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Elsinore74
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 03:29 pm: | 
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Mnrider, +1 on the Uly in Cycle World.
Sept 2005 cover. Yeah, I wanted one from then on. No, mine's not for sale.
If ya have a pile of old Cycle World mags lying around, check out April '06 story posted by Peter Egan; "Ride A Crooked Road," a road trip story on a Uly in Southeastern VA. |
Mnrider
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 04:12 pm: |
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I remember that story.I think he went 2 up on that trip.
I still read Peter Egan. |
Pizat
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 04:33 pm: |
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I just got a phone call from a friend telling me to check out the Buell's for sale on the Kansas City Craigslist. I got on there just a minute ago...Holy Smokes! Usually I'm lucky to find 2 or 3 for sale at a time but there's something like 25 for sale right now. Only one Uly though. |
Electraglider_1997
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 05:14 pm: |
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Pizat,
Here it is
http://www2.jaxed.com/cgi-bin/mash.cgi?cat=cpmoto& itm=buell&loc=MO&fil=&ys=&ye=&ps=&pe=&pgs=50&submi t=++++go++++ |
Liv2
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 06:38 pm: |
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Everything I own is for sale, you just may not like the price that you would have to pay. |
Chad_nc
| | Posted on Sunday, November 08, 2009 - 11:30 pm: |
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My 09 XP is for sale. If I can get what I owe on it  |
Jammin_joules
| | Posted on Friday, November 20, 2009 - 07:21 pm: |
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I cut & paste this for your purusal
http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/oped/economics-bue ll-used-motorcycle-market/
It’s been a few weeks since Harley-Davidson announced the immediate closure of its subsidiary Buell, where dealers began slashing prices both to liquidate stock and to cash-in on Harley’s [rumored sale incentive up to $5,000 on Loki]. Basic economics dictates that any time a price is raised or lowered it has repercussions to the product’s resale value, and in the case of Buell’s sudden price drop and dumping of basically new bikes into the market, the consequences for current Buell owners seem dreary. Or are they?
In order to find an answer to that question, we asked Joshua Minix, former government think-tank Economist, and current John M. Olin Fellow in Law and Economics at Harvard Law School, to wade through the implications of Buell’s closure, and how it affects the used Buell motorcycle market. Click past the jump for his analysis.
Buellnomics 101: Supply & Demand
Before we jump into an analysis, we should first cover the economic basics that surround the used market for Buell motorcycles. The most elementary determinants of pricing are supply and demand. All else equal, increased supply or reduced demand will cause a fall in price and vise versa. Harley-Davidson’s announced closure of Buell Motorcycles has altered this economic balance beyond the fluctuation you would typically see in the used market for motorcycles. Here we discuss four significant ways in which this announcment could affect the supply and demand of Buell motorcycles.
First, the deep price cuts on new existing inventory is best understood as a short-term surge in supply because more units are available at a given price.
Second, many people may now be less interested in buying a Buell at a given price due to reduced advertising, concerns over parts, support and such (reduction in demand).
Third, some people may be more interested in buying a Buell if they already wanted one and now are rushing out to get a new one before they are all gone (increase in demand).
Finally, with production shutdown, the total quantity of new Buells available is decreasing with every unit sold (long-term reduction in supply).
By weighing the relative magnitude of these influences, we can begin to predict how the market will affect different purchasers of Buell motorcycles, in relation to when they bought their bike to Buell’s announced closure. Since the implications will be different for each group, we’ll take them in turn:
Buyers Who Bought After Buell’s Announcement (The Good)
These buyers are in great shape for two reasons. First, the prices were likely well below market value – evidenced by the fact that Buells were more or less selling for nearly double the fire-sale prices just days earlier and by the speed at which the fire-sale Buells were purchased. It is hard to imagine a better deal on a new motorcycle in terms of the physical product that was available for the price.
Second, these Buell owners are also likely not to experience drastic depreciation because once the supply of new, sale-priced Buells dries up, everyone wanting a Buell will have to shop the used market. Provided that demand does not drop off too drastically, long-term used prices of Buells should remain quite good relative to the fire-sale prices.
Buyers of New/Used 2008 Model Year Buells or Later (The Bad)
Riders who have owned their Buells for a year or more may be in a worse financial situation than the fire-sale buyers. The Buell fire-sale will decrease the market value of used Buells, but as this supply is quite limited, the effect will probably not be long-lasting.
Buells over a year old have already suffered the worst of their depreciation before the announcing of Buell’s closure. This may represent a bit of a financial hit for the more recent buyers in this category who must sell now, but overall this group will suffer a relatively moderate decrease in bike value for the near-term.
The longer-term implications depend on the trade-off between the relative magnitudes of the decrease in supply due to stopped production, and the decrease in demand due to anticipated lack of factory support, advertising etc. All of these changes in value are damped by the fact that these buyers have been out riding and enjoying their bikes.
Buyers of 2009 Model Year Buells (The Ugly)
These buyers will be the most financially impacted Buell owners. At an extreme, a rider who purchased an 1125 on the 15th could have seen the value of the new acquisition drop by half overnight. We expect bikes to loose value when we ride them off the lot – but not anywhere near this extreme.
