| Author | Message | ||
     Rocketsprink |
as reported on other sites and in AMA license renewal mailer. Scrubbed MOTO-GT and the planned 450 single class. Can't say I'm surprised. | ||
| Rocketsprink |
http://www.roadracingworld.com/news/article/?artic le=38827 | ||
| Jaimec |
How to kill American Superbike: Pay a BIGGER purse for the "Sportbike" class. Sigh... and I remember when American Superbike riders were some of the best in the world. Ben Spies may very well be the last we'll see in a looooooooong time. | ||
| Rocketsprink |
I'm actually surprised they didn't suspend the entire series for next year do to the economy. At this point, no AMA is better than a watered down version. I'm just a club racer, and at this point, don't see too many is any races in my near future. (Message edited by rocketsprink on November 30, 2009) | ||
| Trojan |
Another punch in the face for teams/riders that try to race at the very highest level in the USA. No factories, no star riders and now no money = no specators (and ultimatley no race series at all). The only constant seems to be the presence of Roger Edmundson regardless of what everyone thinks of him. I agree with Rocketsprink. Cancel what is left of the AMA/DMG series for 2010 and come back with a 'proper' series under new management in 2011. | ||
| Backcountryme |
Wow, I though DMG did a not so bad job last year, but now I am thinking differnetly. This sucks. | ||
| Fast2win |
Whew, less money for superbike. The worst part of that is ERB may concentrate more on DSB than superbike. I hope not but if thats where the money is ? However if he can keep 1125R's at front you may see Buell leading the pack there. Still my hope's were to see a superbike, not that it's out but less attractive. | ||
| Blake |
Anyone care to offer up some facts, like how much did AMA before DMG pay for Superbike and what was then Formula Extreme classes? I know it's just the internet, but it would be nice to see some actual facts interjected among all the DMG bashing. How much do other national series pay? I know, why inject facts into the fray? I'm just goofy that way I guess. | ||
| Blake |
Less payout for Superbike. Why? Less competition, less brands competing? | ||
| Badlionsfan |
Blake, that's no way to attract more competitors to superbike. Let's look at a simple situation, ebr. Erik has to decide what series to race in as a privateer. Which way would you go with that pay out structure? There is no motivation to spend the extra money to run superbike. Of course DMG knows this. My personal opinion is they are going to phase out superbike and make daytona sportbike the top class. That's my guess, and the only thing that justifies this move. | ||
| Jaimec |
And based on last year, almost ANY bike could qualify for DSB, with the rules constantly changing DURING the season. Thank God MotoGP and World Superbikes have stops in the States or we wouldn't get to see Professional Racing at all anymore. | ||
| Blake |
"with the rules constantly changing DURING the season." Baloney. Making up lies to push your personal opinion is poor form. The rules in DSB remained constant save for some very minor parts homologations and weight limit adjustments. | ||
| Blake |
Sorry, didn't mean to inject fact into the fantasy bashing being waged here. | ||
| Benm2 |
I don't think that anyone with a shot of winning superbike cares what the purse is. Its never really been large, has it? The top teams & riders have to get their racing money from other sources. Considering that the playing field is purposely more level in Daytona Superbike, it seems more the home of the talented privateer anyway. As such, anyone in that position (fast & poor) would like this arrangment better I would think. | ||
| Rocketsprink |
I think the fact is there is no money for racing, so the AMA is trying to salvage something. The DSB fields were huge compared to the SBK fields so I can see them concentrating more on that. I think it's going to be a lean year for ALL forms of racing. | ||
| Liquorwhere |
-------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Anyone care to offer up some facts, like how much did AMA before DMG pay for Superbike and what was then Formula Extreme classes? I know it's just the internet, but it would be nice to see some actual facts interjected among all the DMG bashing. How much do other national series pay? I know, why inject facts into the fray? I'm just goofy that way I guess. Blake, Regardless of what they used to pay, look at the links and article that shows Supersport yielding payouts through tenth place and Daytona Sport Bike yielding payments to twentieth place yet Superbike yields payments only on the rostrum. That should be a very clear indication of what they want to support and what they do not support, they meaning DMG and Roger Edmondson. If that is not a way to weed out privateers that compete in Superbike then what is? Isn't that what you like about the series? Privateers? Anyway, it is what they, DMG, want, kill Superbike racing in the US, and they are getting it. I wonder if Johnny Rock Page will compete in DSB or Supersport instead of Superbike, maybe he can argue with another DMG executive, that will probably be the most entertainment provided by that series all season. | ||
| Eboos |
