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Supertoon
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 01, 2007 - 02:04 pm: | 
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I think a RRS out of billet would be cool, even if it was more angular it could look kinda aggressive (sorta like parts of this post.....) |
Chadhargis
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 01, 2007 - 04:39 pm: |
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Chris...I'll take a tube of that cream please! 
As for the RSS...Ducati was mentioned above, and if you look closely at their supersport line of fully faired air-cooled bikes, the front cylinder is cooled via direct air flow...the rear cylinder has ONE duct going to it. Hummmm....looks like them Eye-talains are as dumb as us 'mericans. LOL!
I guess BMW is the only company that has it figured out. They put both cylinders out in the breeze. Sadly, my 1150GS and my antique R60 both pinged badly when they got hot. DOH! They needed a scoop I guess. LOL! |
Dhalen32
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 01, 2007 - 05:00 pm: |
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I believe that Robb's mold cost to be more in the neighborhood of $30K rather than $3K. His $275 retail price is undoubtedly based upon some amount of tooling amortization since the material and labor to make the part are probably are only 1% - 2% of that $275 selling price.
Dave |
Chris_in_tn
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 01, 2007 - 06:35 pm: |
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Will the RSS scoop hurt your bike, probably not.
Will the RSS scoop help your bike, probably not.
The only fact we have is it will in fact keep your pocket from running hot when that $275 is not burning a hole in your pocket.
Chad, lets not forget the great Moto Guzzi. Their perky jugs are poking out in the wind too. Not old and saggy like the BMW. Love those hot Italians!! The cream is in the mail.... |
Crusty
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 01, 2007 - 08:26 pm: |
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At the 20th Anniversary Dinner, Erik was explaining that Buell discovered that most of the oil breakdown in the bikes was caused by oil pooled in the head after shutdown being cooked by the residual heat. If they cooled the head quicker, then the oil wouldn't cook, and the engines would last longer.
Now if they put a simple thermostatic switch on the fan, then the fan would come on while the bike is moving; but since the engine is running, a constant supply of oil is being circulated through the head, and doesn't sit long enough to burn.
So, if the fan is running and it isn't necessary, nothing bad will happen to the engine; but if the fan isn't running, and it should be it could cost you a sizeable chunk of change.
So; given the above, I don't think a RSS will do any thing to help, considering how many man-hours Buell put into developing and testing the system. I also don't think it will hurt either.
I like my fan; it's a great conversation starter. |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 01, 2007 - 10:48 pm: |
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That type thinking is is how Americans got sucked into fighting in Iraq after being attacked by a bunch of Saudis that trained in Afghanistan. The president must have reasons??
We early buyers have paid in many ways. The buyer of this years model gets many improvements over last years, some I would like such as the new front springs. Next year will be better still.
So should Buell provide "upgrade" kits to 06 owners for improvements made to 07's? |
Brad1445
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 12:35 am: |
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Ft_bstrd
So should Buell provide "upgrade" kits to 06 owners for improvements made to 07's?
_________________________________________
Of course not. I guess my own point is I appreciate continues improvement and realize only items discussed in honesty can be addressed. |
Froggy
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 08:16 am: |
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I believe that we can officially recognize the First Church of the Right Side Scoop. Those who believe will never be dissuaded. Those who are "scoop atheists" will never be persuaded.
I had a Jehovah Scoopist knock on my door this morning... |
Jlnance
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 08:59 am: |
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I would like to see the test data from the scoop manufacturer regarding actual cylinder temps, sensor function, oil cooking, air flows, etc.
There was another RSS thread where someone did post data. I believe they used a heat gun to measure cylinder temps after a ride with and w/o an RSS. It's archived somewhere around here if someone feels like digging. |
Treadmarks
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 09:29 am: |
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http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/224426.html?1157060224 |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 10:46 am: |
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Stock Scoop:
front cylinder at base = 247f
rear cylinder at base = 268f
front head = 318f
rear head = 270f
same test run with
Big Air scoop:
front cylinder at base = 241f
rear cylinder at base = 243f
front head = 3336f
rear head = 298f
Teeps is headed in the right direction, actually getting data, and yes the head temps go up. When it's very hot out, (Arizona summer, etc), they get very hot. That's why we don't put a big right side scoop on at the factory. The right side scoop basically stalls some of the air flow across the heads by reducing the low pressure behind them. This causes head temps, then fuel temps to go up, causing real fueling issues at high temps. That's the reality of it. Now if you ride in areas that the temps don't get too high, then the right scoop won't be a problem. We have to make the best all-around configuration however. And if you want to install the 40 thermocouples and massive data logger, and then go run in every environmental condition, then you can have all the data we have too!
