| Author | Message | ||
     Bomber |
All I'm getting ready to replace the iontake manifold seals on my Y2K M2 . . . . I've read the manual, but these fine books often to not reflect the best knowledge available (having been a tech writer, this fact is all too clear to me) . . . any hints/tips/suggestions? also, what would cause these seals to leak? I've got about 20K miles on the bike, and the manifold has never been removed thanks | ||
| Rookie |
Thanks Blake, I have the 45 pilot jet and a drill. It seems to run fine after it warms up, that being the only issue concerning performance, I was more worried about frying a valve. Your advice is greatly appreciated. | ||
| Eastexsteve |
I noticed the service bulletin regarding 200 -1/2 and up carbureted M2s. I also noted a blurb about the revised carb with the 195 main jet and modified vent path. Does anybody know how this affects the suggested carb mods that have been made thus far on this BBS? Also, is anyone drilling their slides out to .110" as I have seen mentioned for stock applications? I have a stock 2001 m2 and I was wondering what the carb mods would be if I installed a D&D slip-on and a K&N element, or went all the way to a Forcewinder breather setup. | ||
| Ocbueller |
Bomber, The seals are rubber and just dry rot away. All those heat cycles and vibration don't help either. Tat sells a nice angled allen wrench that will make the job a breeze. Take note of how the manifold is assembled before taking it apart. There are parts for front and rear and should be marked. SteveH | ||
| Bomber |
Oc thank you sir . . . . .I appreciate the data . . . I modified an allen last night . . . . parts, I hope, will be sourced today at lunch | ||
| Socal |
Hello. I ride a '96 S1, it has 13,500 (givertake). I purchased the bike when the odometer was at about 10,500. Recently, the motorcycle has been popping and misfiring when I'm warming it up in the morning. Also, with the choke on it likes to start out idling at almost 2500rpm, then it creeps up to 3000rpm and further sometimes! I'm not quite sure why this has been happening - I have worked on car and truck motors before, but this is my first air-cooled v-twin! I would like to fix this problem myself and get it running back to normal conditions. I researched the problem on here and came up with a few different entries. It seems to me that I need to re-jet the carb and inspect and maybe replace some seals. Does this sound about right? I included my search results below. Perhaps, since the latest result was nearly a year ago, some more insight has been shed on the problem or somebody else can benefit from this as well. ____________________________________________________________________ Knowledge Vault: Engine - Carburetion, Fuel Injection and Fuel Delivery: Archives: Archive through April 13, 2001 Troop Saturday, April 07, 2001 - 08:41 pm I have an 00 M2. I went the route of the #45 slow speed jet/1988xl needle/2 turns out on the EPA screw and drilled out the slide vacuum hole to 7/64ths(optional). I also have a YoDude intake and V&H pipe installed. My bike runs flawlessly ! It idles smoothly,warms up faster and has no more sputter,stutter or hesitations. The additional nice part ? The cost for carb parts was $12.00 ! Try this route first. You won't be out much and you may be totally happy. Bluzm2 Sunday, April 08, 2001 - 01:11 pm M2Cyclone -I concur with Troop, I have the same mods to my 00 M2, stock airbox with K&N filter, stock pipe. No spits, farts or stuttering. It only takes about an hour and your back on the road. Added bonus, you get to spend some quality time with your scoot! BluzM2 Chuck Thursday, April 12, 2001 - 07:57 pm Jason --- your carb has 2 different fuel "circuits" ... pilot circuit and main circuit. Either can run lean. IMHO the pilot circuit is easiest to diagnose when set too lean. Usually, a lean pilot circuit will cause a "lean mis-fire" or "popping" sound in the exhaust as you decelerate. The main circuit is tougher. Dynojet says that a bike that runs poorly when "asking for power" is generally too rich; but a bike that runs poorly when not "asking for power" is generally too lean . . . IMHO its better to err on the too rich side of perfect than to err on the too lean side. A dyno will help immensely but may not always give you optimal results. I like to gradually adjust the main circuit to be richer and richer until power during acceleration drops off or I can feel a "flat" spot or "bog"; and then, gradually adjust the main circuit leaner until this symptom just disappears. We once "optimized" a race bike (FZR400) on the dyno for peak horsepower; but found that, on the track it had a "rich" flat spot at 9500 rpm ... and so we had to lean out the main circuit until the problem went away. This is an extreme example of a highly modified bike but it illustrates the CV carburetor tuning exercise . . . hope this helps you more than it hurts. ____________________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________________ Knowledge Vault: Engine - Carburetion, Fuel Injection and Fuel Delivery: Archives: Archive through April 18, 2001 Blackbuellm2 Saturday, April 14, 2001 - 05:24 pm WOW Just did the carb fix last night. What an amazing difference. For the first time the bike will power the front wheel up in second gear. No yanking on the bars, just a quick shift and let 'er rip. In town no stutter, no pop, no backfire through the carb. Thanks MUCHO Aaron for the assist. If you haven't rejetted the carb on your bike do it. It took me all of 2 hours total. It's time well spent. ____________________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________________ Knowledge Vault: Exhaust - Headers, Muffler: Archives: Archive through April 26, 2001 Y2k01x1 Tuesday, April 24, 2001 - 10:33 pm just put a V&H SS2R on my 2001 X1. it makes the same gurgling/popping sounds when i'm coasting to a stop or decelerating. will also install the race ECM as soon as my forcewinder XR2 gets here. Chuck Tuesday, April 24, 2001 - 11:26 pm "gurgling/popping" is a lean mis-fire. Easy to fix on bikes with carbs ... harder to fix on bikes with injectors. ____________________________________________________________________ ____________________________________________________________________ Knowledge Vault: Engine - Mechanical (The BIG Parts): Archive through October 06, 2001 Caveman Thursday, October 04, 2001 - 12:16 am Vacuum Leak? After a long ride, my 98 S3 now "pops" and "Crackles" from the exhaust like a street rod during deceleration / engine braking. It never did this before. Also, I noticed that when I "blip" the throttle (not driving) it does not come quickly back down to idle. I think I have seen ppl speak of this b4, but plz remind me of where to look. Exh flanges were kinda loose, so I tightened them with a torque wrench (6 - 8 ft/lb)doesn't seem very tight, and dbl nutted them, still no change. TIA jim Blake Thursday, October 04, 2001 - 03:40 am Caveman: Check your intake seals. Road_Thing Thursday, October 04, 2001 - 09:53 am Caveman: Backfiring on the overrun can be caused by leaky exhaust header gaskets. Since you mentioned that your ex. flanges were "kinda loose" I'd suggest you pull your pipes and change out the little woven metal donuts in the exhaust ports. r_t (...of course, a LITTLE popping sounds pretty cool...) ____________________________________________________________________ Any suggestions would be very helpful. Is it true that I should probably benefit by purchasing a re-jet kit, intake and exhaust seals from my local Buell dealership? Thanks in advance. Tony | ||
| Blake |
Tony, Sounds like intake manifold seal leakage. Check by setting the bike at a fast idle and spraying WD40 or electrical contact cleaner all around each of the three (two cylinder heads, one carburetor) manifold ports. If the engine speed drops, you have located a leak. Replace the seals. Problem solved.  Jetting is not likely the culprit as that would not manifest as a new problem, just poor running all the time. You might want to check your pilot jet to ensure it has been upgraded to the 45 jet. | ||
| Bomber |
Tony replacing the manifold-to-head and carb-to-manifold seals is pretty straightforeward (just did the work last night It will likely seem to you that the top allen-head bolts will not back out enought to be removed -- they will back out into the manifold itself. not to worry, they will bacck out, just emnough, to allow manifold removal. While checking to make sure everything was intalled properly, I ran the engine for a few minutes w/out the aircleaner installed . . . . when blipping the throttle rapdily, a small cloud or fog of fuel/air mixture appeared infront of the carb mouth . . . .it was the diameter of the mouth, and extened about an inch or so from the carb. I don't think I would have seen it if I hadn'/t been working in the garage, at night, with fairly powerful lights grazing the carb mouth . . . it only lasted that long is this fog normal? | ||
| Socal |
Great - thanks for the input guys. I will try that high idle, contact cleaner/WD40 trick - that is a very good idea! | ||
| Ara |
Bomber I've never seen the fog you describe, but I'm thinking that what you saw was fuel fog and probably the only reason you were treated to this Saint Elmo's Fire of internal combustion engines was due to the lighting conditions you describe and whatever the temperature and humidity were at the time. Not sure - that's a guess. | ||
| Bomber |
Ara . . . .could very well be right on time and target, sir . . .it was as humid as it could be without actually raining, temps in the 70s or so . . . it was thick, easily seen through, in fact I had to repeat the excersize three or four times (with my new wileyco in the garage . . . poor me) to make sure I wasn't imagining it . . . I'll just continue to dial in the low speed screw (replaced the stocker with one of those knurled knob jobbies from creative enterprises, I think their name is) and ride the wheels on the poor beast | ||
