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Buell Forum » Knowledge Vault (tech, parts, apparel, & accessories topics) » Brakes » Archive through June 21, 2007 » EBC HH Vs Lyndal Carbon PADS « Previous Next »

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Vagelis46
Posted on Saturday, February 17, 2007 - 11:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I have used them and tested them back to back with the Wave front rotor from BRAKING. I can say this :

The EBC HH is a better choice.

The EBC pads do not fade after hard abuse, and this may save your life. They seem to work even when the rotor is red hot. And the wave rotor gets really hot. They worked when doing 3 consecutive 200-0 km/h stops.

The Lyndal carbon are good, BUT when pushed to the limits they DIE. When I tried 3 consecutive 200 to 0 km/h downhill emergency stops, the Lyndals on the last try were dead providing 0 stopping power. This might prove dangerous.
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Gotj
Posted on Saturday, February 17, 2007 - 11:55 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Just to clarify; are these the same pads referred to as the Lyndal "Gold" pads in other threads? Or is this another model of the Lyndal pads?
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Vagelis46
Posted on Saturday, February 17, 2007 - 12:21 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

They are the Lyndal Gold pads.

I got them from americansportbike.com.


I will also try EBC GFA345HH which are supposed to be better than the FA345HH that I have used so far (3 sets).
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Vagelis46
Posted on Saturday, February 17, 2007 - 12:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Also when the Lyndals get hot, there is this smell like a car's clutch pushed hard! At this moment the pads are dead. It happened to me a few times.
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Gotj
Posted on Saturday, February 17, 2007 - 01:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks for clarifying. You have compared these pads at one extreme of the performance spectrum. What about "normal" use? Does one or the other require more heat and/or pressure to perform well when operated at in a street environment? I understand that some racing pads have to "get up to temperature" to be fully functional.
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Gearloose
Posted on Saturday, February 17, 2007 - 06:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Geez must be alot of unhappy,unsafe Buell riders out there cuz there are a bunch of 'us' running them.I have ran EBC's before but went to the Golds on the Muelly.
Gearloose
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Vagelis46
Posted on Sunday, February 18, 2007 - 03:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Gearloose,

the only way to evaluate a braking product is when you push it in extreme conditions. In 'normal' conditions every product will do the job of stopping, no problem.

I find it strange, that there is a BIG section in this forum about evaluating exhaust systems + ECMs + air filters that simply add 5 Hp on the bike and cost about 1000Euros. On the other hand no-one really investigates on the brakes of the XB, which for me is far more important, and a good set of pads costs 50Euros.

If I had dyno runs for eg. Micron vs D&D, would it be more useful for Buellers?? NO WAY!

Imagine this : You are doing 220 km/h on the street and suddenly there is a crash in front of you (or a dog is crossing the road) and you need the max stopping power on earth to save your life. With the EBC you stop and return home, with the Lyndals you don't and you crash.

Also some of 'us' are doing track days and push our XB to its/our limit. I personally could use all the edge I can get. If I test 2 products and one of them is better than the other, I use this forum to tell the others Buellers about it. Some will find it useful. I would! That is why this forum exist. Right?

If you are happy with the Lyndals, then its fine, use them. Me, I will stay with EBC.

Simple as that!
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Gearloose
Posted on Sunday, February 18, 2007 - 03:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I see your previos post about the wave rotors and EBC being a must.I don't run wave rotors or probably ride to the full potential of the ULY.Of course I didn't with all the other bikes I have owned and ridden.No problem with your input on safety,I am all for it,it just sounded as if the way 'I'interpreted it that you were saying the Golds were unsafe at any speed.I see the 200kmp posting also.
If one is going to be riding a bike hard he or she needs all the braking they can get.
Good luck on the track days.
Gearloose : )
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Vagelis46
Posted on Sunday, February 18, 2007 - 04:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Gearloose,

don't forget to check the front rotor's drive bushings from time to time (I would guess every 5000 miles). It is a very simple task. Just unscrew the front rotor bolts one at a time and you can take just the drive bushing out. It is a good idea to replace them with the first sign of wear. If you find them worn out, then also check the rotor itself, at the point it contacts the drive bushings.

I did not know that the drive bushings wear out so fast, and when I checked them at 10.000 miles it was too late. The rotor was damaged, so I had to replace it and the bushings.

The Ulysses is a great bike, and I like its name ......(I am Greek, remember?)

The Uly is a Giant Supermoto, it reminds me of my last bike a Cagiva Navigator. Buy supermoto boots, and get your foot out at the slow corners going sideways. Great fun around town that I sometimes miss.
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Rogue_biker
Posted on Tuesday, May 08, 2007 - 12:14 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

You said you did 3 consecutive hard stops from 220 kph when the Lyndall's faded.

