| Author | Message | ||
     Barocky |
Had a rear wheel hub warp. Had good bearings in. What would cause it to warp. Axle too tight? | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
I've head of the spacer between the bearings being damaged by too much torque on the axle but that's it. In what way is it warped? | ||
| Motorbike |
I've never heard of a hub warping. I have heard of brake rotors warping though. Is that what you are referring too? Do you have any pics? | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
I've got a 12X rear wheel in great condition if you want to offer me something + shipping for it. Includes the axle. Bearings never failed but could use new ones. I got the 2010 wheel on mine now. | ||
| Barocky |
The hub warped open so the whole bearings spin in them. | ||
| Ratbuell |
warped open? Or too many bearing changes? | ||
| Blake |
warped: twisted or distorted in form or shape Too much torque on the axle? Maybe the bearing seats are just worn, maybe out of spec machining in hub or outer race of bearings, or maybe failing (really hot thus enlarged) bearing led to the problem? | ||
| Mikef5000 |
Ah, that changes everything. The hub's not warped at all, it's simply wallowed out beyond the necessary spec. Too many bearing changes like Ratbuell stated would do it. Or even just one bearing change can do it, if it's done poorly and the bearings go in at an angle. If the bearings seized or failed they could cause this as well. If you bought the bike used, perhaps the previous owner had a bearing fail, and didn't fix it correctly?! If the bearings fit snug but just not tight, you can install them with loctite between the hub and outer race to lock them in. Some have had success with this. Otherwise, a new rear wheel is your only good option. You can buy a 2010 rear wheel kit, which has 3 much larger bearings. American Sport Bike should have the kit, or a sponsoring dealer. Or you can save some money and just get a previous year wheel from here, but just keep in mind, the bearings weren't the greatest. Mine failed at 25k miles, some others failed earlier, some never failed. If you're planning on big trips or lots of touring, I'd spring for the 2010 wheel kit. If it's more of a commuter/weekend bike, you should be fine with an older wheel. | ||
| Uly_man |
A new XB12X 2010 wheel is $362 with new bearings, seals, spacer, axle and pulley bolts from American Sport Bike. You will need to fit the bearings yourself but do it right. Now I have never been convinced over the wheel bearing issues with these bikes. I have always thought that it is caused by over crushing of the alloy spacer. Even with the 2010 wheel you can still get damaged bearings and the front on the 2010 bikes are still the same and can fail early as mine did at 1700 miles (2010 bike) and 6000 miles on the 06 bike. You will need a new or used wheel. Its a near impossible thing to fix a worn alloy hub and I have tried many times before. You might get away with it but how safe or reliable it is going to be is another matter. If you bearings break up at 100mph on a bike its not going to make for a great day out. Since you do need a new wheel $362 for the 2010 set up seems like a VERY good price and what I would do if I lived in the USA. Here in the UK thats what you would pay, with all the bits for a used pre 2010 wheel, not all that easy to find either and the 2010 wheel set up is silly money. If you can Dude just get one as it will also add value to your bike. | ||
| Barocky |
Thanks for the info. I did have bearings fail but thought I caught them before any damage. Had them replaced by a dealership in NM so figured they were done right. Maybe it was me putting wheel back on too tight. It's getting a new wheel now. | ||
| Hughlysses |
If you order the 2010 wheel kit from American Sport Bike, Al will install the bearings for a nominal fee. If he does it, you'll know they were installed properly. Then all you have to do is torque the axle correctly when you install the wheel. | ||
| Rays |
