| Author | Message | ||
     2hogs |
Hey XBers, Another thread pointed out that XB bikes handle differently than a higher revving import. XB has low torque, stiff frame, etc. So what's the 'learning curve' coming off Harley touring and softail models? Low torque still there its just in a bike that's ~ 1/2 the weight. Guess I'll just take it easy until I get used to the bike (Ulysses). Just wondering. Oh yea, I've been riding since 1981. | ||
| Buell12hundo |
the way the motor reacts when twisting the throttle I think will be pretty much the same, as for the different riding position and stile I would say take it easy till you get to know her. and take it easy in the dirt. but I've only ridden a sporty once for ten minutes but been riding different bikes for a long time ty | ||
| Spatten1 |
My guess is you will be shocked at how well a sportbike handles and brakes. You will have more control over the bike than you ever imagined. | ||
| Scitz |
I went from a Honda V-twin cruiser to an 03 XB9R. One of the best pieces of advice I found on this site was "When in doubt just lean." When I first started riding the bike and hit corners at a high speed I would end up braking hard because I felt the bike wasn't going to make it through the curve. After reading the thread I start to be more brave and less tense about leaning the bike. I then found that the bike would take the corners and got over my fear. I also felt it would be better to lay the bike down then go head on into a curb and go flying off. | ||
| Midknyte |
I have found that my XB really responds to body english. It wants and needs to be "talked to". i.e. shifting weight or hanging off the seat at least a little. To the point, that once you start doing it, you'll find that the bike starts talking back. As in, "Oh, you wanna do that? I can do that. Lets go!" "Wanna go faster? I can do that. See!" It's like a damn dog off a leash. (Message edited by midknyte on August 03, 2005) | ||
| Tomd |
Joe, I just posted my experience in going from a sporty to the XB on the other topic. I went from a 74" Glide to a 1200 sporty and that was a wakeup slap in the performance face. It was about the same again going from the sporty to the XB. (Actually, it was more like catching a sledgehammer in the chest the first time I pulled the XB's go chain.) I would say your gonna feel like your on a 100HP mini-bike for the first few rides. Respect that right grip. Grabbing a handful of throttle makes my 'glide louder, my sporty go faster and the XB takes off like a rocket. Tom | ||
| M1combat |
Read "Total Control" by Lee Parks. B&N has it for about $20. | ||
| Ponytail |
The Xb12R is my first sport bike. I started off on a 1200 Sporty, went to the Springer that I still have, and just purchased the Firebolt a few months ago. When I bought the Springer, I massaged it so that it would at least match the performance of the old Sporty. My Springer will chit and git. But, after riding this Firebolt for 1500 miles, the Springer bores me. NO kidding. I'll be doing some SERIOUS work to the Springer this fall and winter. It's an absolute slug compared to the Firebolt. The Firebolt is a rocket. Practice hanging a butt cheek off the seat in the turns. You'll notice that even the slightest THOUGHT about shifting your weight will make your turns smooth and a helluva lot of fun. One other issue I'm having with the Springer now, is that after riding the Firebolt, I find that I'm scraping pegs and pipes, ALOT on the Springer. | ||
| Midknyte |
Total Control, Good. A Twist of the Wrist, Better. | ||
| Glitch |
You'll definitely have to re-learn where to put your feet.  | ||
| Tahoe_xbuelligan |
I have a big inch electraglide. BE CAREFUL!!! Going between the bikes is trickey in that I havent dragged the pegs on the xb yet. Back to the flht and I feel like I cannot turn. I have really scraped and dug my floorboard mounts into the asphalt. My flht dyno's at 103hp and 108tq. Grab throttle=noise. Buell with race kit and D&D pipe. Grab throttle=loop if not careful. I love my bagger, its great for me and the woman but it does not even hold a candle to my Buell. The most fun I have ever had on two wheels. | ||
| Glitch |
Black_Sunshine and I both have dragged the "feelers" on our XB9Ss, we had to stop and take them off. What a bike! | ||
| Blake |
Twist of the wrist is more a track/racing oriented book. Not much good at all for street riding. | ||
| 2hogs |
Hey All, Thanks for the input. I read between the lines somewhat and see "Be careful, it'll spit you off either end depending on throttle or brake use!" Not sure about the cheek thing, at 240lbs 1 cheek is alot of weight to be throwing around :-) My '03 Road Glide is a rolling couch, and the '05 Night Train is a little less comfortable and a touch quicker. Both have me adopting a 'gentle' riding style. I chatted with a local dealer and she said she'd give me a ring when the '06s start rolling in. Can't wait to ride the Ulysses and/or the Lightning Long. Cheers | ||
