| Author | Message | ||
     Hughlysses |
Not a good day- on my ride home from work Uly just died at 75 MPH on interstate with no warning. Waiting on pickup now. Bike stuttered once, I looked down and noticed LED voltmeter flash red, then back to green for an instant, then off. Bike not running- I managed to coast across 3 lanes and off on shoulder without getting hit. Cycled kill switch, giggled key, checked battery connections and fuses, reseated relays- nothing. Noticed if I turn ignition on, giggle it, then turn it off, tach and speedo will cycle 2 seconds later (?!). I'll have to troubleshoot tomorrow, but I'm listening if anyone has any suggestions. Bile os 2007 with 2009 engine and electrics, so it's a 2009 for practical purposes. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Ugh. Sorry Hugh. No blown fuses huh? Maybe a ground didn't get reconnected? I missed the one on the rear head to the frame when I replaced my rear head. | ||
| General_ulysses |
1. Does the dash display light up and cycle the indicators the way it should when you turn the key on? Sounds like you're saying the tach and speedo only cycle after the key is off but not on?? 2. When the key is turned on does the fuel pump run initially like it should normally? 3. Will the starter engage and turn the motor over normally if you hit the start button? If so, does the motor show any signs of life when it's turning over? 4. Are the battery terminals tight? Any indication of what the battery voltage is? 5. Has any maintenance been done recently? Has electrical type work ever been done on the bike? If so what, when and how? | ||
| Hughlysses |
Battery terminals tight, no recent maintenance done, no power or lights of any kind. No juice to starter. No change when handlebars turned from lock-to-lock. After I got it home, I kept playing with the key and eventually I got the dash lights to come on, and the gauges to sweep, but as soon as I hit the starter, everything died. I'm thinking it's got to be the ignition switch. I actually had an occasional problem with it a couple of years ago- I shot some contact cleaner in it and cycled a few times then and it cleared up. I'll troubleshoot more tomorrow. | ||
| Buellerxt |
I empathize, Hugh, but that's no help, I know. Glad you got off the road safely. Those sudden, no warning, shut-offs can be deadly if they occur in congested traffic, especially high speed traffic. You are one of the best Uly guys so either you, or another Buell guru, will nail it. The Quick Board would get wider coverage. Posting my Uly issue there sure helped me. Did you check the fuses with a multimeter or just eyes?  The best to ya'. (Message edited by buellerxt on May 29, 2013) (Message edited by buellerxt on May 29, 2013) | ||
| Etennuly |
I think you are in the right place with the key switch. Wolfridgerider had to replace his once for the same kind of issue. And.....like a toilet flush handle, if you gotta jiggle it to make it perform, something is wrong with it! | ||
| Froggy |
I am going to blame your ignition switch too | ||
| Buellerxt |
I had to have an ignition switch replaced on a Sportster once, at about 40,000 miles I believe. It didn't fail on the road though. It had the toilet handle 'will, won't' warning. | ||
| Swampy |
Check those engine grounds, especially the one under the air box that goes between the frame and engine, that one will make some funny conditions appear. | ||
| Ishai |
Or battery could have gone bad... do you have another battery to check the bike with? you said you saw your voltage LED blink red for a moment... could it be a short inside the battery? | ||
| Uly_man |
"I kept playing with the key and eventually I got the dash lights to come on, and the gauges to sweep, but as soon as I hit the starter, everything died". This is, more or less, what happened to my 06 bike. It was traced to paint on the face of the battery/loom Earth point on the rear sub-frame. I would check that first if you have not done it yet as its easy to do. Then, as said, the other main Earths and the ignition switch. Its deffo a circuit path resistance problem either in the switch, they are Italian made so not the best quality electrics, or an Earth path fault. | ||
| Hughlysses |
I'll check the earths/grounds, but I'm pretty confident they're all good as I re-worked them during my engine replacement (sand paint off frame, re-install bolt with anti-seize compound and a star-type lockwasher). I wonder if it's possible to disassemble the ignition switch? Most switches aren't intended for disassembly, but usually you can bend a couple of tabs back and carefully take it apart which might allow me to polish the contacts or at least see what's causing the problem. I'll post up if I figure out a way to do it. | ||
| Teeps |