I had this exact issue with my '06 and that was after a single set of bearings were replaced. I did the same as you and took it to the dealer to remove the old bearings expecting them to have the right tools/expertise to do this job better than myself. When I got the bare wheel back I was dismayed to see a chunck taken out of the spacer where it was obvious they had used the 'brute force and ignorance' approach and had drifted the first bearing out through the centre of the spacer. This would have obviously 'walked' the bearing out and must have removed enough hub material to shorten the life of that somewhat. About another 20,000 miles later I discovered the drive side bearing loose enough to just drop out of the hub. I have purchased a 2010 3-bearing rear wheel have only just got around to preparing it for fitment because I did a 'temporary repair' with Loctite and have had that repair survive for another 15,000 miles. Here is a link to an old post where I have a picture of what my hub looked like and a description of the Green Loctite fix (originally suggested by Hughlysses). If your hub isn't completely stuffed you might be able to keep it running with this temporary repair until you can organise another wheel? http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/578976.html?1278615631 | ||
| 7873jake |
If you're contemplating doing your own bearing replacement/install... I recently changed out all of my original OEM bearings (orange seals) and found that AutoZone will 'loan' you, for free, a blind hole (bearing) puller. Pay $170 for it when you pick it up, they will give you $170 for it when you return it...my wife thought I was abusing their return policy until I 'splained it to her twice that it was a loaner tool. http://www.autozone.com/autozone/accessories/OEM-B lind-Hole-Puller-Set/_/N-2647?counter=0&itemIdenti fier=391362_0_0_ Anyway, each bearing took about 2-3 swacks (soft, gentle whacks) to come loose with the slide hammer. Straight out, no sign of damage or deformation to the hubs, wheels, seats. I put the new bearings in the freezer several days prior to embarking on this task to get their figs, I mean races good and shriveled. Using a process I found here on BWB, I cleaned up the seats with a little PB Blaster and blue scotchbrite (the wimpiest variety), heated it with my heat gun and then set the frozen bearing in to the seats. I literally seated them with my fingers and they made a very satisfying sound as they settled in to place. No whacks, no swacks, nothing more than finger pressure. I let both surfaces adjust to the ambient temp, coated my axle in nevrseize and reassembled the bike. 1,300 miles later, no probs. I don't know why I dreaded it so much before now. It was shockingly easy and bloody-knuckle free. | ||
| Arry |
I'm just curious. were your OEM bearings bad or just changed for peace of mind. My,new to me, 2007 still has orange seals, so the info on tools & procedure are apreciated. (what is PB Blaster) | ||
| Ratbuell |
PB blaster is like WD40; a penetrant. The orange seal bearings were less stout when it came to water repellency, than the later black seal bearings. Many folks (myself included) replaced them with black seal bearings as preventative maintenance. | ||
| 7873jake |
Arry, yes and yes. I had a sound in the rear that was a combination of an uneven wear pattern in the brake pads (chatter) and an orange seal bearing on the rotor side that began to click and the sound seemed magnified thru the rotor itself. Replacing the bearings fixed most of the rear noise but the brake pad replacement made the rear silent once again. I was surprised that there was moisture in the rear hub. It wasn't a measurable quantity, more like condensation droplets. I don't recall the last time I rode in the heavy wet stuff (...a year or more ago?) and its been over a year ago I last washed it. I am really resisting the urge to drill a drain hole on the rotor side of the hub just to allow any future h2o to drain when the bike is on the side stand. | ||
| Arry |
Thanks for all the info. Mine have real low miles and I don't hear anything when rotating, so I'll probably just monitor them closely for a while. | ||
| 7873jake |
I'm at ~12,400 miles and I didn't hear a peep when rotating the tire when it was up on the lift. It was very smooth and quiet. It wasn't until I placed a load on the rear tire that the bearing would click when rolling. I must have caught it very early  because even just pushing the bike around to see if I could hear anything was not sufficient to reproduce the sound. I had to park my FA on it and ride around to make the sounds reappear. I know, offering that to a guy with orange seals helps him sleep better at night or depart on a lengthy ride with confidence. Just keep keepin' an eye and ear on them. Order spares in advance of needing them. Ride. | ||
| Motorbike |
