| Author | Message | ||
     Buckeye86 |
Like everybody else, I'm upset at the fact that Buell (for the time at least) is done. Court's posts have made me feel optimist, and while I've never met the man, Erik doesn't strike me as somebody who gives up easily, as many have already pointed out. I am hopeful that he will find a way to get back on his feet and start building new bikes again. One question keeps bothering me though... The innovations which Erik developed-underslung mufflers, ZTL, fuel in frame, etc.- HD still owns those patents correct? And if so is there anything that Erik can do about it? Or are the patents going to be sold off to one of the Big 4? Or worse yet, rot on a shelf @ HD since I don't see it being very likely that HD will use any of them. Along a similar note, what of the Thunderstorm V's, or the Helicon for that matter? Can Erik touch those? or are they all HD property? | ||
| Froggy |
And that is the (multi) million dollar question. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Erik had fuel-in-frame in what...'87? I'm sure he's got stuff bouncing around up there that blows XB/Loki tech out of the water. Personally...I can't wait  | ||
| Froggy |
Yep, like blinker fluid in headlights, oil in motor, and hamster on a wheel for an on demand boost when you just need that little extra umph | ||
| Indy_bueller |
Patents don't last forever. | ||
| Gregtonn |
"Guaranteed Term of Protection Under the American Inventors Projection Act of 1999, the term of patents may be extended to compensate for PTO processing delays. Diligent applicants are guaranteed a minimum 17-year term." http://www.ehow.com/facts_5009751_what-duration-pa tent.html G | ||
| Jon |
Two thoughts: 1. Erik still has Erik Buell Designs or something like that. 2. I think he is better off post Harley to start on his own than before. | ||
| Hughlysses |
3. Erik originally started the company from scratch and made it successful when most people had never heard of him. He has a loyal customer base now. 4. The internet was in its infancy (or didn't exist at all) 26 years ago. The internet will make a HUGE difference in any new Erik Buell effort. Court's posted at least a couple of responses in the last day implying the patents aren't necessarily going to be locked away in a vault forever. There's got to be a lot more to this story and I'm sure we've only seen the tip of the iceburg. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Oh yea, something else struck me this morning. IMHO the reason HD won't sell Buell outright and intact is because of the XB. Any new "Buell" company would have to assume support for the existing XB's and THAT would entail being closely tied into the Harley corporate machine (due to the engines being built by Harley) and they won't allow that. Maybe HD keeps all the XB-engine related patents (for use on future Sportsters) and lets a buyer have the remainder. | ||
| Court |
>>>1. Erik still has Erik Buell Designs or something like that. EFB Designs | ||
| Bob_thompson |
Court, do you think Erik has, in HIS possession enough of his designs and/or patents, if he was to go his own way again, to produce something similar to our 1125's or maybe better? Being who he is I'll bet he's at the drawing board already in his time away from HD dreaming up "the next generation" of Buell motorcycle. Or am I completely wrong? Bob | ||
| Davegess |
Guys Erik has not had the time to put more than a small percentage of his ideas down on paper. He does not need the ideas he had a decade ago, the ideas he has tomorrow will be better. Remember the radical new 1125R is based on a 20 year old design of his. | ||
| Court |
. . . and how about THIS from over 20 years ago . . . . The surface has not been scratched. | ||
| Vtwinbuell |
Nice Court. That patent appears to cover it, and aged just right. Since HD no longer produces sport bikes, hopefully there is not a non-compete to create an issue. | ||
| Randomchaos |
http://www.google.com/patents?id=kckbAAAAEBAJ&prin tsec=abstract&zoom=4#v=onepage&q=&f=false Sweet jesus thats cool. | ||
| Two_buells |
My Cannondale Mt bike has a front end like that its called a lefty....  | ||
| Mark61 |
Oh man---I fix/replace busted steel shafts/axles up to 3" diameter regularly. Those single sided forks& axles look scary as hell to me! mark61 | ||
| Jasonk |
...Yamaha GTS...??? | ||
| Two_buells |
>>>>>>>Those single sided forks& axles look scary as hell to me! If the single side axle can hold up on a F16 Falcon landing, I think my Mt Bike will be fine. | ||
| Court |
>>>>If the single side axle can hold up on a F16 Falcon landing, I think my Mt Bike will be fine. Hahahahah . . . that is THE line of the month! The minute I read that I was thinking about a carrier landing on that single sided axle . . . . . . My worries are gone! | ||
| Two_buells |
>>>>that is THE line of the month! thats the line Cannondale uses... almost 10 years of mt bike racing with that front end, must work | ||
| Slypiranna |
...and if it ain't broke, don't fix it! LOL! Back to topic/// If I were HD, I'd gladly hand over the rights to EVERYTHING relevant to BUELL if I could get outta the 7+ year warranty/parts commitment=requirement by US fed law. Seems like a card that might be played out before all is said and done...we'll see. Imagine dealing with all of US with warranty, parts and service issues if YOU are HD...knowing full and well...US! LOL!  Hmmmmmm | ||
| Midknyte |
I was thinking along these lines too. What if Erik founded a new business soley on supporting the current fleet and then moving on to introduce new models... | ||
| Doylejj |
Perhaps a note about patents would be helpful here. It's not all or nothing with patents--Hd can make money licensing some or all the patent rights to as many companies as will pay royalties. In fact, refusal to license can (I believe) provide ammo for an antitrust action in certain circumstances. | ||
| Two_buells |
Legal schmegal! Having the rights to build the bikes means nothing if they do not sell. Was Buell in the Black or has it been in the red like HD says? Only HD knows. In 2008 Buells Gross was 134m and they built 13,000 + bikes. How many were sold? There were a lot of unsold bikes still in the dealer showrooms. I love my Buells, every one of them. I’ve bought many over the last 131/2 years. Bottom line: can Buell sell enough bikes to be profitable? If Erik builds a world-beater and wins everything in sight will the company be profitable? Is that the bike that will make the company or does Buell need a more diverse product line? Ie: A line of street bikes that will beat the big four in every class? Sport touring bikes/Adventure bikes, Dirt bikes, ATV’s? That will take lots of money and a bigger factory…build a big dealer network from established big four dealers…. | ||
| Bumblebee |
}Yep, like blinker fluid in headlights, oil in motor, and hamster on a wheel for an on demand boost when you just need that little extra umph : ) We don't need to worry about THAT technology, that's tried, and failed HD tech  | ||
| Bumblebee |
In the motor vehicle business the company needs to sew seeds first (do R&D) and introduce a new model - the subsequent production and sales is what finances the R&D, and from what I can see Buell spent a BUNCH of R&D $$$ just recently, so the time that a motorcycle becomes profitable is moved off somewhere into the future-reaping the rewards of seeds sewn. In reality what needs to occur is that an investor (or group of them) needs to purchase the intellectual property, name and right to produce the bikes again. I am pretty certain as I type this there are some negotiations going on in Milwaukee to rescue the brand. Bring a mountain of ca$h to the table and see of HD doesn't go for it. By just discontinuing the brand HD is receiving nothing, other than a declining parts market, but bring 50 or 100 million to the table good things might begin to happen. | ||
| Eulysses |
I think they did not sell because they were yoked with an ENTIRELY different market...I accidently discovered them. They should be in independent dealer shops. I would suspect 5 times the sales. | ||
| 46champ |
Two buells don't need another bigger factory, need more bikes just add more shifts. | ||
| Two_buells |
>>>>Two buells don't need another bigger factory, need more bikes just add more shifts. yup, but if you get into more models, dirt bikes, atv's, etc you need more room. but I'm not a bean counter, just a passionate owner/dreamer |
