| Author | Message | ||
     Jphish |
Advertized in WhiteHorse Gear as alternative to wheel weights. Claim to be a way to Dynamically balance a tire with ceramic beads. I like the concept. Anyone had experience with these - Good or Bad?? | ||
| Froggy |
Its one of those things that have a lot of myths and misinformation surrounding them. Some claim they are great, some say they are snake oil. See: Right side scoop, synthetic oil. I doubt they would work in my rhinotired Stradas anyway.  | ||
| Choyashi |
Well.........I have 10oz of them and don't know what to do! I planned to use them to balance my tire when I changed it myself. The site I found on the web made them sound great, but my buddy just laughed. He said they were a bunch of ballony! Two guys at work though said there was something similar way back. It was a ring that bolted on your wheel that was filled with oil and shot. One guy said it was the only thing that could balance the front tires on his VW bus. Anyway, I had a shop mount my new tire, but they couldn't balance it because they didn't have a big enough adapter for the Buell axle. So now I have an unbalanced tire and the dyna beads..........What to do? The cheapest place I found to get the beads was a "Model T" website! I guess they work on Model T's! The Dunlop site said their tires wern't warrantied if you use liquid or solid balancing "stuff" inside the tire! I guess that means dyna beads? Right now I can't tell what my tire is doing. It's the rear. If it was the front, I could probably feel if something was off! If I put the beads in the rear, I probably won't be able to tell any difference. This post is too long, you don't have to read the whole thing......S..o...r..r..y!! | ||
| Jphish |
No - not too long - more like a stream of consciousness. However - I have mulled the same issue - "to bead or not to bead...that is the question". You provided usefull info - to wit, I didn't know Dunlop won't warrant tires that use 'em. Wonder about Avon or Michelin or others ?? Makes me a bit shy - wonder if WhiteHorse knows that ? Yhey're really hyped on 'em. I was considering 'Beads' for the same reason you were - adapter won't accomodate Buell wheel. Guess I could get another adapter, but that would be TOO easy. | ||
| Spectra |
HAVE THEM IN EVERY TIRE I OWN. ULY,S1,F450 | ||
| Jphish |
So spectra - whats the verdict ? Any down side ? Do the beads ever get stuck in the valve and cause a catastrophic failure of gargantuan proportions ?? Don't exactly know how...but just thought I'd ask. | ||
| Blake |
Foolish to use them. They are pure snake oil with blatant lies on there site conning folks to give their money to some very slick hucksters. | ||
| Teeps |
Here's a thought. If they worked, why are the auto makers (of the world) not using them? | ||
| Sprintex |
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44 1599 | ||
| Froggy |
A point like that is easily brought up, but its difficult to answer. Sometimes its legal reasons, sometimes its cost, or sometimes the product is total BS. | ||
| Ry329 |
Just a thought. My front loader washing machine has a ring around the tub filled with liquid and it dose a very good job of balancing, with a whole load of jeans it spins up pretty fast to extract water... | ||
| Jphish |
Given the size difference of Auto tires - probably take 8 oz / tire. @ $2.50 / oz = $25 per tire. That could be a bit prohibitive on the cost/value margin. Doesnt mean they don't work. But thats why I asked the question - to see if anyone had actual experience - good or bad. If folks have used them with good results I think they're an alternative to lead... And maybe recycleable / reusable. | ||
| Thetable |
I have about 3 pounds sitting in the garage, just waiting for me to get off my but and put them in. Of all the hundreds of reviews I have read on the beads, I have seen less than a dozen saying that the beads did not work for them. All the naysayers have not run them and yell and scream about how they are garbage, and they don't work and they can't work and MCN tested them to show they don't work on a tire balancer... If it rains this weekend and I think about it, I will throw mine in and report back. Oh yeah, looking at them, they appear to be simply ceramic bead blasting media. | ||
| Jphish |
Thetable - Will await results of your experiment. Thanks for your willingness to test and report. "It's alive I tell you...it's alive!!" | ||
| Pauley2000 |
I found RideOn (GooP) to balance my dirtbike after rimlocks and it worked incredible. From Hoppy to smooth as glass. same concept with the beads, you just don't get flat protection also. But the beads are re-usable. | ||
| Armymedic |
I used air soft pellets (1oz in front, 2oz in rear)in my V-strom with great results. Will be using same thing in my Uly. Some people have strong opinions regarding these. I say, try them. If they don't work for you, then you are always welcome to stick on weights. (Message edited by armymedic on April 09, 2009) | ||
| Pso |
I have used rideon on my Uly and also before that my goldWing. Started with the wing so I did not need to put air in rear as often. I should not have dropped out of the Yoga classes. Anyway stuff works well and is water soluble so cleans out quickly. | ||
| Arcticktm |
