| Author | Message | ||
     Bearly |
Thanks Annoy, I missed my opportunity for that. That's using the old cranium Zac Thanks. | ||
| Xb9 |
ok, got my bike back after the reflash. It does seem to run smoother,better in some respects, except when cruising in the 3-4K range - that is now worse! : ( And that's the only area I had a gripe with in the original calibration. You'd think that's where the improvements would be focused. Left the shop the AFV's were at 100, stopped after I got off the freeway and they had not adjusted. Rode about 15 more miles on the secondary streets while it was bucking and surging in the 3-4K range. Seemed to get worse the more I rode it in this range Checked it again when I got home and the Frt. AFV went to 95. Rear is still 100. I just don't get it. Something in the ECM programming is way screwed up. The bike is obviously running lean in that range, and when the ECM learns, it makes it even leaner . Doesn't make sense. Someone at Buell needs to get their S$&t together and get it sorted out, and quick. If they have to run it that fricking lean to pass the emissions, then they should have put a damn cat on it to begin with. This crap I never noticed on the track before I bought one, but I thought it's supposed to be a street bike first... sorry, had to vent...very frustrated. | ||
| Slypiranna |
Venting understood xb9, hang in there. I have a feeling BMC has knowledge of all this by now and will enlighten us all soon. | ||
| Donutclub |
Xb9, at least you could get the reflash done. I've been at my dealer twice and they have been unsuccessful on both attempts. They finally gave up and decided to order me a new ECM.............still waiting. | ||
| Zac4mac |
Donut - persistence and luck count. The ECMs are on backorder till June sometime. Have them keep fiddling with yours and call BMC while they're doing it. Mine took two tries, total of around 3 hours. Z | ||
| Cataract2 |
Till June? Hm, wonder what's going on? | ||
| Zac4mac |
That's probably a date pulled from a very dark place. But that's what the computer showed when I asked the dealer to check on it. | ||
| Xb9 |
Does anyone know if the Dealers have the ability to program the old calibration back into the ecm? | ||
| Chevycummins |
It seems like they should be able to put the original program back in. I can with GM vehicles If the customer does not like the updated program. They should be able to call Buell and get the program number, I would think? | ||
| Bearly |
Right now I'm like'n the old program better. Mine is surging slightly from 3k through and above 6k in steady state. Zac, the fans are running duel speeds now I think. When I turned the ignition switch off, they both went from a lower rpm to a higher one. Is that what you meant? Thanks in advance.  | ||
| Zac4mac |
Bear - yup that's it. | ||
| Xb9 |
Well, I feel like an idiot for slamming this new calibration, as I have found my surging/bucking problems self-induced. At least I have found my problem though. Here is what I have determined, and pay particular attention if you have disabled the Active Air solenoid. I did some searching on this site and found an early Anonymous post for July 07 in a discussion on if the 1125r was throttle by wire. The anon poster stated in effect that the Active Air Solenoid was on there for enhanced drivability. This was posted way before someone made the statement that it was only for EPA noise control and you could disconnect the cable with no ill effects. Actually, my observations with the original calibration was that it did indeed help drivability when disconnected. Then I got the new calibration flashed and it was way worse, mostly in the 3-4k range. So after I dug up the early anon. post I decided to re-install the Active Air solenoid and see if it would make a difference. Night and day difference. Period. It runs so smooth now in that range it is the best it has ever been and I cannot fault the fueling in any way. So if you disconnected the Active Air solenoid I would suggest reconnecting it. Live and learn. And don't believe everything you read, just some of it. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show .cgi?tpc=290431&post=939513#POST939513 | ||
| Thurstonbuell |
Damn Xb , You had me all excited , I never disconnected mine ,and my driveability is BAD , atleast at lower rev's , heck I've noticed some surging as high as 5000 rpms , but still most noticeably 4000 and below . Now I even get "popping" and light "backfiring" on deceleration .  I still love this bike more than anything , when I get these issues resolved she'll be PERFECT !!! (Message edited by Thurstonbuell on May 22, 2008) | ||
| Xb9 |
Thurston - I'm just sharing what I have experienced and observations. I haven't put a lot of miles on the bike since I re-attached the 'noid cable, but like I said, on mine it was night and day. I hope it doesn't change or 'learn' the wrong direction. We'll see with time. Could yours possibly be inoperative or not adjusted properly? I adjusted mine per the procedure in the '05 XB service manual for a Japanese model (those had an Active Air "noid) All this confusion could be averted if we had a service manual...... and some technical information instead of silence from those in the know....please? (Message edited by xb9 on May 22, 2008) | ||
| Slypiranna |
