| Author | Message | ||
     Brumbear |
I looked at 2 r's on the floor today sitting on the bike left front weld joint the metal looks distorted to me like bent to quickly more than a cruddy weld I did not care for the fit and finish of the machine I am sorry I want to find every reason to like this I loved the adjustable gear shifter I don't care much for the placement of the rear brake lever but having ridden one I would quickly dismiss minor things once purchased but the welds are a major concern. I know I have dissmissed buying one before but to ride it is truly magic and keeps me at least trying to justify getting one .I was wondering if you all who purchased them have left front weld disfigurement or whatever it is? | ||
| M2nc |
Yup. I made comment on the same finding earlier. It looks like weld spatter got on the frame and someone ground it off. (Message edited by M2nc on February 02, 2008) | ||
| Fresnobuell |
If you are dismissing this bike because it has a slight "metal distortion" that no one will notice unless pointed out, you were not serious about buying it in the first place. That goes for the welds on the can too.... | ||
| Brad1445 |
After two visits to two dealers with two different friend, believe me people notice. Remember once you are an owner of anything few people will give you honest feedback other than positive. | ||
| Gschuette |
Yeah no one notices details that lead to a perception of quality.  | ||
| Rocketman |
If you are dismissing this bike because it has a slight "metal distortion" that no one will notice unless pointed out, you were not serious about buying it in the first place. That goes for the welds on the can too.... Blind faith. Good job Buell aren't in the flying game! Rocket | ||
| Bearly |
I've looked at thousand of welds on airplanes on crome moly, aluminum and other metals. I did for a living. That super small area I think you are speaking of could have been formed before the two pieces were heli arched / welded. It is only on one side of the weld. I haven't cut mine apart, but if there is a baffle attached to the other side that could be what you are seeing as well. I bought one. To me, it looks put together better than most other brands. | ||
| Jpfive |
Some folks are more concerned about cosmetics that others. I saw the dimple on the left frame as soon as I sat on mine (before purchase) - ran my finger over it, thought, "no big deal". As far as the welds go, the puddle is uniform, if a little industrial. It is no worse than the welds on the polished frame of my Aprilia were, or my XB for that matter. Overall fit and finish is pretty darn good, in my opinion, especially considering these are the first down the line. I suspect the 'dimple' will disappear in future batches of frames - but I sure am glad that Buell didn't delay production of my bike because of it. Jack | ||
| Hughlysses |
I noticed the same thing on the first and only 1125R I've seen (~4 weeks ago at Thundertower HD/Buell in Elgin, SC). It's amazing how uniform this area is from bike to bike judging from the photos that have been posted. I agree with Bearly- it looks like the slight distortion in the metal occurred when the frame rail was formed. I also agree with Jack, it ain't the prettiest welding I've ever seen, but it looks functional. Hopefully the later bikes will look better. | ||
| M2nc |
The wave is just a poor job by the supplier. I also believe that Buell passed the parts as acceptable because it was on the frame. I believe their mistake is not taking into account where those welds are located in the frame. If it was in a location less visible I would have agreed with their decision. A few facts I have noticed. 1. The XB frames from a different supplier do not have these imperfections. 2. Not all 1125R have these imperfections. 3. Not all 1125R have these imperfections on the same side. 4. Will the welds hold? Absolutely, this is purely a cosmetic issue. 5. Do they look desirable in that location? No. If you are dismissing this bike because it has a slight "metal distortion" I have rejected many parts for the same thing on the job. I would not dismiss the bike as a whole for that, but would not buy a particular bike for that. I suspect that as the new supplier gets their crap together and Buell forces them to improve their product quality those waves will go away in the future. | ||
| Spectrum |
My bike has the distortion on the frame. I didn't even notice it till I went looking for it. For me it's a non-issue. I did however notice some orange peal paint imperfections on the frame. That's an easy problem to solve with a little wet sanding and buffing. I also corrected a minor fit issue with the seat by simply reshaping the plastic under piece. I use a heatgun and bend the plastic till it was properly shaped. I also had to do this to the Select Seat when I added it to my XB9S. I have yet to find any motorcycle or car that didn't have minor fit, finish or quality imperfections ill-regardless of who manufactured it. Most of these are easily corrected. I'm much more concerned about problems that effect functionality. Aesthetic problems are generally in-expensive and easy to fix. Functional problems tend to be expensive or difficult to resolve. My .02 cents worth. | ||
| Zac4mac |
If y'all are talking about what I think you are... I saw them on mine within the first minute, Discussed them with the dealer. Decided it was a sink from a baffle or somesuch and moved on. It's really hard to see, light has to be just right. Baby's got a dimple. Z | ||
| Slaughter |
I have a question: The XB frame is made by a different casting method and weighs 10 pounds more! Would you pay 10 pounds to get the look? | ||
| Mikef5000 |
It is also not made in the USA like the 1125r frame is. So, would you pay 10 pounds and foreign made to get the look? | ||
| Doerman |
Brad. That is sooo sick!  Good think I haven't had my breakfast yet. | ||
| Slaughter |
What Mike said! Illinois v. Italy AND 10 pounds lighter. | ||
| Court |
There is a good deal of misinformation and "net-guessing" about the frames. I'd say Slaughter has some valuable data. Just a construction workers guess. | ||
| Jackbequick |