-Anonymous- |
Chadhargis
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 11:28 am: |
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Touche'! |
Etennuly
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 12:29 pm: |
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Well...how about a larger left side scoop??? |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 12:48 pm: |
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I wonder how the airflow would be changed by a larger scoop. If a certain air velocity is required in order to maintain the low pressure behind the rear cylinder, a larger scoop might not narrow down enough to increase the airflow velocities.
I'm sure that some here believe that the current scoop design is simply the first tried and they never did any research beyond just strapping it on the bike. |
Aeholton
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 02:22 pm: |
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Ft_bstrd quoted Anonymous: "Teeps is headed in the right direction, actually getting data, and yes the head temps go up..."
If this is true, how come the fan doesn't come on when running steady down the highway with the RSS installed? If head temperature is actually higher, wouldn't it make sense that the sensor (buried in the top of the head) would detect it and turn the fan on?
My fan can come on in city driving while leaving town. After I hit the highway and ride for a 5-10 miles the fan turns off (with RSS installed) and does not come back on until the engine is turned off or I hit more stop and go traffic.
If I make the same run with the factory piece on the bike, once fan comes on it does not shut off until the bike is parked, engine off and cool down cycle is complete. |
Windrider
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 04:01 pm: |
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For some reason I feel compelled to throw in my 2 cents:
1. Buell has to design the bike for ALL conditions from AZ to AK
2. I have to agree with Aeholton, if the fan runs less it is an indication that the rear jug is actually running cooler for most conditions. There may be a few conditions where it makes cooling worse or causes fuel delivery problems as Anon indicated but I think that these are rare exceptions.
3. I can't see a lot of harm from it either way. I don't think the RSS is going to kill your engine.
4. Most importantly, if the overheat light doesn't come on causing your engine to run in spark skip mode all is well in either case. Has anyone running the RSS gone into spark skip mode as a consequence of overheating the engine?
5. Engineers are not always right. The engineers working on this project probably focused on what they saw at the proving grounds down in AZ and optimized the solution, using the test data that they had, for those conditions. They may have missed something or engineered a solution that was slanted towards a certain set of conditions that does not exist for most riders.
And finally, little is more controversial that evokes such emotional debate as that little Right Side Scoop. |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 05:02 pm: |
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I don't know that whether a bike does or does not run in skip spark mode is the best test for the protection or damage afforded by the RSS.
There are lots of things you could do to harm an engine that wouldn't necessarily cause the engine to go into skip spark mode. That is the engine/ECM's last line of defense. |
Dentguy
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 10:09 pm: |
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Nice to see some real numbers. Thanks |
Thunderbox
| | Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 09:38 am: |
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Has anyone without the RSS had their bike go into Spark Skip Mode, with an operating fan. |
Supertoon
| | Posted on Monday, May 07, 2007 - 08:53 pm: |
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There must be a way to move the same volume of air while making less noise, make a fan with just a deeper, less aggressive sound and I would buy it! I crossed the border into Vermont this weekend and I had to use the kill switch to stop the fan as the trooper couldn't hear me over the din, he really didn't look impressed. Luckily it didn't seem to represent a threat to national security. |
Electraglider_1997
| | Posted on Monday, May 07, 2007 - 10:25 pm: |
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Every time you circumvent(turn off)the fan before it cools the oil you are frying the oil. Let the fan do what the engineers intended. |
Littlefield
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 08, 2007 - 09:01 am: |
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The RSS on my Uly seems to make the fan run less at around town speeds but I've noticed with the ambient temperatures up in the 80's the fan will start running when driving down the highway. Won't shut off until I turn the bike off and it runs for a while. I think I'll try removing it and see what happens. |
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