| Author | Message | |||
     Pcmodeler  |
I was thinking to get some vinyl logo's made up by a sign shop. Does anyone have a good black/white logo or know the font used for the Buell logo? | |||
| Midknyte |
I have a font that is verrrry close. PM if I forget to get back to you. It's on another machine. | |||
| Rpmchris |
I'm also interested... | |||
| Midknyte |
Ok, looks like the font is a standard Windows font (not the Buell font, rather, the one I have used that is very close).  Name of font - Impact Bolding it depending on the pitch size makes it better. If you do not have it on your machine, let me know. | |||
| Pcmodeler |
Thanks. | |||
| Steve_mackay  |
Will these work? With the attached PDF, you can convert it to an adobe illustrator, or any other program that can handle postscript. 
| |||
| Henry_the_8th  |
I just did a yahoo search for Buell logo and came up with this. http://buell.qweb.nl/BuellLogo/ Hope it helps. | |||
| Pcmodeler |
Those are perfect. Thanks guys. | |||
| Slaughter  |
Just make sure you don't make any reproduction of those logos (note the little "TM" ) for any puropse without permission. The BRAG manual gives very specific guidelines on allowable usage, sizes and colors. Whether or not you make money, it's still unauthorized reproduction. That being said, I'm not trying to rain on any parade - but the law is pretty clear on using copyrighted images without authorization. I RACE a buell - I looked into it - I can stick on a sticker I got with my BRAG package but cannot MAKE a sticker. Subtle difference but a difference nonetheless. (Message edited by slaughter on January 18, 2005) | |||
| Mikej  |
Does the ruling that allows people to tattoo themselves with brand logos apply to personal use stickers as well? I've got an old van spare tire cover that I'm going to someday paint a "Coke" logo onto to hang in the garage, pretty sure that's okay to do. I'm probably wrong though, so I"ll just keep the garage door closed. | |||
| Pcmodeler |
Well, I would hardly think that Buell would hardly have a problem with me taking my current tank logo off and replacing it with one that I have created. Their other option is for me to take it off and not replace it at all. When people ask me what it is, I'll lie. I'm sorry, but some of these lawyers and licensing issues get out of hand. | |||
| Firebolt020283  |
ok i could see them makeing a hissy fitt if u were selling the stuff but if ur just making one to put on ur bike so that people know what the bike is that is just plain dumb. and if that was the case H-D has alot of people to sue cuz there is alot of people that get harley Davidson airbrushed or put on there motorcycle in other ways then the way it came from the factory and i dont think they have the time or the money to waist to do that not to mention they would loose about 50% of there costomers propbly if they done such things. | |||
| Blake |
If you want a Buell logo, why not purchase it from a reputable licensed source, or simply write HDI or BMC and ask them if they would be okay with your personal use of their trademark? We all think of "Buell" as just the name of our favorite motorcycle(s). It is also some guy's last name. In the form shown above, it comprises his longstanding trademark. Any dilution of the value of his trademark is a dilution of the commercial value of his name. Buell Impact is not quite the right font. Just in case HDI/BMC are okay with your personal use of their trademark, you might want to try haettenschweiler.  | |||
| Slaughter |
This isn't directed at anybody posting above directly - Truthfully HD are probably not going to hire Pinkerton to come out to track a single user. I asked, was told no... the lines are clearly drawn - so I just use a sticker. I'm didn't write the intellectual property laws but do try to honor them as a matter of personal choice. Can I borrow your lawnmower, computer or wife? I ask only because I have determined there are times you're not using them - it will have no impact on you, won't cost you anything - I'll even clean them up when I'm finished. Maybe because a lot of what I do for a living is vulnerable to intellectual property theft - I look at it differently. | |||
| Ingemar |
You wanna borrow my wife and clean her up when your finished? How considerate!  couldn't resist, sorry ... | |||
| Mikej |
I've sometimes wondered if any Intellectual Property Attorneys have any tattoos? The line of "personal use" is gray (or grey). (I'm done. And "maybe, depends, and no, to answer the questions.) | |||
| Slaughter |
Personal use is also application-specific. Software licensing is different than music is different than graphic images is different than motion pictures is different than newspaper/magazines. Newspaper/magazines are different with imbedded images than strictly printed word. EVEN if you sign away rights to your image when racing, your image cannot be used out of context - Rich Oliver is going after the beer company using his face on the bottles. "Yabbut MOMMY - Johnny next door is getting away with it - why can't I???" (how you answer that question is an indication of how you've been raised) | |||
| Mikej |
I lost track of what Johnny next door is doing about 25 years ago, lost track of Jimmy about 15 years ago, didn't care what they were getting away with anyway, different households. Intent and application always play a major part in things. I've got many photographs I've taken with trademarked images and logos in the background, and sometimes in the foreground. Oh well, gotta run. | |||
| Dsergison  |
I wouldn't even think twice. just do it for yourself. what's this world coming to? how absurd. | |||
| Slaughter |
Yeah - actually in an ideal world, we'd have instant access. "From each, according to his ability; to each according to his needs." (Blake I apologize for the quote above - I'll let the audience guess the source. I'm in a bitchy mood today. I can't get to the racebike to clean it up after the weekend and am afraid time is gonna slip away - WAAaaaaa!!) | |||
| Blublak  |