| Wedge |
twist of the wrist II is more of a street oriented sport riding book. try that one | ||
| Metalstorm |
I have all three books & like Lee Park's Total Control the best. His is the less technical (or at least tricks me into believing so) and more real life based book in my opinion. However,.. Keith Code's "paying attention" analogy in his Twist of the Wrist books is priceless. | ||
| Midknyte |
Twist of the wrist is more a track/racing oriented book. Not much good at all for street riding. Blake, Yes, but I maintain that it is a very good book in regard to the XB's because it goes into minute details on how the many and small rider inputs go into how a performance bike reacts and behaves (as you yourself noted here). It is a very insightful book that explains exactly why "this" happens when I do "that"... It even explains how things you don't even realize you are doing can work against you. (Message edited by midknyte on August 03, 2005) | ||
| Henrik |
Sport Riding Techniques by Nick Ienatsch is a great book for techniques applicable for both street and track riding. One of his many good points address the "weak" rear brake. As he points out, on a sport bike, the rear brake is useful for settling the bike during turn entry, however a too strong rear brake will lock up the rear wheel and put you on your head in a hurry. I for one am still trying to "weaken" the rear brake on my SV. Anyway, Nick's book is a good read. Henrik | ||
| Truk |
Most common error I see is not understanding what to do, so panic sets in, handful of brake is grabbed, bike stands up and goes right thru the corner...not a pretty picture. In the vast number of accidents I have seen like this, it wasn't the bike's lack of capability to make the turn, but not understanding what to do,rider panic took over. The bike could have easily made the corner, but rider panic lead to the accident. Know and understand about why and how a bike turns. learn about things like counter steering, leaning, learning how to read corners, braking and what occurs with braking Learn how to read corners and look as far through them as you can. You go where you look. Look at pictures of racers in corners and notice where they are looking. They are looking way through the corner, not right in front of them. They are trusting the bike and we go where we look. Also, notice the front tire, it is pointing ever so slightly in the opposite direction of the corner direction (counter steering) If you are not scraping the pegs, you can lean it further. So if you get in too hot keep leaning and counter steering as smoothly as you can. Chances are you are a far ways from scraping a peg on a sport bike. Racers move the foot pegs even higher to give them more clearance, so that will give you an idea of the potential leaning capability a sport bike has If you doubt how far bikes can lean, go to an AMA race and watch the supersport and superstock races..or watch them on TV (SpeedChannel) Front brake is where most of your braking occurs and under hard braking the rear lightens up and is more prone to locking up. I mostly use front brakes. Look at your bike, most all the bike's brakes are on the front...Little dinky thing in the back...it is that way for a reason On tight turns get your braking done early and smoothly. Smooth on and off the brake lever and let the suspension settle. Then smoothly roll on the throttle. Practice this. Also, understand that as the bike is cornering it is scrubbing off speed and slowing you down some. in other words, leaning and turning is a kind of braking action in itself Keep your forearms loose, relaxed and parallel with the ground. Your arms are for steering, not for holding your body up. Your legs, stomach muscles and good posture are for holding you body up. Do not stiff arm the bike, keep relaxed and down with forearms parallel with the ground and countersteer and lean. Take you time, learn correctly. Ride with experienced riders who really know how to corner and ask them. Take your time and stay in your lane. If you are unable to stay in your lane you are going to fast for your skill level. Stay wide going in and close coming out, not the other way around Get some books and articles on the subject and read them. Practice, but do it incrementally... and practice correct techniques Be safe, have fun and take your time...no one has fun if you wreck, especially not you. The best part about these bikes is the cornering...anyone can twist a throttle in a straight line | ||
| 2hogs |