| H_Man |
Just a quick general note to say how much I appreciate all you guys (and gals) being out there and the info you share. My '00 M2 recently began to sound like I was friggin' Flash Gordon circling in to land (how many of you remember Flash Gordon or Buck Rodgers?). I did a word search on BADWEB and was pointed to the solution. A simple thing really, but pretty damn puzzling for a non-mechanical type like me. H-man | ||
| Bomber |
I remember! what was the problem, in case I can't find Dr Zarkov? | ||
| H_Man |
There was a past post that noted when backfiring occurs during deceleration, to quickly check the header exhausts. Well, that was it. Luckily, I didn't have a sheared bolt. One of the nuts had come off. A friend had suggested an intake leak. I checked the manifolds and the air intake w/ WD-40 and nothing. Took someone pointing out something obvious for me to know. I've replaced both exhaust gaskets and the one nut. The backfiring is just about gone. H-man | ||
| Ara |
OK, H_Man, but don't try to eliminate the backfiring altogether by overtorqueing the nuts. Ming the Merciless will ZAP you for that! Russ | ||
| Mikep |
Bomber, Regarding: ". . . . when blipping the throttle rapdily, a small cloud or fog of fuel/air mixture appeared infront of the carb mouth . . . ." This phenomenon is referred to as 'fuel standoff'. It is the result of 'cross-talk' between cylinders on your 45deg v-twin, short intake manifold design. The reason people tend to not see it, is we do not go around with our air cleaners off very often. It happens at various rpm depending on tuning resonance stuff. At higher rpm you may see as much as 12" of standoff. mikep | ||
| Ara |
Mikep - "Fuel Standoff." Interesting term. But the 12-inch distance is positively scary. Another good reason not to smoke while working on your bike! Russ | ||
| H_Man |
Shite! Thanks Ara. I figured tight is good, so tighter still is even better. I tightened the nuts fairly well on Tuesday. Yesterday, after riding about 25 miles, I noticed the nuts were able to be tightened further. They were hand tightened (nothing ape-like or using my super-human strength ), but I didn't measure it w/ a torque wrench. I didn't put Lock-tite (blue) on the studs either. Think I'll place a second nut on the studs to prevent the nut from loosening. H-man | ||
| Ara |
Anybody put jam nuts on the exhaust header studs? Any drawbacks to what H-Man is proposing??? H_man - If you do that, see if you can find those special jam nuts for that application. They're about 3/5 the thickness of regular nuts and specifically made for the purpose. Recommend Grade 8 because of the high heat. After you tighten the first nuts to spec, put an end wrench on them and hold them still while you tighten the jam nuts. That way you won't inadvertantly over torque and Ming won't suck your mind out. Russ | ||
| Eastexsteve |
Question for Aaron: In your Feb '02 test of CV needles, I was especially interested in the A/F chart. Were you testing these needles with or without shims? - Thanks, - Steve | ||
| Sharkus |
Sharkus here. Just wanted to thank everyone who insisted I get a race ECM on my X1. After my dealer reset the TPS and put on an easy adjustable idle it is a world of difference. Warms up quicker, roll on power is smooth and strong from 2,000 rpm to redline. Now...after reading all of the posts in the last couple of weeks I have just one more question. My Buell is a 99 X1 with 1085 miles...when should I expect it to blow up, spring an oil leak, not start, start running crappy or just plain up and die. I'm an agressive rider but not one of these hardcore riders doing stoppies, wheelies into 4th or 5th gear or riding around corners with sparks flying from the pegs. I really like my Buell since I bought it 5 weeks ago but after reading some of these stories...well I just get this feeling that I don't want to ride out of the city, much less a 210 ride to Myrtle Beach. | ||
| Eastexsteve |
Just a note to those who may read this message board and may be looking for jetting tips specific to a box stock 2001-2002 M2. Although mine is a late 2001 model, Buell told me over the telephone that the 2002 was just a carryover from 2001 and there is absolutely no difference anywhere on the motorcycle. I live in East Texas about 500 ft. above sea level. I changed out the stock 42 slow jet to a 45. I drilled out the plug covering in the idle mixture screw. I am currently running three turns out on the idle mixture screw. I may not be completely set on this, but it is definitely running smoother at low speed, and idling smoother. I can also give it full throttle at 2000 rpm in second gear and there is no hesitation and a smooth steady pull until it seems to hit the power band at 3000 rpm. Getting the idle setting finalized will be an exercise in patience as I cannot seem to find a way to adjust the idle until the engine is