Ok.. Lemmmie see if I get this right.. If I were to say, paint the Buell Pegasus logo on my helmet, for my use only, to show my love, loyalty and pride for my brand of motorcycle, it's a copyright violation (I'm not selling them, just this one time use) however.. If I asked really nice (and maybe came up with more money then the helmet and bike cost together) they might give me permission and therefore I'm OK. However, if I tattoo my body with the same logo, I'm not in violation and won't have the legal eagles from H-D hunt me down and sue to have my shoulder removed from my body since it is the location of the offensive body art. HUH?? I can and do believe in NOT stealing someone else’s hard work and would never want to profit from some others sweat and hard work. So if it were simply a matter of telling the company (Say with a nice letter) my one time usage plans so they know it's not a 'for profit' venture that's cool.. I'll go for it. But, if I write said letter, am I asking for more trouble than it's worth? I am not in the mood to start a legal fight over the decoration of a helmet. Does anyone know if such one time use is permissible? I know it's similar to what's being said above. I also know that if we stick to the letter of the law here, a lot of folks here have to get rid of a lot of their motorcycle stuff, after all, I can think of several people that have 'custom' tank decals. As a matter of fact, since my 'Buell - American Motorcycles' decals aren't the ones for my Firebolt, they are for another bike, from another year. Do I now need to turn my bike over to them for destruction since I've 'altered' the established logo? I don't mean to sound obtuse, or like I'm trying to pick a fight, I'm just trying to get this all figured out before I purchase a new lid, pay a painter to apply my chosen design and then have it found a violation of law and get myself into hot water when I'm attending a Buell/Brag event somewhere. When does it go from reasonable use, to theft of idea etc.,? Later, | |||
| Chainsaw  |
My understanding of the law... If I make a sticker (Buell, Rockies, Broncos whatever) for myself I won't get sued. If I sell that logo I can get my pants sued off, and rightfully so IMHO. Ya'll have seen Calvin of "Calvin and Hobbes" decals pissing on various car logos and the words "La Migre". Every single one of them is a bootleg. Bill Watterson has never licensed his cartoon images for anything. I would be pissed off if I were in his shoes. | |||
| Slaughter |
Blublak, I wondered why it would be an issue - when I asked I was told no. I got kinda pissy and paid $250 to a professional illustrator: http://www.sdlara.com to do my Muell racing logo - I OWN this freaking image - feel free to distribute - just reference SDLara.com  | |||
| Cerbero  |
steve: thanks for the pdf... it works perfectly in illustrator... and i promise i'll only use it for fun, not profit. slaughter: ahhh... intellectual property. a fun little topic. you should check out the "creative commons" movement... it's turning the whole idea of copyright on it's head... in a very positive way! ...c | |||
| Court |
Fact of the matter is that making and plastering Buell stuff all over won't elicit any attention from the fine folks in Michigan. Selling it is more likely too. I would say it depends on how much you sell, but that's not quite the metric. There is an unusual component to IP laws that, to paraphrase, says something like "if you are going to defend it, you have to defend ALL violations. Failing to stop small as well as large violators will compromise your right to exclusive ownership" For more details read some of the old stories where HD brought down the full weight of legal enforcement on Ma and Pa shops selling small quantities. I have a booklet of the "Buell Graphic Representation Standards" somewhere that lists fonts, allowable colors, combinations and places the logo may and may not appear. If I wander on to it, I'll post it. Court | |||
| Seanp |
First of all, Court, what the heck time do you wake up? Holy cow, I get up at 0430, but only because I have 0530 PT every day... On the weekends I sleep in until 0730... Second of all, I can understand why any company wouldn't want any Joe Shmoe making reproductions of their graphics and art. The problem is that there's no quality control once the designing leaves the establishment. Buell, for instance, can control exactly how their official graphics, fonts, etc. look while they're the only ones producing said items. However, there's no way for them to control the quality of outside-produced items. Now, everything I've seen on here has been outstanding, and really good-looking artwork. However, there's probably plenty of guys out there who've painted a Buell logo or Pegasus on their helmet with model paint, or on their bike with house paint, or some other such thing, and done it freehand, so it looks like crap. (Ok, with the size of the Buell population, maybe not. So let's pretend that there are hundreds of thousands of Buell fans out there, for argument's sake.) Now, I applaud those folks' enthusiasm. It's good to see someone get fired up and want to be creative, and to support something that they appreciate. But it comes down to quality control. And yes, I understand that taste is an individual thing. But think about the National Anthem. It's a beautiful and important piece of music. And it's been "redone" many times, by many artists. And it's great to see that some artists feel so strongly about it that they want to add their personal touch to it. But at what point does it stop? Jimi Hendrix's version is great, if you like long guitar riffs. Maybe Roseanne Barr's version is good if you like...well...fat rude women. But I don't think I'd want to hear it done by the barking dogs that sing Jingle Bells. So anyway, I've gotten terribly off track, but what I'm trying to say is that if Buell is the only one who can legally produce their logos, then they can be assured of quality control. I think this is part of why they have these laws. Sean | |||
| Mikej |
"and places the logo may and may not appear" That would be interesting, to know where the logo may not appear. | |||
| Koz5150  |
I can think of many places I would not want to see it. Most of those involve old hairy guys/gals and things that should be covered up anyways  | |||
| Chainsaw |
...if Buell is the only one who can legally produce their logos, then they can be assured of quality control Quality. That's why I created the PDF posted above. So ya'll aren't reproducing crappy copies in the wrong font. | |||
| Slaughter |
The 3-ring binder that every BRAG club gets from Buell has the guidelines in it | |||
| Blublak |
Hmmmm.. Does that mean we're going to have to mug a BRAG chapter for the 'official' info? Or is that simply the restrictions placed on the chapters for their use? Later, | |||
| Slaughter |
Blublak - I'll go look it up - they were pretty specific. If I remember, there were about 4 pages of images. It's the old thing about getting forgiveness or permission. Turns out, we were even using the BRAG logo improperly on our Newsletter. When we first read all that, Tim and I were kinda saying - "awww c'MON! We're doing a BRAG newsletter fer Pete's sake" - but now that we're a legit chapter, we gotta toe the line. |