Truk, Thanks. I do those things now on the Harleys. Just at alot lower speeds. I just wondered if XB bikes had any 'strange' handling characteristics compared to the import bikes. I had a Sprint ST a few years back and knew how it handled. Just wanted to be prewarned of any XB unique things. Cheers | ||
| Truk |
I noticed that my XB9R handles great if I ride it properly, but is not as stable as my R1 if I get lazy, and don't. For example, with aggressive riding in the turns, it doesn't like me loading the front end with my weight (stiff arming versus holding my weight with back/posture, stomach muscles and thighs) keeping my arms relaxed, loose and parallel to the ground. But when i do things properly it is a blast. Truth is, no sportbike handles as good as it can when not ridden properly, but to me the XB a little bit more so. But in a way this is good, because it rewards proper riding and lets you know if you are not riding it right...i like that. It has made me a better rider Also, it does seem to be more prone to standing up in the corners with late braking. I like to do a bit of trail braking by feathering the front late into the corners, and it tends to want to stand up more than my R1 does when i do this. I take this into account when I ride this bike and do it less and lighter, but am prepared to muscle it over if need be. It seems to be more sensitive to body movement/postion. I like to hang off in the turns, and as mentioned above by someone else, I noticed it doesn't require quite as much as other V twin sport bike. I used to have a Honda VTR and that bike required a bit more body weight for the same effect I think the GP two stroke racing bike dimensions on the XB is the reason for some of the things i have mentioned, but that is also what makes this bike so special and fun when ridden properly With the low and centralized weight it is real stable once over, and easy to flick over from one side to the other Finally, the suspension settings including the tire pressure is important. The bike handbook is great about explaining what to do for your weight and riding. I made sure it was at the factory setting when I got mine. Rode it like that for a while then did a little tweaking...slowly. I am back at the factory setting now. Again, I think it is sensitive to this because of the bikes' dimensions (rake and trail) Just take your time.. get to know it...it will talk to you.... and have fun (Message edited by truk on August 04, 2005) | ||
| 2hogs |
Truk, Thanks again. That's what I was wondering. I'm mainly interested in the new Ulysses, so I don't see me getting too wild in the curves. It probably has more capability than I need but I'm mainly looking for a second commuter bike. If I can pack it up for motorcycle camping trips even better! | ||
| Truk |
From what i have read, I agree. The new Ulysses sounds like an outstanding bike for sport/adventure touring. Been tempted myself, as a former VFR owner and one who likes to take some rather long trips annually (e.g. - 2,500 miles during a week this past June on my R1.) This new Buell sounds right down my alley as an addition to my quiver of bikes,one that would allow both great handling as well as able to handle the luggage etc.... Last year Daves put together a Fly, Buy and Ride promotion. Can't think of a better bike for that or person and place to buy one and drive it back home to here in SC. Can't wait to see one in person... My only problem (besides coming up with the money) is that I would have to get rid of one of bikes to do it, and that would probably be the XB9R and I just love that little bike. | ||
| Jeremyh |
this is bar far the easiest bike i have ever learned to ride. i am serious when i say you will have it down in less than 2 miles as far as the basic handling. as far as higher performance demands in the twisties.......its only a matter of how bold are YOU and how well can you hang off without falling off. I •••• you not this is the easiest MC there is to ride in its class. DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE THIS BIKE ON HOW IT HANDLES THE CURVES. it will out handle you. most of the time you will find that this bike could care less if you hang off or not. PRESS AND TWIST!!!! (XB9R) | ||
| Bomber |
the propensity for standing up under trailing brakes can be lessened through tire choice -- while I"m sure the dimensions and geometry of the scoot contributes to this action, tubers do much the same thing, and they have very different geo and dimensions -- they respond to choice choice as well . . . . just a little more data | ||
| Diablobrian |
Lee Parks' book is more geared toward street racing call Total Control. I highly recommend it. Nick Ientasch also wrote a very good book, it is more racing oriented though. (Message edited by diablobrian on August 04, 2005) | ||
| Truk |