Hughlysses Posted on Thursday, May 30, 2013 - Most switches aren't intended for disassembly, but usually you can bend a couple of tabs back and carefully take it apart which might allow me to polish the contacts or at least see what's causing the problem. Or, you could jump the wires that the switch would normally connect to do the same without taking the switch apart... | ||
| Hughlysses |
Did my first troubleshooting check; put a voltmeter across the battery- it was showing approximately 13V with no load. Turned the ignition key on- voltage dropped to ~3V immediately. That sure sounds like a bad battery. Ishai- I think you get the troubleshooting prize for today.  I think the battery is only about a year old; it's an Energizer purchased at Sam's Club. Hopefully I've got warranty on it. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Well, crap- according to Sam's website, warranty is only 6 months, so I'm sure that's no good. Bad thing is I replaced the good original battery with this one just because it was starting to crank a little slowly. I think I'll go back with an HD battery this time; the first one lasted ~5 years. | ||
| Etennuly |
That is unusual for a battery to just instantly die like that. But it does happen. I would be looking at the stator and VR leads for a dead short before hooking up the new one. I have fixed two XBs that had a wire bared on a sharp corner between the muffler and the bottom of the engine. In both cases neither bike would run at all. Here's to hoping that is all that it takes!  | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Might try the Shorai. Working good for me. Normally about 13.30 volts. | ||
| Uly_man |
Is it this one. If it is is a years warranty. http://www.powerstridebattery.com/motorcycle-batte ries/energizer-motorcycle-batteries/energizer-0207 7580-battery-motorcycle-batteries-deka-motorcycle- batteries | ||
| Hughlysses |
^ My battery appears to be the same but the labeling's different. Sam's website says "6 months free replacement" so I suspect they'd only give me a slight discount on a new battery if anything, and it may be over a year old since I don't remember exactly when I replaced it. Since the battery failed so early I really don't want another one. Vern- I checked the wiring and actually found a very slight rub-through on one of the stator wires, but apparently that was not the problem. I taped over the rub-through and secured the wire to the frame brace with a zip tie to prevent further wear. I just did a poor man's static load test on the battery with a 12V light bulb. The no-load voltage on the battery is now down to about 12V and it drops to zero with just the one 12V light bulb (a tail light bulb for a 940 Volvo) across it. I'd say the battery is definitely toast. | ||
| Uly_man |
Yep its toast. That test shows that the battery has formed an internal high resistance in one of its cells. Are you sure that it is a AGM type battery? | ||
| Ishai |
Hugh- Thanks for the prize, glad I was able to help..if the battery is made by Yuasa they had a batch of batteries that had the same problem. | ||
| Buellerxt |
I'll second the HD battery, Hugh. Why sacrifice reliability for pennies in savings? Glad you found the culprit and it is an easy fix. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Yep, I went with the HD battery; problem solved. The guy at the counter that sold me the battery said "Yea, they cost twice as much but they last three times as long. I ride Ducatis and I've modified both my bikes to accept HD batteries." That failure happened at bad time with NO warning at all. Of course, it could have happened ~300 miles away from home on a twisty road in the mountains of north GA or NC and that would have been even worse. | ||
| Zac4mac |
I worked H-D Parts for 3 - 1/2 years and Harley's batteries are among the best out there. I sold a lot of batteries and always asked "how old" and "do you use a tender?" H-D sells 3 different capacity batteries in 12V AGM format - 12, 18 and 24 AH. The 12 AH last 3-5 years. The 18 AH last 5-7. The 24 AH bagger batteries last 9-11 years... I sold one to a guy that said his was the original on a '97 FLH. in 2010. Those regularly using tenders were on the high to high outlier end. Hugh - glad you found the problem, too bad it was a costly fix. Zack | ||
| Hughlysses |
I'm very glad it turned out to be the battery and not something on the bike- that gives me a little piece of mind the problem is "permanently" fixed. I'm strongly suspicious the bike died when the fan tried to kick on. Temperature was in the low 80's yesterday, but traffic had been backed up badly on the interstate so I'd been in stop-and-go for ~10 miles about 2 miles for the breakdown. I'd been running ~75 MPH for just a couple of minutes before the bike died, so I'm guessing conditions were just right for the fan to kick on which provided a big enough draw to cause a failing battery to internally short. | ||
| Cyclonedon |
