| Author | Message | ||
     Dmhines |
I had to go in to work for a couple of hours today. On the way home I pull up next to a late model Corvette (bubble Headlights) at a stoplight. It's a wide open back road and when the light turns green and we both take off pretty quick. Then to my surprise he blows his horn and floors it ... I was like what? So I go WOT .. and within 5 seconds he was a red dot in my rear view mirror ... I guess he thought I was on a Vespa or something? | ||
| Xbud |
LOL - I love it when that happens. I guess some people aren't aware of the power to weight ratio on modern bikes | ||
| Dalton_gang |
I guess he figured out real quick that a 12 second car can`t beat a 10 second bike. | ||
| Captain_america |
He was just testing to see if you were a squid or a real bike rider lol | ||
| Stevek1125r |
Had that happen to me once... kind of Guy was on a R6..... except he was the little blue dot in my rear view and i was in the car...  in fact here shortly when i'm done with my car, i know the buell won't be able to catch it Good for you on the kill , but don't under estimate some cars... I know of one daily driver that has whooped a turbo Busa. the car sounds stock, but turbo's make a hell of difference, especially when you got 2 of them. | ||
| Puzzled |
As the owner of an 07 Vette and an 1125R....there is no way my Vette would launch with my Buell. Now on the top end blasts... put the 1125R away as the Vette will walk away from the Buell. My 1125R runs out around 165ish, the Vette is hardly wound up at that point. Two totally different animals. With that said, It is still real fun to try!  | ||
| T_man |
On that note; your right it was fun and I did try..! When I was on military flight training course we had a bunch of Danish exchange students on course with us. They had a decent tax break from coming overseas and with that they all bought hot late model sports cars; Corvettes, Mustangs, Porshes etc. We all decided to attend a drag race (fittingly organized on a runway) a few hours from our home base. While the results from the 1/4 races were obviously in my 1125R's favour (10.9 @ 131mph vs 13.4 @ mid 100's for the Vette) The ride BACK to the base was a different story. We had a long day and didn't see any point lolly gagging around on a basically straight highway so we hammered it back to base- for about 160 miles straight. After a few lesser vehicles (sorry Mustang & Camaro guys) fell behind I found myself in a deadlock with my Danish buddy in his C6 Vette. Let me makes this clear; we are used to bombing around in military aircraft at very low level and very high speeds so sustaining 150 mph/h + on the Queens highway wasn't that big a deal (to us at least  . Initally we took turns passing each other at 100 mph/h + but that quickly escalated into a flat out race. Top speed race. Me - stock exhaust at the time he with a Borla system not much else. It didn't turn out as bad as you might think! We wound out at about 170mph - each reluctant to push much harder. Perhaps he had a bit more in the tank, but if he did - he wasn't pushing it there. I was flat out. Anyways, point is; in the real world the 1125R won't lose out! | ||
| Jng1226 |
Great story T_man! Now that would be the best video... Somewhat related: the new issue of Sport Rider has a comparison between BMW's S1000RR and M3 both in ET and Lap time. I was disappointed that the difference in lap times were not greater. Jeff | ||
| Dannybuell |
Jng1226 - disappointed that they are all magazine sponsor's and no one want's to piss off a sponsor? | ||
| Nillaice |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Man0X0bf8vk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Jl9m--j2F4 | ||
| Xbud |
Thats funny you mention magazine sponsors getting pissed off Dannybuell, I just read this article about Dextor Ford getting fired for the "Blowing the Lid off" article. http://hellforleathermagazine.com/2010/07/leaked-d ocs-show-motorcyclist.html | ||
| Clk92vette |
The only stock vette that can even hang close is the ZR1. It's supposed to be good for a 0-60MPH of 3.1 seconds and an 11.30 1/4 mile. From what I've read, a stock 1125R can hit 60 MPH in 2.9 seconds and run the 1/4 in the mid 10's. The big difference is who's operating. I would be willing to bet that I could beat 90% of the 1125R owners(including myself) in the 0-60 sprint with the ZR1, and quite a few again thorugh the 1/4. Launcing the Vette requires about 10% of the skill required to launch the 1125R hard. I am still trying to figure out how to repeatedly get my feet on my pegs in time to make the 1-2 shift cleanly. After the 1/4 the ZR1 would walk away from the R. | ||