2Hogs, Based on the articles on the Ulysses I have read so far, I think some of my comments regarding my experience on my XB9R would not be as much of an issue with the new Ulysses. I say that because it has a longer swing arm and subsequently the wheel base, rake and trail are not quite as aggressive as the current XB models. | ||
| 2hogs |
Jeremyh, I don't doubt the Ulysses is blessed with sport bike handling qualities. I think the xb12x may have all the good qualities of a sportbike with the relaxed comfortable seating position I experience on my Road Glide. Throw the 3 hard cases on, and I have a baby Glide that can haul me to work, out camping, and play a little on the twisty backroads. If getting the 'feel' of it is as easy as you say, then I know I'll enjoy it for many years to come.  Just waiting for them to hit the dealers. | ||
| 2hogs |
Guys, Not sure about this trail braking thing, but think the same physics that allow the bike to round the curve causes most/all bikes to try to stand up when the brake(s) are applied? Sure seems that way on the Glide. Maybe I wasn't clear on some points. I'm not looking to push the XB12X to the jagged edge, just want a light (compared to the Road Glide), sporty, comfortable bike that can do many things well. The books maybe great reads, and I may pick one up after I get a Buell (XB12X maybe a XB12Ss) Cheers | ||
| 2hogs |
Truk, We maybe thinking the same things on the Ulysses. Hardcore dirt riders bash the 17" wheels. I see them as a Ulysses strength. Why? Look how many manufacturers make tires in those sizes and the variety of said tires!! From super sticky all out performance ones, to harder longer wearing ones. The more I read about the Ulysses, the more versatile it looks. I think Buell was very smart designing it like they did.  | ||
| Truk |
I agree. I think there are very few people that actually take the larger Dual Sports (R1200GS, KTM Adventurer) on serious off road trails. However to get down a fire gravel road to a camp ground dosesn't really require all that they offer, but the Ulysses sounds like it would have all you really need and then be better on the street and twisties | ||
| Opto |
Going from the Road Glide to the XB12X, you will have around 40% more HP and weigh 100 lbs+ less and have a huge cornering clearance. It will be a lot of fun to ride, keep it over 3000 rpm when cruising, and hang on when WOT and try to keep the front wheel on the ground. You'll need an aftermarket muffler so you can hear it and I would recommend a Drummer if it fits, because it delivers strong power from down low to up high. Since you've been riding for nearly 25 years I think you'll take to it like a duck to water, I don't think it will be quite as highly strung as the current XB models with the X's longer wheelbase and less steep rake and longer trail. | ||
| Whodom |
2hogs, I think your comments on the Ulysses wheel sizes are spot on. I followed the Suzuki V-stroms pretty closely for a while (there's a good group at Yahoo) and several of those guys were very interested into replacing their 19" front wheels with 17 inchers for just the reasons you mention. I think someone finally worked up a conversion with off-the-shelf Suzuki hardware. Oh yea, there is also a belt drive conversion kit sold for V-Stroms, developed in Europe I believe. I'll bet Buell was paying attention to these things when they were developing the Ulysses. | ||
| 2hogs |
Truk, I think you're right, the majority of DS riders may only be doing mild off-roading. I bet the U will handle what I have in mind just fine. Opto, Yea, almost 300lbs if the XB12X is ~ 500 wet. The Glide has the optional tour-pak and with 'must have' gear in the saddlebags she's close to 800lbs! I was hoping the Buell would curb some of my 'must customize' tendencies, as customizing the 2 Harleys have run into some crazy amounts of cash. Cheers | ||
| 2hogs |
Whodom, Yea, Buell is very inovative (sp?), and from what I've read here they listen and respond to the customer complaints and suggestions (new '06 air intake?). I think you're right. Buell let the other companies plant the DS/adventure/whatever seed in the US market, then researched what buyers said, then bought out a bike based on that research. Just my 0.02. Cheers | ||
| Midknyte |
I don't believe that the 06 air intake was a response to any complaints, at least in regards to intake, perhaps marginally related to fuel capacity. The reader base here just showed an alternative way of getting air in there and BMC used it to coincidentally allow them to close the hole thru the frame to allow more fuel storage. Just a zen moment in time... | ||
| Truk |
But it could have been a response to tank range issue, and solving that problem with comments about snorkle to come up with the present viable solution.... |
