| Author | Message | ||
     _gdkp_ |
hi guys, now i have seen this part today: http://www.EBRacing.com/shop/product121.html Is it better than the not-targeted (built in 08 - 1125 models?) If yes, how many i need - 2? or 1? Thanks! | ||
| Thurstonbuell |
 Hmmmm.... I wonder what kind of improvement that could make to my baby ? | ||
| Xodot |
what does a targeted do differently than a non-targeted? | ||
| Easyrider |
good question.... | ||
| _gdkp_ |
hmm - i wrote a mail to Erik Buell Racing after 2 min i opened this thread... i´m interested | ||
| Boogiman1981 |
it's my understanding that the ports on the injector are 'aimed' more at the valve heads themselves where the OE for 08 were just a generic downward spray pattern | ||
| Syonyk |
Hm... If they went to these for 09, that would explain some of the improvements. Spraying gas directly on hot intake valves is a great way to get it pre-vaporized on the way into the intake, and the intake system should respond better to power changes (as you're not building up fuel on the wall). Anyone want to try a set?  | ||
| Boogiman1981 |
someone here did last year as i recall it they weren't completely happy with it. i may be wrong on that. i think the conclusion was that it needed the fuel maps from a 09-10 bike? you could do a search it should be archived | ||
| Easyrider |
I have them tested in my 2008, you need to remap the bike completly | ||
| Froggy |
Everyone with 2009 or 10 models already has  | ||
| Thurstonbuell |
I wouldnt think E B R would sell and market them as a "drop in replacement" if you needed 09 or 10 mapping , we shall wait and see what E B R's email response is ... | ||
| Easyrider |
Maybe someone can find out what the brand or partnumber is.. | ||
| Thurstonbuell |
Easy , "I have them tested in my 2008, you need to remap the bike completely" Well you blew my theory out of the water , oh well , so how does the E B R ecm's work thru out the 08 to 10 line up ? | ||
| Thurstonbuell |
This just in from Erik Buell Racing : ..... asked if there was any substantial benefit using the targeted injectors.... Ken , Not so much with a stock ’08 ECM. It wouldn’t have the adjusted injector timing and a few other bits that improved low speed drivability and emissions for ’09 and 2010 model year bikes. We put those up as a “nice to have” add on for our race ECM’s combined with an ’08 bike. Not necessary, but a minor incremental improvement to light throttle drivability. (Message edited by Thurstonbuell on June 24, 2010) | ||
| Highscore |
This is the source for Helícon injectors: http://www.synerject.com/fuelinjectors.html The difference between the "old" 08-injectors and the last one is the spray pattern of the injector´s nozzle, spraying now with two sharp fuel bundles onto each valve. Spraying the fuel directly onto the intake valves is in my opinion a little bit old-fashioned. This is a feature of the 80th and 90th, it is good for idle and partial load regarding emissions. But for performance and response a injector position upstream of the throttle body is preferred in our days. The idea behind this is to prolong the air stream to assure a better mixture formation, giving the fuel more time to evaporate. From that point of view the best location of an injector is above of the velocity stack at the very beginning of the intake path. | ||
| Bertman |
Interesting indeed. I am one of the guys that experimented with the 09 injectors in my 08, and it did run like crap. Now my question would be, does the E B R race ecm have a different map between the 08 and 09 models to accommodate the different stock injectors or does it work fine with both style injectors? | ||
| _gdkp_ |
hi now i got the answer from Erik Buell Racing: "It would provide marginal improvement in low speed drivability." "We offer them as an option for customers with ’08 bikes." | ||
| D_adams |
I got a set last week, they do help for the bottom end, especially in conjunction with the race ecm. You need a pair of them, one for each cylinder. Took me about 1/2 hour to install them, that included taking off the lower airbox twice. | ||
| Bertman |
Well since you all got my curiosity up, I reinstalled the 09 targeted injectors back into my 08 when I got off work earlier. Like Dean says, it takes about 1/2 hour so no big deal to change them out. I only rode around for about 5 miles and did not notice any stutters like it did with the stock ecm when I tried this experiment before. With the stock 08 injectors and E B R race ecm my bike ran great so I'm going to have to go on a good ride this weekend before I give it my two thumbs up or not award. | ||
| Thurstonbuell |
D_adams , "A pair for each cylinder" meaning 4 in total ? | ||
| D_adams |
NO, you need a total of 2 injectors. | ||
| D_adams |
Here's a pic of my 08's that I took out last week.  | ||
| Mountainstorm |
Looks more stuff for those of us with tinkeritus lol Thanks for linking me to the discussion Froggy. To clarify, if I have an Erik Buell Racing race ECM for an 08 will it need a reflash to use these injectors correctly? Or is it really PnP? | ||
| Ratbuell |
That's a good question for Erik Buell Racing. I don't know if their race ECM's automatically include the revised injector software or not...but I bet they know  | ||
| D_adams |
From what I gather, the ecm doesn't really care which injector you have, but it will smooth out the low rpm even more with the targeted injectors. I get a slight surge at 5-6k rpm, but I'm running the Erik Buell Racing base race calibration right now and it might be feedback from the O2 sensors causing it to cycle up and down from rich to lean while cruising. I have the wideband setup, so I know it's not actually running lean based on the live display unit. I see it cycle up and down, so I know it's trying to maintain whatever setting is in the ecm. I'll disconnect the narrowband outputs and see how it runs, but in general, it's pretty damn good, although I know for a fact it's got more power available with the correct tune. The $64 question is, how much more? | ||
| Easyrider |
There we go again, You measure something and then you tell people what you measure dont guess with fuell it is not working of you love your Buell get THE right amount of fuel | ||
| D_adams |
I'm not guessing. They did the work, I'm just reporting what I see on the display unit. The basic race map is NOT perfect for the exhaust I make, although it's a LOT better than the stock calibration. Just my opinion here, but I'll take what the guys at Erik Buell Racing tell me over ANYTHING anyone else has to say, they DESIGNED the bike and I'm pretty sure they know what they're doing. Nothing against what you've been doing, but info direct from the guys that made the bike, I'll take that as gospel and go with it. I watched almost the entire tuning process for the Drummer exhaust, it was close to 5 hours of work and that was starting from their base race calibration, which is pretty damn good to begin with. There's no real "guesswork" involved, it's all logged and recorded data, from there, changes get made, run again to verify results, then tweak a little more to extract the maximum amount of everything out of the bike. It's way more complicated than what I'd want to tackle without a lot of spare time on my hands. Not to mention, the guys up there at Erik Buell Racing are the nicest guys around. | ||
| Easyrider |
Dont talk about things you did not measure yourself, that's all i say now chill and take à drink | ||
| D_adams |
So, I can't report what I see, what I know to be facts, or what the guys at Erik Buell Racing tell me? Hmm. I've stated that I'm not a tuner, No, I don't know anything about it except for old school tuning with a 4 gas analyzer using jets, needles and whatnot, and that I'm using what they've done. What I have done is install this on my bike to see what it's doing. I certainly don't know it all, but I know enough to be fairly dangerous in certain company. Live display, not running.  Wideband Bosch LSU 4.2 sensor. Before you ask, yes, there's 2 of them, the rear is just in a place hard to get pics of it, so I didn't bother.  PLX Devices, bagged, taped, wrapped and sealed.  } | ||
| Easyrider |
You forget to take à drink, what i say is tune it for 2008 then put that ecm in à 2009 and tell me what you see, i think you understand perfect hoe things work, you only didn't did it |