I've been thinking about this all morning. Here is the only thing that I can think of: DMG is putting more emphasis on a series that will be less expensive to run then the full on Superbikes. Factory support is and was dying long before DMG took over. The bikes need to be cheaper to build and run in order for more supporters to justify the expense of racing while the entire industry is hurting and pulling out of racing. Suzuki, who's profits were down 66% in the last 6 months, how could they continue to spend what they had in the past on racing. They already made major cuts last year, in both pro and club level racing. Other manufactures are doing the same thing. Lack of factory support goes much deeper then the DMG drama. | ||
| Backcountryme |
I can go with your thought there Eboos. Superbike has always been the playground of the factory bikes. But Sportbike was a great success as far as starting grid size and close racing. I guess the thing that gets me is why would DMG announce that they are going to have Moto-GT and a 450 class only to pull it? How about not announcing anything until it is a solid deal. Overall I think DMG did a pretty good job at giving us close entertaining racing last year. There are the people out there that hate DMG no matter what. This is just going to put more fuel on that fire. | ||
| Stormy |
There is another way to look at this. The large Superbike teams do not rely on purse money to fund their operations. For many years factory racers and fans have been complaining about backmarkers getting in the way of the "important" racing. Privateers ran the Superbike class because the purse paid deep into the field, so they would run their superstock or DSB bikes in Superbike to help pay for the weekend (ask Shawn Higbee). Now maybe only racers who want to concentrate on Superbike will race it. As to injecting facts about purses into this argument, look up what the payout was in 600 SuperSport, supposedly the "Privateer" class under the AMA rule. I have many stories about what it was like to run in a Roger Edmondson owned/run series, but it is not possible to blame all the woes brought out by the economy on him causing the money to leave American Pro Racing. Most racing series worldwide are now in the reality of constant increasing cutbacks. | ||
| Stormy |
The purse still pays back as far into the DSB field as it did last year. | ||
| Fast2win |
Richest winning purse at Daytona's Road Racing motorcycle competition February 16th, 2009 There may be decreasing sponsorship dollars in professional motorcycle racing, but one organization is hoping to help by increasing the rewards of winning. AMA Pro Road Racing are promising the 2009 season-opening Daytona 200 by Honda weekend, March 4 - 6, will pay the richest purse in AMA Pro's history at the legendary Daytona International Speedway. A total of $286,000 in posted team support will be on the line for the Daytona weekend, which will feature four AMA Pro Road Racing classes. In addition to the AMA Pro American Superbike opener, Friday's schedule will feature the AMA Pro Daytona SportBike class in the first Daytona 200 by Honda at night and under the lights in the long history of America's premier motorcycle road race. The weekend card also features the AMA Pro SuperSport class and the AMA Pro SunTrust Moto-GT division. The record Daytona payout is part of AMA Pro Road Racing's 2009 team support that has also been increased across the board for the entire season, although AMA Pro confirmed today that the total posted support has been adjusted since it was announced late last year. The 2009 combined total of over $2.1 million in team support is a full 50% greater than 2008's posted awards but has been decreased since the previously announced total. The adjustments were necessary due to the ailing economy, which has prevented AMA Pro and many organizations from realizing their revenue goals for 2009. "We are proud to offer record team support for the Daytona 200 weekend and an overall AMA Pro Road Racing season-long support package that is substantially larger than what was posted in 2008," said AMA Pro Racing President Roger Edmondson. "We obviously were shooting for a greater total, and that will always be our goal, but the current economic situation just wasn't going to let us get there this year. Previously committed sponsorship dollars evaporated in light of the global downturn in the economy." Despite the unforeseen decreases, AMA Pro Road Racing's 2009 team support program compares favorably with purses offered in any other road racing motorcycle series. The 2009 AMA Pro Road Racing contingency program also offers a variety of potential awards and bonuses to competitors in each of the four road racing divisions. Not exactly what we were looking for but less pay after what is claimed to be a record year. After thinking about this a little more, Edmondson I think responded that he wasn't interested in competing with wsbk. How ever this could be a great cultivating field (DSB) for all the privateers that had no chance in AMA. and with a little luck could also fall into ERBs lap. If it's our premier class and ERB offer's competitive bike's out of the box you may just see a lot of more Cory West's coming into AMA.}}} | ||
| Badlionsfan |
IIRC, Cory West was offered Eslicks' ride first and he declined it. But I see your point Fast. | ||
| Trojan |