dead stop and cool. Putting a .020 shim under the stock KOKK needle was a bad idea in this particular bike. It ran worse. It did not cause the bike to stutter or miss out, it just caused it to not pull as hard from 3000 rpm on. This could easily fool someone into believing that the power band suddenly became flatter or stronger. But, I can tell you that was not the case. It was just too rich and did not run as well. I had a feeling this would happen, but I tried it to be sure. I did not enlarge the vacuum hole in the slide. It was already about 3/32 of an inch in size to begin with. I just want to take a moment and throw my 2¢ into the ring regarding constant velocity carburetor tuning. I'm definitely not the expert, and it has been awhile. But, I spent several years in my younger days as a motorcycle mechanic and road racer. CV carbs are much more accommodating than mechanical slide carbs when it comes to changing or modifying intake configurations. Rarely did I ever have to re-jet a CV carb due to changes in the intake/airbox design of an engine. Changing the exhaust however, was always a different story. Quite simply, if you increase or decrease the efficiency of the air box, the CV carb will automatically compensate for it. It is the nature of the beast. That is what it is supposed to do. Also, something else that we learned in Honda Performance school is that there is a tunable length and diameter to an intake port. It didn't really matter where in the intake track you placed the carburetor, but the total port length and size made a difference in how the engine would run. From my experience, you can do a heck of a lot of bolt on modifications to an engine and the stock intake port configurations will still be the best. Only when you started making major engine mods did this rule change. Trust me when I say that the snorkel inside of that bread box is there for a reason. And, it is also that diameter and that length for a reason. However, air filter efficiency is a different story. | ||
| Jadow |
Sharkus! Go ahead and ride to Myrtle Beach..If you have any trouble, one of the best Buell Techs works in Charleston, SC.(just down the rode from MB) He can get you home! | ||
| Meditr0n |
Ok news on the X1 with the misfire... I have replaced the O2 sensor, air filter and removed the offending PC3. The bike even just sitting (under NO load) still misses. It is acting like the rev limiter is activating. Has anyone had anything like this? THX Doc | ||
| Eastexsteve |
Meditron: I have experienced this with FI cars. I would normally check for plugwire or coil failure. Also, I would check for crosstalk or shorting out of FI wires themselves. | ||
| Ara |
Med: How's your sidestand switch? | ||
| Meditr0n |
I pulled the codes out of the computer. Thanks again for all of the help from everyone here on the board (I wouldn't have known the codes or how to get them without you). Anyway, got a engine temp sensor code, rear fuel injector code and rear coil code. Also got an O2 sensor code but I figured that one was normal due to the trashed O2 sensor that was on there. So it is now in the hands of Tampa Harley Davidson's service dept. Since it is still under warranty. I will let you all know what happens. Thanks again Doc | ||
| Rookie |
Different problems now, I put the 45 pilot jet in and adjusted the idle mixture to 2.5 turns out from full in. The bike seems to run fine at low rpms until I roll on the throttle quickly...it bogs for a bit and then comes out of it. I checked for an intake leak with WD40, no leak that I could tell. I'm the genius that posted about a week or so ago concerning a lean condition after gutting my stock exhaust. help... | ||
| Reepicheep |
Rookie... The CV carb on your Cyclone needs a little vent hole to be routed correctly in order to respond correctly to quick roll ons. This showed up as a result in changes to the way the forcewinders were being built, they went from a nice big ground out channel to a thin little cut, and it made the bikes run very lean when you jump on the throttle... Aaron found this, and lots of us cleaned up throttle response significantly by opening up our narrow channels. Don't know how you did the airbox, but making sure that little vent (a small hole right next to the intake) is routed correctly is one thing to check (though it could be other things as well). There are photos of the "good" and "bad" forcewinders in the knowledge vault if you need help finding the vent. | ||
| Rookie |
I'm lost, before I changed the pilot and adjusted the idle mixture, the only complaint was poor performance until the bike warmed up. Now it runs fine at low rpms but runs like crap when I get on it. It wasn't doing this before. The breadbox remains untouched. Here's something to think about, when I got it back together and took it for a spin, I had the outer cover of the breadbox off. Could that affect performance? If so, then I will get the feathers and you guys bring the tar. |