I tend to believe the MCN test results. They could not measure any significant difference before and after using the beads. People get too worked up about balancing sometimes. In a pinch, I have balanced wheels/tires on my ex-Ducati using the bikes axle and 2 car jack stands. Never felt any vibes, and tires wore evenly (no cupping, etc.). Many of us have also noticed how tires and wheels are so much better in the last decade that you typically need very little balance weight now. My latest tires on the Uly (PR2's) took about 1/4 oz IIRC. Wheel weights are so cheap and easy that I see no reason to spend more money for something that only MIGHT work. But that's just me. | ||
| Thetable |
This is because they had a fundamental misunderstanding in how the beads work. They need the wheel to be able to move or they will be unable to move to where they need to be. Got time? http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33 0675&highlight=dynabeads | ||
| Dr_greg |
Um, on what physical principles are the "beads" supposed to position themselves so as to balance the tire? Is the original unbalanced force (which has to produce some motion to affect the beads) supposed to do that? Or are these "smart beads." I'd like to see an analysis of that. And no, I'm not looking into it. Or into the N-page discussion on ADV. I'll stick with weights and a balancing rig. Good enough for the racers. --Doc | ||
| Thetable |
Let's pretend that the wheel/tire assembly suspended by the axle in an environment where the axle has the ability to move, like when it is attached to the suspension. Any imbalance in the wheel, will cause the wheel to move in the direction of the heaviest spot. Newton's first law of motion dictates that the beads will try to remain in the same spot in relation to the universe, but in relation to the wheel/tire assembly, they will be moving towards the lightest spot. Sorry, I'm having a hard time explaining it without visual aids. Hmmm, take a plate and put a tennis ball on it. Now move the plate, as a wheel would move with a heavy spot causing an imbalance. Relative to everything else (neglecting rolling resistance) the ball will end up, relative to everything outside the plate, exactly where it started, but relative to the plate, it will move opposite the direction it was pushed. Sorry, best I can do without an animation. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Table... Wouldn't they move towards the furthest spot away from the center of rotation? In essence, I'm saying the centrifugal force is like gravity, and the beads would seek the lowest point. Which would be the point furthest away from the center of rotation. Which is the heaviest point, which is the opposite of what you want. I've mounted 5 or 6 motorcycle tires now, and rode one of them at over well over 100 MPH down the back straight at mid ohio. My "balancing" consisted of lining up the paint dot for the heavy part of the tire opposite the valve stem. None were out of balance, neither the Scorpion Syncs or any of the Knobbies. Maybe dyna beads "work" because they don't have to do anything these days. | ||
| Thetable |
Center of rotation is always going to be the axle no matter where it moves. It could effectively be larger, but the axle movement is effectively contained to only one degree of freedom. It can move up or down. Of the last 15 tires or so I have mounted and balanced, I have seen one that required no weight, and two that required a quarter ounce. All the rest required more weight. Various brands, various wheels, gravity balanced. How did you verify that none were out of balance? Man, I hate getting involved in these threads, they always end up just a couple steps away from my ability to verbalize. It works in my head, and it all makes perfect sense, but to try to explain it to someone without circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of each one explaining what each one was to be used as evidence agains... (Sorry wrong song.) | ||
| Froggy |
I know what you mean Thetable, try having someone argue with you that something you have been doing for 30k miles isn't possible! | ||
| Reepicheep |
Not trying to argue, just discussing... The center of rotation would only be the axle if the axle was rigidly fixed, which is the balancer test, which everyone said was an invalid dynabead test because the axle was rigidly fixed. If the suspension does let the axle move, then its going to always move towards the heavier part of the tire, so the heavy part of the tire will always be "furthest out". Which seems to be where the beads will go. I test for balance by mounting a tire and riding it until it is worn out. If I haven't been able to detect an out of balance condition by then, I assume it was balanced | ||
| Choyashi |
I just put 2oz of dyna beads in my rear tire today, and went for a test ride. When at idle the bike shakes quite a bit, but once moving, it smooths out quite a bit! It vibrates the same as it did with a 1/2oz stick-on weight on my last rear tire. Therefore, I have concluded, that....... "Dyna beads" work as well as lead weights."  | ||
| Spectra |
THEY WORK LIKE A FLUID DAMPNER ON A HI PERFORMANCE V8 ENGINE. THEY HAVE BEEN USED ON LARGE TRUCKS FOR MANY YEARS. | ||
| Thetable |
No reason to shout Spectra. A couple nice videos that demonstrate the way they function: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eq263AYgyYg And another product based on the same principle marketed to truckers: http://www.centramatic.com/howworks.html | ||
| Blake |
The beads MAY provide a damping effect as they bounce around inside the tire. The lies propagated be these hucksters are that the beads provide any kind of balancing effect; they absolutely do not. In fact they likely worsen any imbalance. | ||
| Spectra |
SORRY, NOT SHOUTING JUST DONT RIGHT WELL.} |