That's most likely NOT going to happen in the streets. Maybe one hard stop from 220 kph.

The EBC Sintered metals eat rotors faster. So for a bike ridden mostly in the street and which accumulates a lot of miles, this may not be practical. The rotor on the XB isn't cheap. For bike ridden at the track, I would say go ahead with the sintered metal pads. Because you should replace the rotors every 25k miles anyway for a bike ridden that hard often.
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Vagelis46
Posted on Tuesday, May 15, 2007 - 07:41 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I replaced the OEM front rotor after 17.000km because it was worn at the point of contact with the bushing on the wheel rim, and I had noise when braking. So this is the weak point of the OEM rotor and not wear from the brake pads. The rotor wear due to pads, is not a big issue for the XB.

I use the bike for track days, and street ridding with my friends on Jap (faster) bikes. So in order to stay ahead of them or keep up, with the excellent handling but under-powered XB, late braking is helpful. I really bealive that the combination of the XB chassis & front end is superior to the Jap bikes, so the XB can handle extra stopping power than a Jap bike. That is why I want to get the maximum in handling and braking power.

So when the OEM rotors were off, I decided to use the BRAKING wave front rotor to check it out. So far I have covered 5.000km with it. In the beggining, before making hard stops, I was impressed with the improved handling the lighter (300grams) wave rotor gave. But the braking power has decreased and when pushing hard I was experiencing brake fade. Pads from Lyndal and Braking had more brake fade than EBC.

Maybe the Lyndal and Braking pads are superior to EBC, when the OEM rotor is used, BUT I doubt it.

I can say that with the wave rotor, even with EBC FA345HH, after hard use the brake handle gets soft and I loose confidence in the brakes, which is a very bad thing when you fight a GSXR750.

I have not tried the wave rotor with EBC GFA345HH, or a 14mm master cylinder. I have read in one post that some people use a 14mm master cylinder, for their track days, since they get a better feeling on the handle and less brake fade with hard use.

But I think now I will switch back to a new OEM rotor.

I know that I am talking about very extreme situations like track days, but I think that sharing this info is good.

Everything on any bike's set up is a comprimise. But for me, safe and late braking is a higher prioroty than easier turning in.

Also when I installed the wave rotor I was running Dunlop208RR, that gave slow steering. Now I use Michelin Pilot Power, which is lighter compared to the 208RR and give faster turning in and handling. So maybe the OEM rotor's effect in turning in, will not be noticed.

What I will do is, install the OEM rotor + GFA345HH. Then add a 14mm master cylinder, and see what I get in braking power and handling. Then maybe, after 5000 km I will switch back to wave rotor.

For me improving my bike is a very interesting experience.
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Al_lighton
Posted on Tuesday, May 15, 2007 - 10:02 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'd put a 17mm radial master on before I'd put a 14mm "normal" master.

I recently put one on my Uly and I like it. It trades hydraulic leverage for mechanical leverage, and improved feel is the result.

I bought a Brembo master first, and it just wasn't going to be an easy installation. The location of the hydraulic line fittings interfered with the throttle cable exits, and the reservoir mounting was going to be a bitch. I wasn't running perch mounted mirrors, but it lacked mounting points for one, so it wasn't going to work for some folks, which was part of the plan. It needed to use a hydraulic line switch to activate the brake light, which meant harnes mods. And it looked funny on the handlebar.

But I got a 17mm Nissin radial master, and the installation was a breeze. It comes with the reservoir mounting bracket, the perch comes with a mirror clamp and a non-mirror clamp, the hose launch is in a good location, the switch was an exact match for stock and plugged right in with no mods, and it is black like it's supposed to be. It has a bleed nipple right on the master cylinder, and it installed in literally minutes, bled and everything. Most impressive. Best of all, I like the way it feels.

But there are a couple drawbacks. The pivot points are different, so you can't use Uly/CityX handguards with it. I wasn't using those anyway, so that didn't matter to me. And the stock white plastic reservoir isn't exactly pretty, though it is somewhat "standard" looking compared to most metric sport bikes. I'm going to put a billet anodized black on on mine eventually.

Here is a picture, I have bigger ones at the shop I can post.


I added it to the store here: http://www.americansportbike.com/shoponline/ccp0-p rodshow/16106.html

Vagelis, I have a couple sets of the EBC GFA345HH pads at the shop you asked me about if you want them.

Al
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Vagelis46
Posted on Wednesday, May 16, 2007 - 01:10 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Al,

How much are these? How can I pay for them ? Would you add them to the shop?
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Al_lighton
Posted on Wednesday, May 16, 2007 - 02:21 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

They're on the shop already, see the link in my previous thread below the picture.

Al
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Vagelis46
Posted on Wednesday, May 16, 2007 - 02:39 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I am talking about the GFA pads.
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