| Author | Message | ||
     Tempest766 |
Hi ya'll. When I put the 2008 XT away for the winter everything was working fine. I did try to start it on an unseasonably warm day in January, but it tried to turn over, then seized and the starter would only then click and dim the lights. I figured the battery was weak (I remove it and store indoors during the winter). So I replaced the 160cca battery with a Yuasa yxt14hbs 200cca battery and just attempted to start the bike again. No joy. The starter just clicks and the lights dim. I also tried to push turn the engine on a downhill grade but couldn't get it to turn, too much compression? So I'm left with an engine that appears to be seized up and a new battery that wont turn it even with the higher power delivery. Any thoughts on diagnosing the issue? | ||
| Teeps |
Pull the plugs, apply a squirt of marvel mystery oil, or other rust penetrant, in each cylinder, then try turning the engine. Either by the starter or bumping in gear. | ||
| Tootal |
+1. Pull the plugs, a squirt of oil, and see if it turns over. If it does then install plugs and try again. If it still won't turn over then the solenoid needs help. | ||
| General_ulysses |
I'm doubting the engine is truly seized (unless it was run without oil or experienced a flood event in the NE). Sounds like a bad ground, chafed wire, mice gnawing on electrics, starter gone bad etc. See if you can bypass the wiring to the starter and directly apply +12v and a good ground to it. Also pull the plugs and make sure no liquid has somehow been trapped inside (ie hydro lock). A leaky injector could theoretically dribble gas down into a cylinder over time (I suppose, new to Buells FI system). Had an oil injector on an old kawi H1 2 stroke leak and fill the whole crankcase with oil. When I went to start it after 35 years of setting, it pumped the oil into the cylinder and created a hydrolock, bending the connecting rod and shattering the piston. | ||
| Hughlysses |
I agree there's almost no way that engine seized over the winter. If you're trying to push it to make the engine turn over, don't do it in first gear, try 2nd or 3rd. Higher gear = more "leverage" when you're turning the engine, just the reverse of when the engine is moving the bike. Is the new battery fully charged? That'd be worth checking. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Put the bike in a high gear and try to run and bump start it. Or put in the air, 5th gear, turn the rear wheel like you would when checking the primary chain. If the engine is seized, which I doubt, you'll find out that way. | ||
| Tempest766 |
You are of course, right...I doubt it's seized too, but it made the post sound so much more dramatic and caught your attention. The new battery is fully charged and I'm thinking that the solenoid is stuck or the starter is bad. I did try to push/turn the engine (but yeah...I was a ••••••• and did it in low gear) I'll try again if I can get it cycled up into a higher gear. I'm so hoping that I can shake the thing loose without removing the starter. the jigsaw puzzle assembly on modern bikes stresses me something fierce. | ||
| Motorbike |
I tried to bump start my 08 XT last summer when the start switch on the handlebar failed due to corrosion on the connection of the wire to the switch. I rolled the bike down a slight incline and popped the clutch in third gear and the bike jerked a couple times and stopped, almost slid the tire. I pushed it back up the hill and tried the same thing in fourth gear. That worked and I rode the 45 miles home. Do like the guys said. Jack the rear wheel up and try rolling the rear wheel while the bike is in fifth gear. Try to roll it backwards too. I'm thinking your starter failed somehow. | ||
| Tempest766 |
I too am thinking the starter failed. I was able to push/turn the engine in third gear with the help of a teenage nephew. All we succeeded in doing was further depleting the battery. When fresh, the starter solenoid clicks loudly but the starter motor isn't turning. Electrical contacts all look good and the battery is fresh. Is removing the starter as involved as the manual portrays? Any special considerations or special tools needed? I'm not too keen on bypassing the electrical system and applying current to the motor directly, as was suggested. | ||
| Buellhusker |
did you check the Starter relay? | ||
| Zac4mac |
If you provide power and ground to the starter motor, it will spin if it's good, do nothing if it's bad. It needs the solenoid to engage and make the motor turn. | ||
| Etennuly |
I would bet on bad connections. If you can grab your battery terminal connections and force them to turn with your fingers, they are not tight enough. On some of these batteries a lot of us had to put washers on the cable ends because the bolt would tighten up just as it would bottom out. This would leave the cables appearing tight and feeling tight, but they are just not tight enough. Grip them and force them hard with your fingers, if you make them move this could be your problem. | ||