| Jdugger |
It's still all about the corners. Unless you are turning left and right, it's not really a race that separates the men from the boys. Brakes and turns are where tons of time is made. At my home course, sports cars and bikes turn roughly the same kinds of times. Given a bike's huge acceleration advantage, that certainly tells you something about corner speeds. Try keeping up with a fast cart or open wheel. Not even a remotely close contest. The track record is fully 5 seconds faster on my home 2.5 mile circuit by a pro open wheel driver, set in a single day of testing, than the motorcycle record set by a pro (AMA) motorcycle racer who rides there 3 times a week. 5 seconds! In just one lap! That's a lifetime in road racing! Just under half a second PER CORNER! | ||
| Fast1075 |
If you foot shift...leave with you left foot on the peg...you just have to be careful that you are perfectly vertical when you launch... | ||
| Jng1226 |
Oh boy, this is turning into the infamous car vs. bike thread, almost as bad as another oil thread! Nillaice - that 1198S vs. GT-R is a great video. However, I really think it depends on the track. Given the same skill of rider vs. driver, most magazine comparisons I've seen have the bike consistently beating the car. Modern motorcycle rubber is so sticky now that it allows bikes to really put the power down, and also approach 1G on a flat skidpad. In the case of Cadwell Park, there are a lot of undulations in the track where the bike can't help but pull a wheelie and the rider has to back off. Try the same comparison at Silverstone or something similar and I'd wager the outcome would be significantly different. Clk92vette - when you say the ZR1 would walk away from the R after the 1/4, that would be AFTER the ZR1 finally caught up with the 1125 on their way to terminal (top) speeds. Besides being almost a second faster to the 1/4, the 1125 is also going 10+ mph faster. So not until the 1125 hits is mid-150s, low-160's drag-limited top speed would the ZR1 begin to catch up and then eventually pass the 1125. You would need a mighty long straight road to see that happen. Finally, to put another check box in the bike column, for a little more than the original 1125 MSRP, you can have a base BMW S1000RR, that has been tested to do mid 9's stock with a trap speed in the mid-150's. Only a stock Bugatti Veyron has a chance of catching that bike, and again you would need a very long road because of the scale of speed involved. Jeff | ||
| Jng1226 |
+1 Jdugger on the kart lap times. My home track for years was Viginia International Raceway (VIR). My 2000 Aprilia Mille R did 6,000+ miles on that track in the early 2000's. Because VIR has so many different configurations, it would be common to have a car day on one side and a bike day on the other. We would all break for lunch and eat at the same restaurant at the track. Sitting next to a full Sparco-outfitted Porsche GT3 amateur driver we would discuss lap times. He proudly stated that the "fast" street car group would do right around 2:00 lap times on the North Course (the same track that AMA Pro races are run on). I feigned amazement and it was everything I could do not to burst his bubble with my personal best of 1:34 (10 seconds off the AMA Pro racer pace) on the same bike I rode to bike night, albeit with race tires and bodywork:  Then on another day it was the same situation except it was national kart meet on the North Course, while bikes were on the South Course. The shifter karts with bodywork (more aerodynamic) had a top speed of about 115 at the end of the front straight where I would see about 155 on my Aprilia. The "fast" aero shifter kart lap time? Wait for it: 1:12 Another 12 seconds faster than AMA Pro Superbikes, who are going almost 180 at the end of the front straight. Don't even think of trying to corner or change direction with a shifter kart! Jeff | ||
| Clk92vette |
