| Author | Message | |||
     Court |
Hahahaha . . . . yeah, pack up and go home . . . give up, stop trying. That pretty well nails down folks like Erik Buell, Dave Ulicki, Geoff May and Dave Gess. I recall when we all started in the business with dark hair and washboard abs. No one ever dreamed, in those days it was a struggle to find $3,000 to make the next payroll . . . that the company would be where they are today. Sulk off . . . cry, , , , complain or do whatever suits you. Meanwhile . . . I'm going to continue trying to make travel arrangements. I'm betting on Erik Buell & The Elves. | |||
| Ljm |
Really? You are going to sell the Buell because of WSBK results? Should your wife be worried when the Miss Universe results come out? | |||
| Stirz007 |
Russian Round has been Canceled. | |||
| Hughlysses |
Press release regarding this morning's practice sessions: http://us5.campaign-archive1.com/?u=b1964295d7f155 fa8c439a200&id=b1fd20d3aa | |||
| Classax |
Sorry I missed all the fire works, I was out riding an 1190RX. Amazing street bike! Anyhow I see we missed a major goal of making super pole. Hmmm. Still way down on top end. We're going to really get on top of why an AMA bike is trapping higher on a shorter straights. Up.. done fueling gotta ride! Peace! | |||
| Rocket_in_uk |
Hahahaha . . . . yeah, pack up and go home . . . give up, stop trying....... I don't for a moment think they should give up. I'm sorry if that's the way my recent comments have you see me. I just find it disappointing and somewhat sad that the best they can do appears to be way off the mark. It's because of this disappointment I get my armchair racer head on (like we all do) and find myself wondering what the hell they're doing at EBR. It's a normal reaction after all. I shall try to restrain my criticisms no matter how well intentioned they are meant to be. Such intentions it seems, not always being obvious  Rocket in England | |||
| Fast1075 |
Sandbagging: To intentionally project a lack of performance in order to gain a mental or tactical advantage to be exploited at an opportune moment. | |||
| Ebmachine |
That would be great to watch. The sandbagging strategy would definitely grab a lot of press. | |||
| Classax |
Looks like they are close (second) every where except section 3 of the track, they are loosing close to 3 almost 4 seconds on that one sector every lap. | |||
| Fast1075 |
Magic smoke escape. | |||
| Elvis |
It seems likely that Geoff's shoulder is still bothering him (it's only been 6 weeks since his surgery and that's probably one of the biggest reasons they skipped the group practice after he only had 4 weeks recovery). Since a healthy May should be faster than Yates and since Yates made clear progress from round 1 to round 2, I'm feeling more optimistic about their ability to learn and progress throughout the season than I have. I think we can realistically hope for finishes above 15 for both riders next round, and if they can do that I think that will show very solid progress for anybody who is looking at this rationally and not pushing an agenda on one side or the other. | |||
| Hughlysses |
Aragon results: Race 1- http://resources.worldsbk.com/files/results/2014/E SP1/SBK/001/CLA/Results.pdf Race 2- http://resources.worldsbk.com/files/results/2014/E SP1/SBK/002/CLA/Results.pdf Complete WSBK stats: http://www.worldsbk.com/en/results%20statistics | |||
| Pikeben08 |
At least they weren't dead last today. | |||
| Hughlysses |
Press release for today's races: http://us5.campaign-archive2.com/?u=b1964295d7f155 fa8c439a200&id=05e10002af | |||
| Ljm |
Anyone see anywhere what the 20 second penalty in Race to was for Aaron? | |||
| Snowscum |
Who is this? | |||
| Ljm |
Geoff. Maybe the technical problem that caused him to retire the first race? (Message edited by ljm on April 13, 2014) | |||
| Trojan |
Sandbagging: To intentionally project a lack of performance in order to gain a mental or tactical advantage to be exploited at an opportune moment. Please explain how or why a team that has gone to all the expense nd organisational hassle of running a team in a world class race series would then 'sandbag' by deliberately running around at the back of the field? That would please your sponsors (and the race organisers) I'm sure? The fact is that the team seem to have badly underestimated just what it takes to be competitive in this series, from hiring inexperienced riders to lack of testing, which then translates directly through to poor results. The two EBR bikes were the slowest through the speed trap by quite a large amount (9kmh slower than the next slowest in race 2 - an EVO engined kawasaki). If someone can give me something genuinely positive from this latest result I'd be very happy to hear it? (Not being last is not a positive result in my view). | |||
| Reepicheep |
It is easy to confuse a "fact" with an "opinion", "educated guess", or "preconceived conclusion". | |||
| Trojan |
OK, the FACT is that they are both consistently the slowest bikes on track and although the team press release keeps saying they are making progress in every session that is not reflected in lap times in either race or practice sessions. My opinion is that they have underestimated the task ahead of them, and so far I see nothing to change my opinion (based on educated guesses, perusal of race/timing records and a reasonable level of knowledge of racing, not through any preconceived conclusions). So I ask again, can someone please give us something positive from this latest result based on solid facts? here is the team press release (which I suspect includes more PR speak than before, so maybe they actually do read this forum  ) Top Twenty Finishes For Team Hero EBR In Spain Team Hero EBR secured another solid set of results in today’s World Superbike races at MotorLand Aragon. Race 1 saw both riders make excellent starts, ending the opening lap several places higher than they had qualified. Comfortably ahead of the BMW machines, the EBR 1190RX machine of Aaron ran inside the top 20 eventually finishing in 17th position. Geoff on the other hand was forced to retire from 22nd position on lap 5 with a technical problem which thankfully was able to be resolved for race 2. The opening race result is especially satisfying given the fact that Aaron had never ridden at Aragon before, and we expected the character of the circuit to make it a difficult weekend. To start 25th and finish 17th is credit to the whole team. In race two both riders made slight adjustments to their EBR 1190RX machines in an event to close the gap to the point scoring finishers. In