| Author | Message | ||
     Scbueller |
The wife has finally allowed me to kill myself by letting me turbo my xb9s, but 4000 seems a bit high for a turbo kit. Does anyone have the specs on one? Turbo size, engine management, ecm ,fuel psi, blow through, injectors, want to build one without killing the motor. Looking for 130hp for 2500 bucks impossible? slightly used is ok for me | ||
| Joele |
I'd like to know too - emailed Jens at Hillbilly-Motors and didn't get a response. Who knows? | ||
| Cataract2 |
That's going to be a wild bike. Can we say Hellbender 2? | ||
| Scbueller |
Does anyone know if I can use the stock ecm or if a stock eclipse turbo is to large to be on a stock 9? | ||
| Blake |
I have no idea what you are talking about. What is a "stock eclipse turbo"? Doubt any turbo will work with a stock ECM on any engine. | ||
| Wyckedflesh |
Try giving these guys a call... http://www.rbracing-rsr.com/ They build turbo systems for Land Speed racing bikes, and seem to do alot of work with HD bigtwins and sportsters so there should be no problem with them making something for your XB. | ||
| Spike |
I believe he's referring to the Mitsubishi car- the Eclipse. I'm not a DSM guy, but I *think* the stock eclipse turbo is a Garrett T25. Considering that it's sized to work with a 2.0l, it's likely too large and will create a lot of lag. | ||
| Blake |
Thanks Spike. A race turbo is might not work so good for the street. Turbo lag is not an issue on a Land Speed racing machine. I keep hoping Buell will come out with a compact variable vane turbo setup that will push the stock bikes up to 110 RWHP or so, just a 20% increase is all, nothing scary. How cool would that be? I bet it would allow a significant weight reduction to the muffler too. Turbos can be pretty good mufflers all by themselves. Hillbilly-Motors did it with a stock XB; surely Buell can find a way to do it with even cleaner integration/implementation. | ||
| Fullpower |
turbo charging is indeed an effective noise reduction technique. have been running a 3.5 inch straight stack on my cummins powered dodge for 241,000 miles. hacked the stock exhaust system off at 300 miles. might even be possible to fit a turbo in the area currently occupied by the BIG STEEL BUS MUFFLER under the XB? | ||
| Joele |
If you can get the fuel situation licked, turbo charging is a great way to make 10 - 20% more HP. Not to mention the cool sounds it adds. | ||
| Leftcoastal |
What fuel situation is that, Joel? My aerocharger bumped my 60ish hp RS to around 100 - low boost, no intercooler. A bit over 10 - 20%! It got 40-45 MPG at 80+ mph so if that is what you meant by the fuel sit, that is handled too! I did sound cool! except when those little washers went through it, that didn't sound all that good. AL | ||
| Joele |
Re-mapping fuel program for increased volume of air - possibly changing the injectors to accommodate the additional fuel required to prevent a lean situation - changing the fuel pressure regulator to increase fuel pressure with boost so you don't starve - possibly replacing the fuel pump with something that can move more fuel at a reasonable duty cycle. If you ignore these things and run lean, you'll have a nice hole burned through your piston. Leftcoastal - do you mean you had some washers drop into your compressor side?!?!? | ||
| Spike |
Way cool. Cool enough to have me waiting in line at the dealer, even if it meant sleeping in the garage for a while. | ||
| Djkaplan |
I think air-cooling would make it prohibitive to do turbocharging for production, especially for a Sportster based engine. Porsche pulled it off with the 930 back in the 70's, but the cooling fan on the engine was huge. | ||
| Firemanjim |
Be wary of RBR,I have heard some bad things about them on a couple of other turbo sites.The Turbo Doc in Ogden Utah has another line of variable vane turbo similar to the Aerochargers. Joele is correct in his thinking--you need a boost referenced fuel pressure regulator to increase fuel pressure as boost rises,depending on injector flow you may need bigger injectors.And some sort of ECM that you can program to increase fueling under boost.Stock won't do it.Some bikes use a piggyback type ,some replace the stocker completely.As to whether or not the Eclipse turbo will work you need to get a program such as Turbo Calc that you can put in your engine info and it will recommend turboes to fit that application. BTW,I may have an Aerocharger from a Buell for sale soon if you are interested. American Turbo Power also offers some turbo set-ups for HD's. A couple of things to consider,turboes need an oil supply and then oil return to sump is gravity so mounting is important.Aerocharger overcomes this by using a self contained oil system.Also the variable vane style is nice because you make boost sooner so no lag and a wastegate is not necessary to bleed excess boost off as the vanes adjust to control boost. Most car turboes are internal wastegate styles and most bikes use an external type as they are more responsive and easier to mount in a motorcycle application. Fullpower is right on about the noise reduction,my turboed Buell Bonneville bike makes less noise than a race canned Buell.And I removed the stock muffler completely from my Ford 6.0 diesel and almost cannot tell the difference. | ||
| Leftcoastal |