Fast1075: I have been putting both feet as far back and leaning as far forward as possible to keep the front end down. It probably is time to try just one foot. It certainly will increase the amount of clutch slippage required at launch, but I just can't get the left foot in position with repeatability. Jng1126 I have two rebuttals: 1) I did not say when the ZR1 would walk away from the 1125R after the 1/4 mile traps, admittedly it would take some time to catch up and then blow by pretty hard. 2) "Oh boy, this is turning into the infamous car vs. bike thread, almost as bad as another oil thread!" It still managed to lure you into a few minutes worth of posting! It's all just good clean fun. I wish I could land a job finding the answers to such compelling questions. | ||
| T_man |
Nothing to do with this thread; Jng1126 - thats a beautiful Aprilla! Ok, carry on..  | ||
| Fresnobuell |
ZR1 will be well into six figures with it's "on-the-road" price. You can get an R for four figues all day long. I am constantly amazed by the performance/dollar with sportbikes...ezpecially during Buell firesale last Fall/Winter. | ||
| Jng1226 |
Clk92vette - yes, I LOVE the car vs. bike debate and am always suckered into it. I love both, but can afford way more bike than I can car. Plus, I can drive a sports cage when I'm old, rickety and can no longer maneuver on a sportbike. T_man - thanks and I do miss her a lot. She was the bomb in her day! More pics:    Jeff | ||
| Fresnobuell |
It probably is time to try just one foot I always launch hard with one foot on the left peg. I like the ability to keep my body from sliding back on the seat with the foot on the peg. Also, allows to keep weight over the front end. I can also snick into second gear even when my right foot might not be on the peg yet. I can't stand the two foot down launch. feels like I am less control of the bike in the superman position. | ||
| Jng1226 |
Another good point Fresnobuell. With cars, you can have a production-car based racer that will indeed lap faster than a bike, due mainly to aerodynamic enhancements such as splitters, wings, undertrays, etc. Case in point would be the new factory GT2 BMW M3 race car. However, to LEASE that from the factory for a season would be around $500,000. It will lap Laguna Seca probably 30 seconds faster than a stock M3 with the same pro driver. Take a Ducati 1098R, buy every race upgrade offered by Ducati Corse and it will be around $70K to OWN. And, with the same pro-level rider on both at Laguna Seca, it will lap only about 10-12 seconds faster that the stock 1098R with race rubber. The point being that aside from the sheer value equation for performance, street sportbikes are much closer to their pure racing brethren than cages will ever be. Jeff | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Take a Ducati 1098R, buy every race upgrade offered by Ducati Corse and it will be around $70K to OWN. And, with the same pro-level rider on both at Laguna Seca, it will lap only about 10-12 seconds faster that the stock 1098R with race rubber. I would be surprised if it even would be that much of a difference (10-12 seconds). On a short track without a true straight like Laguna, if I remember right the difference between the Superbikes (1000cc) and Sportbikes (600cc) is in the 2-3 second range. 10-12 seconds is significant when laptimes are in the 1:30 range. This means you would be lapped in approximately 8-9 laps. | ||
| Cataract2 |
These are stock 1125s we seem to be talking about. How about one with a pipe and the Race ECM or tune? | ||
| Thefleshrocket |
What some of you guys don't take into account that a lot of why bikes turn better numbers than cars is because bikes launch harder than cars. While a bike may easily show its taillight to a car from a dig, a run from a roll against a high powered car may be less favorable for the bike. In this particular case, I'd actually put my money on the zr1 if it ran an 1125r from an 80mph roll. | ||
| D_adams |
Somebody's gonna get a seriously rude awakening going up against an 1125 with a pipe/ecm. A corvette does this one in 8 seconds and had almost 600 hp at the wheel. Sure, it's fast, but how much did it cost to get it to this point? A stock 1125 will do it as fast, 60-140 mph. (Message edited by d_adams on July 13, 2010) | ||
| Jng1226 |