The rules in DSB remained constant save for some very minor parts homologations and weight limit adjustments. MINOR PARTS HOMOLOGATIONS!!! only on a Buell board would you ever read that regarding the 2009 AMA Season! Regardless of anyones personal thoughts on the merits of Buell racing, DMG made a serious miscalculation by favouring a factory (any factory) so heavily when they made 'minor parts homologation' amendments to allow Buell to compete in DSB and then in Superbike with the 1125RR. No other organiser worldwide would have bent so far backwards to facilitate one manufacturers presence and it has lead to other (bigger) manufacturers pulling the plug on their US racing concerns. This is in no way a criticism of Buell racing, so please don't jump on me with that accusuation again. Buell will of course race to whatever rules they are given and take advantage of any 'loopholes' given to them by an organiser, as would any professional racing team. They took the rules as they were and did very well with the race package they had. Until DMG/AMA apply the rule book without fear or favour equally to all manufacturers then the whole thing is a laughing stock and will continue to plummet in popularity and prestige worldwide. factory/importer teams need a structure that they can follow and above all trust from year to year before they will invest significant amounts of money into long term racing strategies, and if they don't see that in AMA they will undoubtedly look elsewhere to spend their top level racing beudgets. That may be WSB/GP or may be another organiser within the US, or they may just pack it altogether, which is no good for any of us race fans long term. (Message edited by trojan on December 01, 2009) | ||
| Eboos |
Do you mean that Ducati shoving the need for a displacement increase down FIM's throat even while they dominated the season on the 999 doesn't count? | ||
| Trojan |
Do you mean that Ducati shoving the need for a displacement increase down FIM's throat even while they dominated the season on the 999 doesn't count? There is a massive and discernible difference between the FIM and DMG, and that is that decisions made in WSB are made AFTER discussion and general agreement with other teams/manufacturers/competitors and usually set in stone before the season starts. If the FIM had suddenly decided mid season that Ducati could race a larger displacement (or even a technically ineligible bike) then there would have been uproar and it would probably spell the end of WSB as we know it. The rights and wrongs for allowing the 1200 twins rule in WSB was discussed for almost a full year before the rules were implemented. These discussions were open and accessible by manufacturers and teams and all sides had their say before decisions were made. The capacity increase was only allowed with the proviso that other technical provisions should be adhered to, which in effect gave the extra capacity no extra advantage. Can the DMG?AMA say the same? | ||
| Blake |
Matt, What rules changes through the 2009 DSB season occurred that were not typical of any other racing series? What are you talking about? Only on a Buell board? What rules were changed in Daytona SportBike that you find so outrageous? Think facts. What are the facts that lead to you insult and sarcasm asserting that the DSB rules were changed so outrageously during the 2009 season? I'd sure like to know. | ||
| Fast2win |
Trojan Obviously, were a little Buell biased here but I think a Buell 1125RR is no more than a superbike prepped 1125r. While it differs greatly from a 1125r, so do the other top superbike's. From what I can see in the rules of superbike the Buell was allowed to modify their air box and install larger valves. The rules allow valve's to be replaced but not with larger ones. and the air box must remain stock size. These two exceptions shouldn't really be that big a deal, given that the helicon was 1st developed as a street based eng. and not a superbike eng. Buell went to AMA to try to homolagate the parts as the other teams did earlier in the year. Erik just showed up later. Most likely because the parts weren't ready. And they added weight mid year to the 1125 in DSB, which from what I gather from this board was irrelavent because it never hit the min. anyway. | ||
| Backcountryme |
Correct me if I am wrong, but DMG did ask all the manufactures what bikes they wanted to race. When Buell said they wanted to run the 1125r in DSB the other manufactures had no problem with it. That is until it started to win races under Danny. Amazing that Danny was the only one able to run consistently at the front. As for rule changes, Fast2win is right. The only change made during the season was a weight change. Also, don't forget that the Suzuki almost won the championship. There was no runaway victory for the Buell. It is hard to say that DMG bent to rules to have a Buell championship when Suzuki almost won it. | ||
| Liquorwhere |
Correct me if I am wrong, but DMG did ask all the manufactures what bikes they wanted to race. Please provide the link to where you read that, I would love to actually read of this "asking". Thanks. | ||
| Backcountryme |
Not sure if I will be able to provide a link. I am pretty sure that I read it in Road Racer X. I will have to go back through the ones I have at home and see if I can find it. |