"Well, I feel like an idiot for slamming this new calibration, as I have found my surging/bucking problems self-induced. At least I have found my problem though. Here is what I have determined, and pay particular attention if you have disabled the Active Air solenoid. I did some searching on this site and found an early Anonymous post for July 07 in a discussion on if the 1125r was throttle by wire. The anon poster stated in effect that the Active Air Solenoid was on there for enhanced drivability. This was posted way before someone made the statement that it was only for EPA noise control and you could disconnect the cable with no ill effects. Actually, my observations with the original calibration was that it did indeed help drivability when disconnected. Then I got the new calibration flashed and it was way worse, mostly in the 3-4k range. So after I dug up the early anon. post I decided to re-install the Active Air solenoid and see if it would make a difference. Night and day difference. Period. It runs so smooth now in that range it is the best it has ever been and I cannot fault the fueling in any way. So if you disconnected the Active Air solenoid I would suggest reconnecting it. Live and learn. And don't believe everything you read, just some of it. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show .cgi?tpc=290431&post=939513#POST939513" ? Now I'm really confused. I was told by a veteran Buell Tech, fresh from the 1125R seminar the following; "The intake solenoid's only purpose is to pull the butterflies back slightly to meet epa noise limits." I would really love to hear how this could affect air fuel ratios at many different load points (closed loop) and or the rider's perception of rideability? Is there anyone with factual data monitoring this thread and or website that can elaborate on this? I am not posting here to argue or discredit anyone. I am very much trying to help my own 11's issues and possibly others with similar experience. Any info would be most appreciated. | ||
| Crowley |
I'd really like to know the facts on this solenoid issue as well because mine is faulty and replacements are not available in the UK. Seems like the reflash doesn't stop the random overnight discharges either  | ||
| Xb9 |
Sly, Yea, this is a bit confusing. And I also am not posting here to argue or discredit anyone. But the performance tells the story - it does make drivability differences. Thinking out loud, if the 'noid is altering the intake flow "in certain conditions" and they developed the fuel maps while it is functioning the same, then removing the 'noid will throw things off. Kinda makes sense. Just another component that will affect mapping like a different exhaust or changing an airbox or new port job on the heads. Plus throw in the fact the the ECM controls it.... We just need hard factual information from BMC. | ||
| Slypiranna |
Based upon XB9's post of resolve...I've reconnected the entire solenoid assembly, removed my 1:1 throttle lock and tried every adjustment in 1/8" increments from minimum to maximum with the noids travel. Wideband shows no fueling difference, still very lean in the hickup zones. All positive conditions gained before are now worse. I even hooked up a test led indicator light in series with the noid to verify whether if its a player down low. The positive lead to the noid is always hot and switches to ground via the ecu. No where in closed loop, below 4k rpm does this noid energize. I can't see it a player in feedback either as this is only a two wire device. The base fuel maps might have been tuned with the noid in place, however, a properly functioning Adaptive Fuel system should see a rich or lean condition...as we understand it... and therefor modify slightly and within a reasonable amount of time. No changes after two hours of testing in Adaptive Fuel. Back to the drawing board...I'd love to be paid by the hour for all this!  | ||
| Zac4mac |
The Electrical Diagnostics Manual says it's for noise abatement. There is a DTC for "No Feedback" for the Active Air System. I assume the feedback would be from the TPS, verifying that the solenoid closed the throttle some. | ||
| Slypiranna |
By the way...a question for the post flash owner crowd that runs without the airbox lid mod... Did any of you note a different and or louder, more aggressive intake "sound" in the upper 4k to low 5k rpm regions under full throttle acceleration? Please pm me if ness'y | ||
| Xb9 |
MM, email sent | ||
| Chevycummins |
I talked to Mat at Buell about the active intake solenoid. He told me that they did have a problem meeting noise regulations at a certain rpm in 3rd or 4th gear so they installed this device that pulls back the throttle to 11 percent to reduce noise. He did not really go into great detail about it but it was just to reduce noise. It should not effect fueling if removed. I just disconnected my cable today and it seems about the same to me. Still surges and jerks under 3500rpm. My bike also sets code p0193 sometimes. | ||
| Slypiranna |
xb9, never got it,,,but I think you know my direct contact. Thanks, mm | ||
| Xb9 |
sent it again to your yahoo email | ||
| Crowley |
Thanks fellas. That's what I needed to know. | ||
| Rcrboy |
I road tested my dealer's demo bike after they did the reflash. It was much smoother in the low rev range. And you could accelerate in a high gear/low speed conditions without having to down shift to avoid the "herky-jerky" thing.  BUT! When accelerating at higher speeds, while it felt SMOOTHER, it also felt slower. Since I was not on a track I don't have any lap times, but only a seat of the pants feeling. I'm not going to have it done to my bike. I like the "raw-race" like feeling of the original ECU Map. it just feels more "crisp" The new mapping has a more "civilized" feel to it. So that makes it not a Buell, just another "Jap" like bike  just my 2cents -Mark- | ||
| Thurstonbuell |
I wonder if they have the original flash available , I would at this point like to go back to my original bike that i had prior to the re-flash | ||
| Mingo |
If the surging you guys are experiencing is indeed due to lean fuel conditions,i'd do a leak-down or at least compression check to compare the valves-seats condition now versus later,to see if my valves-seats were being damaged. | ||
| Spectrum |
No going back for me. After the front and rear finally adapted, mine is just about perfect. Very smooth at all rpm's with only a very slight surge now and again when holding steady at 3500K. | ||
| Doerman |
I'm only going from my own experience here. But if the re-flash does not improve how the bike runs, I'd have the dealer look for other causes rather than go back to the previous ECU program version. Mine was running good before the re-flash. After the re-flash, it is running better and it also improved the fuel mileage. The improvements were not there immediately though. Took a few miles before it was apparent (400 or so). |