Cataract2 - I think even with a full exhaust and custom mapped race ECM you would only gain about 10-15 peak HP, albeit with a fatter midrange as well. There is a formula for calculating ET with weight and HP, someone here may know it, but I would wager it would only amount to less than 1/2 second and 5mph in the 1/4 mile. So going by generally accepted test data, you'd be looking at high 9's and 140 mph at best. Still impressive and still smoking every 4 wheel stock street vehicle. Thefleshrocket - I tend to disagree with your assessment of why bikes have faster ETs than cars. Traction issues aside, it comes down to power-to-weight ratio. Watch the first video link that Nillaice provided above. They compare a 1198S to a Nissan GT-R. The 1198S weighs about 583lbs ready-to-ride with a 150 lb rider and puts about 150 hp to the wheel, for a 3.89 lbs for every hp to move. The Nissan GT-R weighs about 4070 lbs ready-to-drive with the same weight driver and puts about 435 hp to the wheels, resulting in 9.35 lbs for every hp to move. Stated another way, the Nissan GT-R has 140% more mass to move for every HP it makes than the 1198S. In straight line acceleration the GT-R makes up for its weight with AWD and short gearing for an 11.6 ET at 120.4 mph (source - R&T online), while the Ducati runs 10.02 ET at 145.2 mph. Not only does the 1198S get to the finish line 1.6 seconds sooner, it is pulling away at 15mph at that point. You bring up an interesting point about starting from 80 mph with an 1125 vs a ZR1. I'm not sure of the answer but I would take your bet and back the 1125 if you were racing to 130 mph or so. My reasoning is that again because of the superior power-to-weight ratio of motorcycles, the motorcycle will accelerate to its top speed in less time than the car. I propose that the acceleration advantage is the same whether from standing start or within a reasonable speed, up to say 80% of a vehicle's top speed. Even though bikes have terrible drag coefficients compared to sports cars, their superior power-to-weight ratio more than makes up the difference. The same R&T test had a ZR1 with an 11.5 ET at 128.7 mph, still about 1-second and 10 mph slower than a stock 1125R at the 1/4 mile. Fresnobuell - After thinking about it, I agree with you. I think the difference between a Ducati Corse-modded 1098R and stock 1098R on the same race tires would only be 5-6 seconds around a place like Laguna Seca. I bet most of the time would be made powering up the hill after turn 6 towards the Corkscrew and blasting out of turn 11 towards turns 1 and 2, with the extra 40 or so HP you would get with the Corsa full exhaust, race ECU, cams and pistons. Go someplace like Road America, and there you might see the 10 second difference in lap times I was thinking about. Jeff | ||
| Jules |
It's pretty acodemic in reality, it's not often you'll run across any car capable of keeping up with any half decent bike (not in the UK anyway) and if you do the chances are they paid tens of thousands more £ or $ for their ride. I have a lovely 400hp Supercharged Jag in the garage at home, it's astonishingly quick (for a car) but if I'm in a hurry I always take the bike. If you factor in "traffic" to the equation then it's always going to end badly for the car, they'll still be sat at the back of some queue somewhere whilst I'm back at home drinking a cold one. It is great fun though when you do meet a fast car with a good driver. I couldn't get past the guy in his Scooby the other week, he could carry a lot more corner speed than me with all 4 tyres gripping and his 4 wheel drive...but at the faintest whiff of a straight I was right on his exhaust. When we got to the end of the road there was a queue and I just rode past him smiling and could see the huge grin on his face too.. Anything FAST with wheels and an engine is cool | ||
| D_adams |
I got to do a roll-on against a newer vette today, guess who won? Hehehe. I waited for him to go, dropped to 3rd (pretty sure he did the same by the sound of the exhaust) and rolled by him doing maybe 120 or so and just flat out smoked him. Did it twice just to make sure he got the point since he started it with the revving of the motor next to me on the highway. | ||
| Torquaholic |
Okay, I'll bite. i love reading stories about mismatched races. I know it is in no way Buell related, but here's one of my favorite duels: |