slightly warmer conditions both riders finished, with Aaron once again ahead of both BMW machines. Geoff completed his first race of the season in 20th. Geoff May: “I am sorry I was out of the game in Race 1 because I need to test as much as possible. Anyway, I am happy because I healed properly after the Phillip Island crash and I really look forward to the next race in Assen, to make a another step forward with the development of the bike.” Aaron Yates: “I feel satisfied. I completed both the races, collecting a lot of data for the team and we also tried a couple of adjustments to the bike that will help us to be faster starting from the next race.” Giulio Bardi – Team Manager: “We can be satisfied for this race because Aragon is a fast track and we were obviously going to suffer with the long straight. Aaron and Geoff did a great job along with our mechanics and we collected a lot of important data to better develop our EBR 1190RX. Every session on track we got an improvement and I feel confident we will do even better at the next race, in Assen.” 2 rounds, 4 races and all the associated practice/test/qualifying sessions have now gone by with no visible improvement. In fact if the Bimotas would have been allowed to score points the results would look worse than they do now (which is already pretty poor). When does the sandbagging stop then? | |||
| Elvis |
Fact: Aaron Yates' best race lap vs. top race lap for round 1 (both races calculated and then averaged): 105.6 % Aaron Yates' best race lap vs. top race lap for round 2: 104.6 % In simple terms, Aaron reduced the gap between him and the top riders by 18% from round 1 to 2. That's real, measurable progress. (Message edited by elvis on April 14, 2014) | |||
| Vagelis46 |
What happened to Geoff's engine in Race1 ??? No answer to that .... Was the engine destroyed ? The problem is that the EBRs are about 3sec slower per lap from the faster EVO ..... I wonder how much of this is down to the riders and how much to the bikes. I guess we will get the real answer to this , when WSBK gets to Laguna Seca in July ... Aaron and Geoff know that track pretty well .... | |||
| Trojan |
Aaron Yates' best race lap vs. top race lap for round 1 (both races calculated and then averaged): 105.6 % Aaron Yates' best race lap vs. top race lap for round 2: 104.6 % So if they increase in compeitive ness at around 1% per race they should be at or near the front by around 2030? 1% could just be down to a good tyre or higher temperature and is not a measurable basis of improvement surely (unless you are grasping for straws)? I guess we will get the real answer to this , when WSBK gets to Laguna Seca in July ... Aaron and Geoff know that track pretty well .... You cannot hire riders on the basis that they know one track per year. They should have dug deep and hired an established WSb rider from the start. I have to wonder where they would be with a decent rider on board compared to their current situation. | |||
| Elvis |
Round 3 - 103.6 % Round 4 - 102.6 % Round 5 - 101.6 % Round 6 - 100.6 % Round 7 - Win. Obviously they're not going to be able to maintain that rate of improvement, but it doesn't mean it isn't real, measurable improvement. | |||
| Classax |
If someone can give me something genuinely positive from this latest result I'd be very happy to hear it? (Not being last is not a positive result in my view). Perhaps you should adjust your view. *Both riders Finished a race. *Yates was penalized 20seconds which would sans that, have had him in the hunt to score their first point. *While clearly not 100% May is healing well and should be fully ready soon. *Looking at the sector charts, both are with in a second of the leaders in the technical sections. *The team gathered data that shows they must focus on increasing top end. *They ran with in 105% of superbike pace and no one crashed or got hurt. *The new suspension seems to work, and the new RX swingarm has cut down on the unintended wheelies. I want to win you want to win, Hero/EBR(they) want to win, but like THEY told us before the season, this is about learning. So what have we learned so far? It may be that the ET-VT is in such a high state of tune in stock form there's just isn't much more to get out of it, OR they're chasing an issue that only additional testing and racing will indicate the fix for. | |||
| Hughlysses |
Classax- any idea why Aaron got the 20 second penalty? | |||
| Classax |
No clue, 20 seconds is normal for a jump start though. Whatever it was, it was assessed by the second lap, as they show him last on the sheets even though he was 15-17 on the track from then on. (Message edited by Classax on April 14, 2014) | |||
| M2typhoon |
105% within the packs pace is great news with riders that don't know jack about the tracks and a bike which has seen about 10% of the race development that the RS currently has. | |||
| Trojan |
105% doesn't sound a lot but is actually a massive gulf, especially considering they are a factory team within the rules yet are still behind almost all the EVO bikes. If it translates to 6-8 seconds per lap, depending on track, then that sounds harder to achieve than 5%. It will take an awful lot to get that 5% back, even though it sounds like a small measure. Every session where the EBR improves is also a session where everyone else makes moves forward too, so they are not operating in a technical vacuum here. The goal posts are constantly moving forward, so they have to make bigger improvements than everone else just to catch up. I hope they can find some missing horsepower or a magic bullet before the next round, because comments are already starting even on educated racing commentaries (not just sour grapes or uninformed trash). Motomatters.com had this to say: The EVO Bimotas of Ayrton Badovini and Christian Iddon performed admirably, even if they technically didn't exist for the purposes of racing, collecting no points, in spite of point-earning placement, due to Bimota not having made the 125 necessary bikes to count. The EBR bikes, running as regular, non-EVO, bikes didn't fare as well, with their innovative design not translating to actual results and, in spite of having enough bikes for sale to claim points, they have as yet been unable to do so. If they'd entered as EVO bikes, their predicament would not be as bad, but as it is, they will inevitably be compared to the Bimota and MV Agusta, both equally new to the class this year. | |||
| Albert666 |
maybe they should have gone evo and possibly got some hungrier riders still looking forward to meeting them at donington though |
ebr?