| Ourdee |
Battery may be bad. | ||
| Hughlysses |
I agree it's very unlikely your starter motor is the problem. Never heard of a starter motor failing from sitting up a few months. Troubleshoot all the other stuff before you pull the starter. | ||
| Motorbike |
The fact is, he said that when he hits the button, the lights dim. This tells us that current is more than likely activating the solenoid and the starter is trying to spin the engine. Now, as some stated, this could be a bad or weak battery or bad connections. If that is the case, than there is not enough juice to go any farther than just engaging the starter. Or something is jammed so the starter cannot turn the engine? If it did not dim the lights when the button is pushed, then the relay or start switch could be bad. This problem sounds like all is good up to the starter to me. | ||
| Tootal |
Lights should go out during starting procedure unless you have done the "both lights on" wiring switch on the connector. | ||
| Motorbike |
Tootal, I stand corrected. Been so long since I've ridden that I forgot about that, thanks to this lovely weather. Thanks for setting me straight. I have the "both lights on" mod on my 08 XT but did it at the handlebar switch. What are you thinking is wrong with his starter, maybe a bad solenoid? I had a bad connection problem at my start switch last summer and if I remember correctly, it did not do anything at all when the button was pushed. I suspected the start relay but I swapped with another relay in the box and it made no difference. Thanks. | ||
| Britchri10 |
FWIW: Rode to work yesterday. Parked for c10 hours. came out. Turned bike on, followed starting procedure., got one brief "chug" from the starter & then.... Nada! Lights came on, ECM "primed" but no starter turnover just click, click, click. Jump started the bike from a non-running truck. started 1st time. Rode home, checked battery connections & charge. Result: Bad battery (HD OEM, 3 years old). Bought new battery today. ( HD OEM $125.00.) Bike started 1st time. Conclusion: I think it's your battery or your terminal connections, or your grounds. YMMV Chris | ||
| Tempest766 |
Shortly after I bought the bike (bought used, two years ago) the starter would seem weak. Sometimes multiple switch pushes to get it to turn over. Sometimes (when engine was hot and I restarted the bike) it would grind like the solenoid wasn't disconnecting after it started. Dealership mechanics said I needed a new battery but they never addressed the grinding so I learned to just lightly touch the starter switch and back off quickly to avoid the grinding (same as happens in a car starter when you hold the key in the start position after the engine is running). Well, I have a new battery now. went from 160amp to 200amp battery and during all the testing and trying to get it to turn over I've dropped the battery from about 13v nominal to 12.7v nominal. I can't do anything more until I get a working battery charger now. It just gets more and more fun... | ||
| Uly_man |
Is this a AGM battery. 200 CCA is the std size and 12.7v is a full charge but not if its a AGM as not the same. | ||
| Tootal |
Motorbike, I switched mine to the handlebar too after I was told that the light doesn't go out since the other wire is on a different fuse. I figured that starter needed all the power it could get! I still want to hear what happens with the plugs pulled out. I realize the engine is not seized but let's see if it will turn the engine over with no compression. If it just clicks then it's not the battery and is the solenoid. I have a push button end cap on my Harley starter. Sometimes it works and sometimes it just clicks. Push the button and you bypass the electro magnet and push it on yourself! Sounds like your problem. | ||
| Uly_man |
All the "two light" mod should do is keep the low beam light on with the high beam. It still cuts the light on starting via the relay. "I have a push button end cap on my Harley starter". I am not sure WHY this would be as a Buell has little to do with a Hardly Dodiee-son bike. | ||
| Froggy |
There are a few ways do to the mod, the most popular way is to change the pins on the headlamp connector to feed the low beam off the parking bulb. The parking light is not on the same fuse as the low/highbeams, so it does not get cut by the starter relay.
Nearly every air cooled Buell and Sportster since the mid 80s has used the same starter motor. The button mod is easily doable on the tubers, I've never seen it on a XB. | ||
| Uly_man |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jodLajEQQyI | ||
| Tootal |
You guys missed my point. I'm just saying my temporary cure was to put the manual button on the Harley, not that you could do that to the Buell. I'm just saying his Buell sounds like it has the same problem as my big twin. And by the way Uly-Man, it's a Hardly Dangerous!! Good tunes, bell bottoms and all!  (Message edited by tootal on April 11, 2013) | ||
| 7873jake |
Ahhhh, zipper boots. |