This is particularly bad for owners that are forced to sell quickly as losses will be significant. Owners who will be able to keep and enjoy their bikes are the best off in this group.
If the bike was worth full price to a rider before the closure, the intrinsic value to that rider needn’t have changed significantly after the closure – only concerns about parts and servicing really affect how much one would expect to enjoy a new bike and Harley-Davidson’s promise to provide servicing for 7 years should allay these fears to a great degree. Once the short-term effects of the Buell fire-sale are over used prices could rebound provided that demand isn’t overly squelched by concerns about support, etc.
Most in this group will be best off by not selling their recently purchased Buells. These buyers valued their Buells highly at the time of purchase, and the demise of Buell is not likely going to harm their ability to enjoy the bikes as much as the bikes have depreciated in recent weeks. Also, as noted, depending on how demand is affected, used prices are likely to hold reasonably steady or possibly even increase over time.
In closing, enjoy the bike, have fun and try not to worry too much about market value. If you must sell your recently purchased Buell remember that the purchase price is a sunk cost and move forward.
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Eulysses
| | Posted on Friday, November 20, 2009 - 08:30 pm: |
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That's about right. I do see the Uly's being the least drop and rise. |
Busykat
| | Posted on Sunday, November 22, 2009 - 03:44 pm: |
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All,
I may offer mine for trade or sale. I thought I'd never feel this way about Buells as I was very passionate about them, but here's my rationale. H-D pulled the plug on Buell, a product that they already seemed to treat like a red-headed stepchild, (now a disowned son). They sell off the remaining inventory at dirt-cheap prices. This causes my 2009 Uly bought in Sept to plummet in value. Then I discover that the damn thing won't go over 115 mph, and nobody has any idea why, (it's governed, but how to un-govern it remains a mystery so far.) I am rooting for Erik Buell to make a comeback, which he is; however, he is forgetting about the street going Buells and they're owners. What about support for the non-racers Erik?! Damn! I think I'm tired of the drama of it all and want a company as trustworthy as the bike they sell.
So, I think my loyalty is starting to wane and I may look to another brand when I get a chance. |
Jammin_joules
| | Posted on Sunday, November 22, 2009 - 04:12 pm: |
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Busykat: " ...H-D pulled the plug on Buell, .. They sell off the remaining inventory at dirt-cheap prices. This causes my 2009 Uly bought in Sept to plummet in value. Then I discover that the damn thing won't go over 115 mph, and nobody has any idea why, (it's governed, but how to un-govern it remains a mystery so far.) ... What about support for the non-racers Erik?! Damn! I think I'm tired of the drama of it all and want a company as trustworthy as the bike they sell. "
Buell/H-D did not sell off remaining inventory. They offered incentives to dealers to make a few bucks, many of which had been loyal and burdened by slow moving products, that could now sell them while they are fresh & relevant. The parts sales everyone here seems to think was a liquidation was merely an inventory reduction of accessories, not service parts. It was titled as such in dealer communications. I can't help what posters here called it. Reduction does not mean depletion either.
You have no idea what your 2009 Uly is worth. I am a sales manager and I own a Uly and I have no idea what it is worth until I sell it at a price, then I know. Right now all that are selling is new, discounted bikes, but there are precious few of those remaining and we've seen prices rising on those according to the Laws of Supply & Demand. We ahve not been able to get any more new Ulysses and have non that are used. Yes your 2009 probably took a hit right now, but it should recover some of any perceived loss come spring and a period of inavailability.
Why it won't go over 115mph should be able to be diagnosed by a good service tech. If you aren't dealing with one, find another. I wish you were our customer, we do not believe in ghosts nor Monday/Friday built problems and have not had a problem we could not fix. If you are at all close to Colorado, come to High Country and we'll make it right.
If you tire of the drama, get off BadWEB and get on your 115mph Uly, shut up & ride. A good ride fixes a lot of what ails us.
~jammer
Cycle Therapist
(Message edited by Jammin_Joules on November 23, 2009) |
Jphish
| | Posted on Sunday, November 22, 2009 - 04:47 pm: |
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Governated'? Never heard of that before - but suppose it's possible. Perhaps Jammin's tech could have a chat with Busykat's tech. I wouldn't think it would be that much of a mystery. Have they tried a new ECM? Where else could the 'command' to stop @ 115 be commin from ? My Uly will always have a home unless she spontaneously combust's in the garage...then NONE of us will have a home. |
Alchemy
| | Posted on Sunday, November 22, 2009 - 04:57 pm: |
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BusyKat,
I see you have an XP. I doubt it is governed but it does have bags and a tall windshield. Still should do more but I have no personal experience to back up that opinion.
What about bad fuel or need for a TPS reset? |
Busykat
| | Posted on Sunday, November 22, 2009 - 05:06 pm: |
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It is.
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/499273.html |
Alchemy
| | Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009 - 05:43 am: |
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I PM'd Jim Williams and he has not had a chance to test the limit.