I purchased a new battery for my SUV once and it didn't even last a month. I went back to the GMC dealer and put the stock battery back in and everything was back to normal again. | ||
| Reepicheep |
That's funny right there, on Wed I did exactly the same thing. The HD battery I bought exactly a year ago because the old HD battery was turning over slowly was really never good, and hit 3v trying to turn the uly over. I switched back to the old HD battery and it spins right up happily now. The old HD batteries did used to be very good batteries, but the one I bought a year ago was junk (1 year warranty from HD, I should have returned it when I got it, it never did turn the bike over well). | ||
| Uly_man |
I have the HD OEM battery from my 06 bike and its still fine. As I have said before I once tried to jump my 3000 cc BMW car with it. Ok so it only turned the engine over for about 4 times but then again it had not been charged for six months either. The HD battery is 200 CCR and my car is 800 CCR. I am amazed it worked at all. | ||
| Etennuly |
The battery that came in my '06 was never up to standard from the beginning. The SM says the bike needs 12.6V from the battery before even testing the electronic stuff on it. My HD battery NEVER, even after charging, held at more than 12.3V. Oddly though, it never was at less than 12.2 when tested. At two years old it was spiking to 8.5V on starting, normal was a drop to 9.6V. No longer quite enough to keep the ODO memory going, and just enough to start that V twin once. I pointed this out to HD, but they would not warranty it from new. I went to a battery from Walmart and it was no good within a month. I took that back and switched to the AGM batteries sold at O'Reilly's. So far I have run each of them about two and a half years in the Uly. Every part of the bike that had to do with electrical power was working better than when it was new. Now, a couple of years out, when the Uly starts cranking hard, I put that battery in the Blast and a new one in the Uly. Even starting out at over two years old, the AGM battery can sit for a whole year not having been on a charger, and still crank the Blast right over. | ||
| Teeps |
Hughlysses Posted on Thursday, May 30, 2013 Yep, I went with the HD battery; problem solved. The guy at the counter that sold me the battery said "Yea, they cost twice as much but they last three times as long. I ride Ducatis and I've modified both my bikes to accept HD batteries." That's funny, as I modified my Uly to take a "Honda" battery (actually Yuasa.) Etennuly Posted on Friday, May 31, 2013 The battery that came in my '06 was never up to standard from the beginning. This was the case with my '06 Uly's battery as well. I bought the bike used in May/06 (850 miles); but it had sat for 6 or 7 months. The original battery crapped out that summer. I bought a Yuasa battery from work for $45; it's still in the bike... today. The take away here is, it's not who markets or sells a battery it's who makes the battery. H/D batteries, are probably made by Johnson Controls. JC makes good batteries. So did Delco. | ||
| Tootal |
Hugh, glad to see you found the problem and it wasn't serious! You've had enough of those type of problems!! As far as battery's are concerned, I believe part of the problem is the stock VR is not designed for the newer style battery's. They seem to need a little more juice to be "fully" charged. I've read a few post about how some folks feel their bike spins faster now that they have an aftermarket VR on their bikes. I've also read that some old style battery chargers aren't quite up to par for charging newer style battery's. Just things I've read. I do know that on both my Uly and Geezerglide, if I put the smart charger on the battery's the bike will turn over faster the first time I start it. Seems the VR on both bikes won't get it to the same level. | ||
| Reepicheep |
My old (one year old and useless) battery sits on my bench now... I'll put it on the computerized smart charger and see if it "comes back". | ||
| Hughlysses |
Somewhat unrelated follow-up- I'd had a set of new NGK iridium plugs sitting on the shelf for at least a year. I figured this morning was a good time to install those. While I was in the airbox, I checked the muffler valve actuator and found that it wasn't moving at all. I had seen a check engine light a couple of times over the last month but since it always cleared up I hadn't worried about it. Very fortunately, I had a brand-new actuator also sitting on the shelf (the latest type with metal gears) so that was an easy fix. Plugs changed, muffler valve working again, I'm interested to see how much better it runs. | ||
| Motorbike |
When the actuator failed on my 08XT, the only thing I noticed was that the CEL was on. The bike ran just fine. I think the only way anyone would notice is if they are used to running real hard and opening the throttle all the way quite often. That's the only time the valve opens anyway. |