7873jake, I would have never thought to loan a bearing tool from AutoZone. What a great idea! I did not need to pull any bearings because I went with the 2010 wheel setup, but if I ever do need to pull a bearing, I will remember your tip! Question, were you able to pull the bearings with that tool and not do any damage to the spacer? I've read somewhere in here that blind pullers will wreck the spacer. The spacer on my 08 wheel was already wrecked because my bearing failed completely and the wheel hub itself cut into the outer surface of the spacer. Thanks. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/653516.html?1317306927 | ||
| 7873jake |
I was (able to pull the bearings w/o damage to the spacer). While I did not reuse the spacer, I probably could have. The ends were not mushroomed or showed any sign of compression contact/damage before bearing removal or after. I tried to take note of the state of the spacer prior to dis-assembly because I had read where others spoke of deformation due to over-compressing the bearings either on install or over-tightening the rear axle. I also noted the amt of free movement of the spacer prior to removal of the old bearings and was pleased when I could see the same amt after installing the new bearings. It was a very unscientific measurement without feeler gauges...just eyes and touch. The bottom face of the blind puller in the set I used was very VERY thin and fit neatly between the bearing's inner race and spacer. Once I tightened the spreader bolt and spread the 'fingers' of the puller in to the inner race, it was a very snug, secure fit. I attached the slide hammer and gave a few knocks and it popped right out, straight up and straight out, no walking or tweaking or sideways crawling. The first blow broke the grip of the bearing in the seat and the other two, far less intense bumps, just pulled it free. It was surprisingly easy. | ||
| Djohnk |
7873jake, I bet you heated the rim first before you used the blind bearing puller. I tried it without heating the rim and smacked it about 100 time with no movement. I then heated the rim with a hair dryer for about 10 minutes and it came out as you described. | ||
| Uly_man |
Checking the wheel bearings is normal bike maintenance and needs to be done maybe every 5k miles on this bike. I think taking the wheels off an XB is the way to do this unless you are sure of the fitting of your bearings. On the 5k service I had rears on my 06 (fronts at 12k) and fronts on my 2010 Ulys. So what does that say about the factory installation of these bearings? They also did not use a "anti-seize" compound on the hubs or axle which, for some meant you had to near smash the bearings out. Not something you should need to do at all. The inner and outer rings of a bearing should NEVER be pushed out of spec as once you do the bearing will die very soon. Over crushing of the alloy space will do this VERY easy. Its a stone cold engineering fact. The XB series wheel bearing issues have come about for many reasons. None of which I think is due to design. I see no logical reason why it should. Mind you changing them is a right "pain in the ass" without a costly puller and could have been thought out better. I know so because I thought of one using standard tools and bearings. | ||
| Uly_man |
"I am really resisting the urge to drill a drain hole on the rotor side of the hub just to allow any future h2o to drain when the bike is on the side stand." I know some have but I would not myself. Anyway the hole will not always be at the bottom with the bike on the side stand. If you get water in the hub find out why first and fix the reason why. Anything else, like this, is what I call a "Dark Star" fix. And if anyone does not know this film then just watch it and you will know? If you change the bearings replace the spacer. I do not think they cost much and it seems like a false economy not to do it given the work involved. Do it once, do it right. | ||
| 7873jake |
Djohnk, I gave them a little heat. I forgot that "preheating for extraction" step in the description. Nothing like i gave them once I was ready to set the new ones in. For installation, I heated them until I heard the rotor begin to 'plink' as it (or the wheel, not sure) expanded. I knew I was good and warm when the small gap (I'm talking feeler gauge fine) between the outer shoulder of the lip on the seat and the rotor's inner diameter began to disappear. Its not a very noticeable gap and not any thickness measurable by ruler but when the gap disappeared, I knew I was good to seat the bearing. Anything before that required more pressure than I wanted to apply in this experiment to see if I could just drop a new set of bearings in. (My apologies to Barocky. Was not my intention to jack this thing all up.) | ||
| Barocky |
No 7873jake no apologies needed. This is all great information for all of us. Thanks to everyone for their input. |