I have to think that this may be an electronic issue. Not sure if it might be a speed sensor, ECM or cracked coil issue. I just can't believe there is something in the SW capping the top end. |
Alchemy
| | Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009 - 05:48 am: |
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One more thing BusyKat, if you have not had the comfort kit installed then that would reflash the ECM. I don't believe there is a special comfort kit for the XP so that would guarantee you were running the same Flash level as others. |
Busykat
| | Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009 - 08:30 am: |
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I'm planning on buying the comfort kit, but as listed in the July 2009 Buell Parts and Accessories catalog, the XP does take a different kit vs the X and XT.
XB12X/XT (non-cat exhaust): M1907.1AK
XB12XP (non-cat exhaust): M1907.1AU
I'm guessing that the differences are due to the siren mount.
As for the 115 mph limit, it's limited in 4th and 5th gear. It may have also been in 3rd too, but I can't recall. It pulls right up to it and then it starts cutting out the cylinders. I'll be taking to a dealer soon for other work; I just hope I can get them to look into it. I reckon it has something to do with it's intended customer, (which seems ironic to me).
Here's the thread which has more details:http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/499273.html |
Jammin_joules
| | Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009 - 07:40 pm: |
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FWIW we just sold our first used Buell since the black thursday announcement.
We have sold dozens and dozens of new Buells from our inventory, new ordered from Buell and any available from that of surrounding dealers, driving as far as 700+ miles two states away to get them. But used Buells just sat - especially since we held our pre-15Oct pricing on them because of what we paid for them as trade-ins. We have had our hands full on new bikes and we planned to wait until spring to sort the used ones out. There has been plenty of speculation and anxiety on used bike prices shared on these boards too.
I've said it before that I thought this could be one of those rare & unique times where it is advantageous to hold on to a used bike because spring unavailability of new bikes should see an uptick over prices I have been offering on trades right now.
So the drum rollllllllllllllllll.....
A 2005 XB12S with some very nice features, new skins front & rear, nice wheels, carbon fiber parts, Pro-pipe & dyno tuned, 13,000 miles. We actually sold it for more than we paid on trade for it. (hey, $1 and $100 and $300 is all considered more, albeit not get rich more) The price is very near the current NADA retail so I take this as a victory for current owners concerned with the 'value' of their Buells since black Thursday. It is not the blood bath fear mongers would have us believe.
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Eulysses
| | Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009 - 07:44 pm: |
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Good report there Jammin. Hooyah! Also...Busykat...what is the rpm of the cut-out? |
Busykat
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 - 07:02 pm: |
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Eulysses,
I don't know, too preoccupied with watching the road and cussing about the limited speed. I've got to find out though as I've been asked that before; however, as stated in the link, it does it in both 4th and 5th gear, and I think 3rd gear too, so it's not an RPM limiter thats kicking in. At least not in the sense that we tend to think of it.
A supervisor that I work with is also a local reserve law enforcement officer. In conversation one day he told me about the cruiser that was given him after the previous officer got a newer unit, (Crown Vic). He said that the previous officer said to him, "Be gentle with her Dave." When Dave asked what he meant, the other officer said that the governor was removed.
Now why a Police cruiser would be governed is a mystery to me. But perhaps there is some liability reason that cause them to do so. It may be that the same rationale exists for the XPs. I don't know, just hazarding a guess.
My 2006 would do 135 mph indicated on the speedo and was rock steady. I've got to get this resolved. If need be, I'll purchase a module off of an X (non-XP) Uly or buy a computer tweaking program to correct it. |
Froggy
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 - 07:28 pm: |
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The X and XP (In fact, all 2008+ fuel injected Buell's including the 1125R) use the same ECM. Only difference is the programming on each. Good news is, it would be easy to turn off once you figure out which bit it is on the EEPROM. It would be easy to figure out if you had both a X and XP firmware of the same revision. |
Alchemy
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 - 08:27 pm: |
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If it is real, it may be related to the speed rating of the large windscreen... perhaps. |
Frito
| | Posted on Friday, November 27, 2009 - 06:05 pm: |
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quote:Now why a Police cruiser would be governed is a mystery to me. But perhaps there is some liability reason that cause them to do so. It may be that the same rationale exists for the XPs. I don't know, just hazarding a guess.
I figure when you market a vehicle as a *police package* there is an expectation that the police will at some point run it as fast as it will go. To apply a end point to that speed to help keep the said *police* vehicle within controllable limits would seem to be a prudent legal maneuver for the protection of the mfg. No limiting device is needed on non police vehicles. If you're exceeding the posted speed limit the mfg. has an out from the liability standpoint. |
Frito
| | Posted on Friday, November 27, 2009 - 06:14 pm: |
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Well add me to the sold the Uly list. I bought my XT on 9-16-09, I got ill on 10-15-09. I had $6900 in my bike excluding tags and title. I sold it for exactly that. I figure it cost me ~$250 to ride the Uly for 2 months and 1100 miles. I'm uncertain at this point if I'll replace it or just stick with the FLHT. |
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