Sorry Joel - didn't realize what "fuel situation" you were referring to. Mine's carbed which gets around most of that. Re: washers- a couple of the bolts that hold the plenum on the carb loosened up, allowing 2 little 1/4" washers to take a tour through each cylinder, then when they'd seen enough and were getting hungry, decided to head on down the header and see if they could find some tender turbo impellers and variable vanes to eat. I've had some words with my maintenance dept. AL ps- FMJ what size is that turbo you're gonna part with? | ||
| Firemanjim |
The one that came in my S-2 kit--replaced it with a bigger one from a snowmobile. | ||
| Spike |
Unless I don't know my Porsches, the 911 Turbo was air-cooled all the way up through the 993 series which ran until 1998. It wasn't until they released the 996 that the 911 went to water-cooling. Since Harley already has some ties with Porsche engine development it seems like it wouldn't be too hard to work out some sort of reliable turbo setup. | ||
| Spike |
*Edit- double post (Message edited by spike on July 19, 2005) | ||
| Blake |
The little red "  " works nicely too for handling double posts.  | ||
| Jan_lee |
i have been thinking of turbo charging my 9r for a couple of weeks now but yesterday i ran in to electric superchargers on ebay apparently they push 250cfm that would be a lot for for under a liter they are twelve volts and draw less than 2 amps thats hard on a bike but if you toggle it for when you want it then hey it flows without running. mount it where the air intake is with a cone filter facing forward like a force but on the left side and seal the charge tube into the airbox. mix with pc3 and very open exhaust like a force, stir left cool and serve up with rice. just a thought any comments, jan | ||
| Joele |
LOL at Jan_lee's post!! Now if we could only coax the folks from Hillbilly-Motors to give us details about their turbo implementation.... | ||
| Firemanjim |
Electric supercharger looks suspiciously like the fan motor in my old Oldsmobile---- Save your money,no way that can work. But there is an outfit in Berkeley working on real superchrgers for motorcycles.Their site lists a Buell as coming soon.Look here- http://www.calisuperbikes.com/ | ||
| Jan_lee |
if you dont like the idea of the electric motor we could always take the mouse out of the fan in your oldsmobile and just let him run in side the one on the bike, that would save the drain on the charging system but you never know when its going to take off into a run and instantly give you -3.14150265359 gain in horse power. | ||
| Djkaplan |
"Unless I don't know my Porsches, the 911 Turbo was air-cooled all the way up through the 993 series which ran until 1998. It wasn't until they released the 996 that the 911 went to water-cooling." That's the point I made with my post. Porsche turbocharged the air-cooled 911 (designated 930) in the mid 70's. The boxer engine used forced air induction to cool the cylinders and heads and the fan was huge (and a little noisey). Chevrolet turbocharged the air-cooled Corvair in the mid 60's, but it too, had a huge fan to cool the engine. There's a reason no manufacturer has ever developed an air-cooled turbocharged motorcycle. Kawasaki marketed, but didn't develop, a very limited run of turbo Z1-R's, but only for one year. Lot's of aftermarket applications exist, but the companies that market them aren't liable when the engine grenades. | ||
| Firemanjim |
All the Japanese manufacturers put out a turbo bike in the 80's.Turbo Seca,Honda 500/650 CX,XN85 Suzuki,Kawa 750.They all worked well,the Kawi was the best.Lack of buyers made them go away.IIRC the Honda was the only watercooled one. | ||
| Djkaplan |
I forgot that the Yamaha and Suzuki were air-cooled. | ||
| Blake |
DJ, I think you are mired in a mistaken assumption. There is no reason that turbocharging cannot or should not be employed on air-cooled engines. Cooling is cooling. As long as it is adequate, the medium through which it is accomplished is immaterial. For instance, what liquid cooled high performance car engine, turbo or no, does NOT have "a huge fan to cool the engine"? So much HP requires so much cooling. If a 130 HP naturally aspirated Buell engine can operate well via air cooling, there is no reason that a 130 HP turbocharged Buell engine cannot do the same. Cooling is cooling. It matters not how it is accomplished. At least not with respect to the ability of the cooling system to cool the engine. It might matter if you don't want the added weight and complexity of a big liquid cooling system which then in turn also needs to be cooled by air, often via a big fan. Are you seeing the gist of my point? | ||
| Fullpower |
jan: you cannot pressurize the intake manifold of a running 984 cc buell engine with 24 watts of electricity. 2 amps x 12 volts = 24 watts. not enough power. you may get 250 cfm free air volume.... outdoors in a hurricane. 1 horsepower is thoeretically equivalent to 746 watts, at 100% efficiency. to pressurize ( 1 atmosphere)the intake manifold of your 984cc engine at its torque peak around 5500 rpm should take at least 2 horsepower. | ||
| Fullpower |
i should add that 2 horsepower is a pretty BIG dc motor, and would require several XB charging systems to operate. using essentially wasted exhaust gas energy is a much more attractive method. |