During the recent discussion here about the casting process used in making the new frame (called ablation casting) I exchanged a couple emails with a guy I found through an Internet link about the process. I was sort of looking for a description of the process and perceived advantages in "laymans" words. I did get some interesting info and, at the end of it all, I found that I was talking an engineer from the company that makes the 1125R frames for Buell. I don't have the specifics here but I'll dig them out and post them later today. Ablation casting is a relatively new casting process and it does bring some improved mechanical properties (tensile strength, rigidity, etc.) to that casting. It would not surprise me that there may be some dimples or other visible effects coming out of the new process that will be worked out over time. You are seeing the first implementation of a relatively new process there. Until I start seeing or hearing of 1125R frames collapsing or caving in, I am still a believer in the integrity of Buell as a company. And if I owned a 1125R I think I could accept the some of the cosmetic issues described here as one of the prices of owning a motorcycle with the "character" of the Buell. And it is not going to surprise me to hear that Buell takes this info to heart and works out the details to the favor and advantage of their buyers. It is unfortunate that some of the people in the process (at the dealers for example) seem to be less interested in working out the details, making amends, and administering hugs when they are needed. If you wanted something that might look better with all the pieces exposed to close scrutiny you might be happier with something with a little less character, like a HoKaSuYa rice rocket. Jack | ||
| Brad1445 |
I love the take it or leave it marketing approach. Why is it so difficult for parents to recognize ugly or defective children. It does not lessen your love for said child. I hate the headlights on my 999, My Busa is FUGLY, the exhaust cans are a HUGE JOKE. There, see how easy it is. I could go on but I have a garage full of ugly and hate to type. | ||
| Brad1445 |
they're not problems, they are opportunities to get better, but only if allowed to be discussed. | ||
| Slaughter |
The thing is that ALL marketing is "take it or leave it" when you reduce it to an elemental level. I'd strongly recommend that somebody NOT BUY an 1125R if they are driven by the looks of the castings and welds in their buy/not-buy decision. Ditto for the scoops Ditto for the wide fairing Heck for me, talk is cheap since I don't have the money to put down on one right now anyways (motorcycles for me are a cash-only deal nowadays) Not saying there's NOT room for cosmetic improvement(s) - it's more likely a matter of priorities. We've been interested in ablation casting at work, our metallurgists are looking at it and the fact that they have such exact temperature controls in the "quench" cycle means that they have really TINY grain formation on the surface of the casting which is very much different from sandcasting or investment casting (without HIP processing after the casting) (Message edited by slaughter on February 03, 2008) | ||
| Slaughter |
Oh and my company IS in the "flying game"     (Message edited by slaughter on February 03, 2008) | ||
| Zac4mac |
Thanks for the tech side, Steve. One of the main reasons I come here. Zack | ||
| Court |
Perhaps you should buy a Goldwing . . . they have GREAT looking frames . . . . . . . . . . . BOTH HALVES! Slaughter . . . ya gotta send me the full res of that SR-71 shot! | ||
| Slaughter |
Court - I'll have to go to our PR folks and see about releasing it. Realize that is a digitized image that was taken originally from medium format film... so I don't know how large a digital image I'm going to be able to get. That one in that resolution is from the home page. No prob (but that'll have to wait til Monday) (Message edited by slaughter on February 03, 2008) | ||
| Court |
There is no hurry . . . . I'm a pilot and I lust over this stuff. I have, I think, every book ever written about the SR-71. Few folks know that the name was SUPPOSED to be the RS-71 and it got transcribed and stuck . . . kind their version of Parkway Blue.  No hurry and thanks in advance! | ||
| Thespive |
"The Sled Driver" The only book I have considered paying $500 for - and I am still saving. I am an A-12 and SR-71 fanatic, probably the most beautiful plane ever made. 'Nuff said. BTW, why is there a 5th guy? Oh I know, he goes in the drone, right? Wait, those were not manned, hmm,maybe someone has to pull a short straw. --Sean | ||
| Thespive |
For Court... brrrrr,,, http://www.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/0701 16-F-2907C-176.jpg --Sean | ||
| M2nc |
I am not going to say the frame will fail, this is purely a cosmetic defect. A preventable defect as well even if the manufacturing processes is new. Since the dimples are only around these welds, I stand on my interpretation of the cause. I have seen it too many time. Even though my company does not build cool airplanes, we do use aluminum castings on our product. I prefer an American made frame, but not at the cost of quality. Neither the M2 nor Uly have such a poor looking exterior surfaces so why would I not expect at least the same quality out of the latest and greatest revision of Buell. I am sure what you say about the new process is true, but it is also more cost effective since the XB frame does not lack in strength. The 10# savings comes from the motor being used to connect the frame and the swing arm together, rather than the frame. You can do that with a motor that has counter-balance shafts. Look at an XB and a 1125R frame side by side and you see the tail section of the 1125R is missing in comparison. I have no doubt that in the future this will be a non-issue since the problem is not universal. That means the supplier has produced good product that meets Buell specifications. This is not a slam on the 1125R, I still dig it, but more a criticism hoping for improvement. If you do not identify your problems how are you going to improve your product. | ||
| Zac4mac |
"BTW, why is there a 5th guy? Oh I know, he goes in the drone, right?" Sean, I don't know a thing about Blackbirds except they are gorgeous machines. Looks to me there's a SIXTH person. An unaccounted shadow is sticking out the right side of the front plane, ahead of the rear landing gear shadow and a bit of yellow-orange is in the cockpit window. You guys worry about my frame if you want, I'm gonna ride it. Z |
