. All of a sudden the $10,000 XB9 Firebolt didn’t look so appealing. As a HD\Buell dealer, you can discount the Firebolt all you want but the new Suzuki SV 1000 still costs $8,000. The customer is left to decide what’s the best bargain. As for me, I thought a Y2K M2 with a lame rear shock for $7,000 was a good bargain. Two years later I thought a $7,000 Triumph Sprint RS was the best bargain. Two years from now a 100 H.P XB9S for $8,500 might seem like the best deal. Sorry Dave, nothing personal. | ||
| Nevco1 |
Ray, Tough to argue with your logic/opinion. Like they say buy low and sell high. Nice thing about bikes and boats is you almost always get your money out of them when you factor in the cost of what else you could have been spending your hard earned cash on during those idle hours. Think of it as a vacation toy that you get practical use out of as well and you never will feel down about the investment again, regardless what you buy. Hope you hang around the BWB as your input has always been great. Bill | ||
| Jimmytwobuells |
No Dave, you probably wouldn't be able to sell me a bike. Back in '99 my local dealer was selling M2's for list so I drove 6 hours to save $1000. If I do buy a XB9S(which we are seriously considering)I'll probably drive 5 hours north and pay $8500. Nobodies been able to convince me the things worth 10 grand!( a matter of fact the more I hear about it's weird handling characteristics the more I doubt I'll buy it at all). When I walk into my local dealers new 6 million dollar building it's hard for me to feel badly about not patronizing him or eating his free hot dogs! | ||
| Daves |
Let me get this right, you guys(Ray and JimmyTwoBuells) actually go to dealerships that you don't support and eat their free food? Interesting. Anyone else out there do this too? Ride to the Edge! Dave HD/Buell Cycle Center Waterloo Ia 1-800-342-7539 ext 14 |
